4 ms·

The reason I posted this to HN, is because I am curious as to how many people here hack at their own body language, and whether you tend to focus on "improving"

by abl 18y ago

The reason I posted this to HN, is because I am curious as to how many people here hack at their own body language, and whether you tend to focus on "improving" it, or just let it be "natural", whatever that means. And if you are "improving" it, what are your considerations for particular situations? Do you try act as if you are from a lower SES, to try to level yourself with your listener, or the other way around - try to increase the perceived importance of your SES in order to put down your listener?

Alex3917 18y ago
There are some good papers on perceived IQ, and how perceived IQ correlates with actual IQ. It turns out that pIQ is mostly a function of body language, eye contact, rate of speech, and things like that; what comes out of your mouth doesn't actually matter all that much. Some of the factors you are able to fake and boost your pIQ, but most you aren't. So if you are into that it would pay off well to figure out what those are. :-)
- DaniFong 18y ago
  That might be true in the general population, but I'm hoping that at least in the scientist or the hacker population this effect is mitigated...
- yan 18y ago
  Do you by any chance have links to any of those papers? Curious.
  - Alex3917 18y ago
    I lost my JSTOR account, but here is the first one that came up in Google: http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/journal/118832742/abstract?CRETRY=1&SRETRY=0 http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/journal/118832742/abstrac... If you read through that you can probably find more using the citations and keywords they use. There might also be more papers by the same authors. There is another one where they turn around and have people try to fake having higher IQs, but unfortunately I didn't save it.
- wallflower 18y ago
  Social skills can be hacked. Remember unconscious incompetence -> conscious competence. RE: Body Language. Move slow, talk slow, be an approval giver (not a seeker). We all have the capacity to be at the level of Bill Clinton or other legendary communicators - we do it on first dates, job interviews - he does it all the time. One of my most networked/outgoing friends consciously goes into certain situations like 'she owns the venue'. Also if you talk to everyone, you can hide the fact that you are interested in not everyone. You might also try videotaping your body language when you are with friends/familiar situation vs strangers/safe situation. You will have to try this to realize the power of this - but if you really, really want to talk to a group or even a cute female who is seated alone/together, drag a chair over from the other side of the room (noisily if possible) and sit down with them. That demonstrates commitment and is an opener all-in-one. RE: Peer ratings They are a form of social proof (raters do not exist in a bubble). "Similarly, a person who has been unemployed for a long time may have a hard time finding a new job - even if they are highly skilled and qualified. Potential employers attribute wrongly the person's lack of employment to the person rather than the situation. This causes the potential employers to search more intensively for flaws or other negative characteristics that are "congruent" with or explain the person's failure and to discount the applicant's virtues." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_proof http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_proof RE: SES One of the more clever and disturbing ways to gain 'power' over an individual is to play the student in the master-student role. E.g. by having them teach you something - which is doing you a favor, you can gain their favor. Ben Franklin: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=145544 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=145544
  - brandnewlow 18y ago
    re: last point - Sounds like every girl who ever asked me to help her with her homework...
- yan 18y ago
  I love how searching google for "perceived iq" now brings up this comment as the third result.
  - eru 18y ago
    Google loves Hacker News. Does anybody know, why?
Tangurena 18y ago
I never really paid much attention to mine: after all, I'm a nerd, judge me on what I do, not how I look. However, when I ran for office, I found that I needed to - because the vast majority of people judge solely on looks, appearance, and to a much lesser degree, actual message.
kolya3 18y ago
I notice it's hard to get things done in a meeting when your arms are crossed over your chest or abdomen. It's the universal sign of "I disagree with you and I'm on the defensive" Try this: cross your arms, and the person across from you will inevitably do so as well. I find that when they do that, it's much harder to convince them of your point of view. It's almost as if their defensive posture puts their mind into defensive mode. The opposite seems to hold true as well: relax your posture (open arms) and the person will be more receptive.
- semerda 18y ago
  It's called mirroring - a psychology process in building rapport. We all do it when comfortable with a friend / family member. You can use this to your advantage to win people over to your side. Just try not to be too obvious or they might spot you! ;)
  - eru 18y ago
    Never happened to me. And I am über-obvious.
- skmurphy 18y ago
  It's interesting that folding your arms when faced with a difficult problem can make you more persevering. http://www2.canada.com/components/print.aspx?id=fb05abc6-149a-499d-b3b4-e9df6007675a http://www2.canada.com/components/print.aspx?id=fb05abc6-149...
  - khafra 18y ago
    When facing a difficult problem and trying to project confidence, I prefer sitting astride a rearing horse, brandishing a sabre. The body language mirroring and influence thing has a comprehensive theory on using it to your advantage: Neuro-Linguistic Programming. Unfortunately, it has little experimental support, but it's still trendy with the management and life coaches--which doesn't necessarily make it not true; which wouldn't necessarily make it not useful.

by abl 18y ago

Alex3917 18y ago

There are some good papers on perceived IQ, and how perceived IQ correlates with actual IQ. It turns out that pIQ is mostly a function of body language, eye contact, rate of speech, and things like that; what comes out of your mouth doesn't actually matter all that much. Some of the factors you are able to fake and boost your pIQ, but most you aren't. So if you are into that it would pay off well to figure out what those are. :-)

DaniFong 18y ago
That might be true in the general population, but I'm hoping that at least in the scientist or the hacker population this effect is mitigated...
yan 18y ago
Do you by any chance have links to any of those papers? Curious.
- Alex3917 18y ago
  I lost my JSTOR account, but here is the first one that came up in Google: http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/journal/118832742/abstract?CRETRY=1&SRETRY=0 http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/journal/118832742/abstrac... If you read through that you can probably find more using the citations and keywords they use. There might also be more papers by the same authors. There is another one where they turn around and have people try to fake having higher IQs, but unfortunately I didn't save it.
wallflower 18y ago
Social skills can be hacked. Remember unconscious incompetence -> conscious competence. RE: Body Language. Move slow, talk slow, be an approval giver (not a seeker). We all have the capacity to be at the level of Bill Clinton or other legendary communicators - we do it on first dates, job interviews - he does it all the time. One of my most networked/outgoing friends consciously goes into certain situations like 'she owns the venue'. Also if you talk to everyone, you can hide the fact that you are interested in not everyone. You might also try videotaping your body language when you are with friends/familiar situation vs strangers/safe situation. You will have to try this to realize the power of this - but if you really, really want to talk to a group or even a cute female who is seated alone/together, drag a chair over from the other side of the room (noisily if possible) and sit down with them. That demonstrates commitment and is an opener all-in-one. RE: Peer ratings They are a form of social proof (raters do not exist in a bubble). "Similarly, a person who has been unemployed for a long time may have a hard time finding a new job - even if they are highly skilled and qualified. Potential employers attribute wrongly the person's lack of employment to the person rather than the situation. This causes the potential employers to search more intensively for flaws or other negative characteristics that are "congruent" with or explain the person's failure and to discount the applicant's virtues." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_proof http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_proof RE: SES One of the more clever and disturbing ways to gain 'power' over an individual is to play the student in the master-student role. E.g. by having them teach you something - which is doing you a favor, you can gain their favor. Ben Franklin: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=145544 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=145544
- brandnewlow 18y ago
  re: last point - Sounds like every girl who ever asked me to help her with her homework...
yan 18y ago
I love how searching google for "perceived iq" now brings up this comment as the third result.
- eru 18y ago
  Google loves Hacker News. Does anybody know, why?

Tangurena 18y ago

I never really paid much attention to mine: after all, I'm a nerd, judge me on what I do, not how I look. However, when I ran for office, I found that I needed to - because the vast majority of people judge solely on looks, appearance, and to a much lesser degree, actual message.

kolya3 18y ago

I notice it's hard to get things done in a meeting when your arms are crossed over your chest or abdomen. It's the universal sign of "I disagree with you and I'm on the defensive" Try this: cross your arms, and the person across from you will inevitably do so as well. I find that when they do that, it's much harder to convince them of your point of view. It's almost as if their defensive posture puts their mind into defensive mode. The opposite seems to hold true as well: relax your posture (open arms) and the person will be more receptive.

semerda 18y ago
It's called mirroring - a psychology process in building rapport. We all do it when comfortable with a friend / family member. You can use this to your advantage to win people over to your side. Just try not to be too obvious or they might spot you! ;)
- eru 18y ago
  Never happened to me. And I am über-obvious.
skmurphy 18y ago
It's interesting that folding your arms when faced with a difficult problem can make you more persevering. http://www2.canada.com/components/print.aspx?id=fb05abc6-149a-499d-b3b4-e9df6007675a http://www2.canada.com/components/print.aspx?id=fb05abc6-149...
- khafra 18y ago
  When facing a difficult problem and trying to project confidence, I prefer sitting astride a rearing horse, brandishing a sabre. The body language mirroring and influence thing has a comprehensive theory on using it to your advantage: Neuro-Linguistic Programming. Unfortunately, it has little experimental support, but it's still trendy with the management and life coaches--which doesn't necessarily make it not true; which wouldn't necessarily make it not useful.