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> I'm sure I can name a few militaries [...] Well, when are you planning to name them? If Israel is so evil, it must be very easy to name a few militaries that

> I'm sure I can name a few militaries [...] Well, when are you planning to name them? If Israel is so evil, it must be very easy to name a few militaries that are much better at fighting terrorists, who dress as civilians and hide among them, without much collateral damage. > actually manage to successfully prosecute There are countries that never let off suspected criminals due to insufficient evidence? Also if we're just bringing up random stories to paint one side in a bad light, what happened to the Gazans who paraded their rape victims around the streets? They didn't seem at all worried about being arrested. > if we continue sanctioning Israel as much as we can that will help Sanctions can't convince a nuclear state to ignore the attacks against it and give up on its own defense. If we want Israel to stop fighting messy wars, the focus should be on its neighbors who keep attacking it.

gambiting 6mo ago
Is there a reason why you cut off the second part of that first sentence when you quoted it? Or was it again because you wanted to argue against a point in your head instead of the one I actually made? Because I'm sure even you can name militaries that generally don't shoot at ambulances, or if they do the people responsible tend to go on trial and be prosecuted. >>There are countries that never let off suspected criminals due to insufficient evidence? Funny how Israel always finds insufficient evidence against all of its soldiers.But maybe that just doesn't bother you. >>what happened to the Gazans who paraded their rape victims around the streets? Oh wait, it's Gazans now? not Hamas? Or are they one and the same for you? >>Sanctions can't convince a nuclear state to ignore the attacks against it and give up on its own defense Of course they can't, and no one advocates anything of that sort. We do want Israel to stop killing Palestinian civialians in the numbers that they do. We want food and medical supplies to be restored. No one says Israel shouldn't defend itself - but this has crossed the line of defence long time ago. Maybe it hasn't for you, but that's your morality that you have to live with. >> the focus should be on its neighbors who keep attacking it. You do realize that both of these things can happen, right. We should be criticizing Israel for how it's leading this war, and we should focus on it's neighbours to stop the terrorists inside them. Do you feel Israel is being unfairly treated in this case?
- dlubarov 6mo ago
  It seems like you're unable to name any military that broadly deals with terrorists in a cleaner manner, so you've resorted to cherry picking specific alleged incidents that are more specific to Israel. This is like saying that the US is the most evil country, because it's the only one that bombed the girls' school in Minab. Or Ukraine is the most evil country, because they're the only ones accused of who executed Russian POWs (in recent memory). > Oh wait, it's Gazans now? not Hamas? Or are they one and the same for you? I'm sure you know that Hamas fighters were not the only ones committing atrocities on Oct 7. The Gazans who were parading their rape victims didn't hold signs saying "I'm with Hamas", "I'm with PIJ", "I'm just a random Gazan", etc. Why should we make assumptions about their affiliation? > We do want Israel to stop killing Palestinian civialians in the numbers that they do. If you can't name any real-world military capable of dealing with terrorists disguised as civilians with less collateral damage, than just blaming Israel for the collateral damage is rather unproductive. > You do realize that both of these things can happen, right. That's a nice sentiment, but in reality those who are ostensibly pro-Palestinian are way more focused on trying to harm Israel than on actually helping Palestinians. Where were the protests for getting Hamas to put on uniforms? For getting other countries to accept war refugees? For pressuring Hamas to step down, ceding power to a government that will stop starting wars? There were none.
  - linehedonist 6mo ago
    Israeli civilian death ratios are actually terrible, worse than Bosnia, Syria, or even WWII (including the Holocaust!). I assume it’s because Israel wants to kill as many civilians as possible, while still claiming the faintest hope of plausible deniability. https://aoav.org.uk/2026/why-israeli-claims-of-low-civilian-to-combatant-harm-in-gaza-do-not-hold-up/ https://aoav.org.uk/2026/why-israeli-claims-of-low-civilian-...
    - dlubarov 6mo ago
      Frost is using quite a long chain of creative assumptions to claim that fighting age male casualties (almost half of all casualties) were mostly civilian. His conclusions are contracted by Hamas' own admissions. Earlier in the war they acknowledged losing 6,000 fighters, when the claimed total was ~29k. If we believe Hamas, and conservatively assume that everyone other than Hamas fighters were civilians, that's still a CCR around 3.85:1. If we believe Israel it's around 1.5:1. > worse than Bosnia, Syria, or even WWII As I said elsewhere in the thread, CCR comparisons need to be apples-to-apples. Gaza is tiny, civilians have nowhere to evacuate to (no state accepted significant numbers of war refugees), and Hamas disguises as civilians. Your examples are not comparable.

gambiting 6mo ago

Is there a reason why you cut off the second part of that first sentence when you quoted it? Or was it again because you wanted to argue against a point in your head instead of the one I actually made? Because I'm sure even you can name militaries that generally don't shoot at ambulances, or if they do the people responsible tend to go on trial and be prosecuted. >>There are countries that never let off suspected criminals due to insufficient evidence? Funny how Israel always finds insufficient evidence against all of its soldiers.But maybe that just doesn't bother you. >>what happened to the Gazans who paraded their rape victims around the streets? Oh wait, it's Gazans now? not Hamas? Or are they one and the same for you? >>Sanctions can't convince a nuclear state to ignore the attacks against it and give up on its own defense Of course they can't, and no one advocates anything of that sort. We do want Israel to stop killing Palestinian civialians in the numbers that they do. We want food and medical supplies to be restored. No one says Israel shouldn't defend itself - but this has crossed the line of defence long time ago. Maybe it hasn't for you, but that's your morality that you have to live with. >> the focus should be on its neighbors who keep attacking it. You do realize that both of these things can happen, right. We should be criticizing Israel for how it's leading this war, and we should focus on it's neighbours to stop the terrorists inside them. Do you feel Israel is being unfairly treated in this case?

dlubarov 6mo ago
It seems like you're unable to name any military that broadly deals with terrorists in a cleaner manner, so you've resorted to cherry picking specific alleged incidents that are more specific to Israel. This is like saying that the US is the most evil country, because it's the only one that bombed the girls' school in Minab. Or Ukraine is the most evil country, because they're the only ones accused of who executed Russian POWs (in recent memory). > Oh wait, it's Gazans now? not Hamas? Or are they one and the same for you? I'm sure you know that Hamas fighters were not the only ones committing atrocities on Oct 7. The Gazans who were parading their rape victims didn't hold signs saying "I'm with Hamas", "I'm with PIJ", "I'm just a random Gazan", etc. Why should we make assumptions about their affiliation? > We do want Israel to stop killing Palestinian civialians in the numbers that they do. If you can't name any real-world military capable of dealing with terrorists disguised as civilians with less collateral damage, than just blaming Israel for the collateral damage is rather unproductive. > You do realize that both of these things can happen, right. That's a nice sentiment, but in reality those who are ostensibly pro-Palestinian are way more focused on trying to harm Israel than on actually helping Palestinians. Where were the protests for getting Hamas to put on uniforms? For getting other countries to accept war refugees? For pressuring Hamas to step down, ceding power to a government that will stop starting wars? There were none.
- linehedonist 6mo ago
  Israeli civilian death ratios are actually terrible, worse than Bosnia, Syria, or even WWII (including the Holocaust!). I assume it’s because Israel wants to kill as many civilians as possible, while still claiming the faintest hope of plausible deniability. https://aoav.org.uk/2026/why-israeli-claims-of-low-civilian-to-combatant-harm-in-gaza-do-not-hold-up/ https://aoav.org.uk/2026/why-israeli-claims-of-low-civilian-...
  - dlubarov 6mo ago
    Frost is using quite a long chain of creative assumptions to claim that fighting age male casualties (almost half of all casualties) were mostly civilian. His conclusions are contracted by Hamas' own admissions. Earlier in the war they acknowledged losing 6,000 fighters, when the claimed total was ~29k. If we believe Hamas, and conservatively assume that everyone other than Hamas fighters were civilians, that's still a CCR around 3.85:1. If we believe Israel it's around 1.5:1. > worse than Bosnia, Syria, or even WWII As I said elsewhere in the thread, CCR comparisons need to be apples-to-apples. Gaza is tiny, civilians have nowhere to evacuate to (no state accepted significant numbers of war refugees), and Hamas disguises as civilians. Your examples are not comparable.