6 ms·

You don't on new projects. CMake + ninja has support for modules on gcc, clang, and MSVC. This should be your default stack on any small-to-medium sized C++ pr

by jjmarr 7mo ago

You don't on new projects. CMake + ninja has support for modules on gcc, clang, and MSVC. This should be your default stack on any small-to-medium sized C++ project. Bazel, the default pick for very large codebases, also has support for C++20 modules.

VerifiedReports 7mo ago
Thanks. It's been a long time since I started a C++ project, and I've never set up any build chain in Visual Studio or Xcode other than the default.
sgt 7mo ago
How about using Zig to build C++ projects?
- jjmarr 7mo ago
  I haven't used it. That being said, while it looks better than CMake, for anything professional I need remote execution support to deviate from the industry standard. Zig doesn't have that. This is because large C++ projects reach a point where they cannot be compiled locally if they use the full language. e.g. Multi-hour Chromium builds.
  - sgt 7mo ago
    Surely Zig can also be invoked using any CI/CD flow running on a remote machine too.
    - jjmarr 7mo ago
      I'm referring to this: https://github.com/bazelbuild/remote-apis https://github.com/bazelbuild/remote-apis Once you get a very large C++ project with several thousand compilation jobs over hundreds of devs, you need to distribute the build across multiple computers and have a shared cache for object files. Zig doesn't seem to support that.
duped 7mo ago
I have yet to see modules in the wild. What I have seen extensively are header-only projects.
- jjmarr 7mo ago
  You're not supposed to distribute the precompiled module file. You are supposed to distribute the source code of the module. Header-only projects are the best to convert to modules because you can put the implementation of a module in a "private module fragment" in that same file and make it invisible to users. That prevents the compile-time bloat many header-only dependencies add. It also avoids distributing a `.cpp` file that has to be compiled and linked separately, which is why so many projects are header-only.
  - duped 7mo ago
    What I mean is, I have yet to see projects in the wild _use modules at all_.
    - pjmlp 7mo ago
      Plenty of examples on Github, Microsoft has talks on how Office has migrated to modules, and the Vulkan updated tutorials from Khronos, have an optional learning path with modules.
- FrostKiwi 7mo ago
  It's the fault of built systems. CMake still doesn't support `import std` officially and undocumented things are done in the ecosystem [1] But once it works and you setup the new stuff, having started a new CPP26 Project with modules now, it's kinda awesome. I'm certainly never going back. The big compilers are also retroactively adding `import std` to CPP20, so support is widening. [1] https://gitlab.kitware.com/cmake/cmake/-/work_items/27706 https://gitlab.kitware.com/cmake/cmake/-/work_items/27706
  - duped 7mo ago
    weird to blame build systems for a problem caused by the language
deleted 7mo ago
[deleted]

by jjmarr 7mo ago

VerifiedReports 7mo ago

Thanks. It's been a long time since I started a C++ project, and I've never set up any build chain in Visual Studio or Xcode other than the default.

sgt 7mo ago

How about using Zig to build C++ projects?

jjmarr 7mo ago
I haven't used it. That being said, while it looks better than CMake, for anything professional I need remote execution support to deviate from the industry standard. Zig doesn't have that. This is because large C++ projects reach a point where they cannot be compiled locally if they use the full language. e.g. Multi-hour Chromium builds.
- sgt 7mo ago
  Surely Zig can also be invoked using any CI/CD flow running on a remote machine too.
  - jjmarr 7mo ago
    I'm referring to this: https://github.com/bazelbuild/remote-apis https://github.com/bazelbuild/remote-apis Once you get a very large C++ project with several thousand compilation jobs over hundreds of devs, you need to distribute the build across multiple computers and have a shared cache for object files. Zig doesn't seem to support that.

duped 7mo ago

I have yet to see modules in the wild. What I have seen extensively are header-only projects.

jjmarr 7mo ago
You're not supposed to distribute the precompiled module file. You are supposed to distribute the source code of the module. Header-only projects are the best to convert to modules because you can put the implementation of a module in a "private module fragment" in that same file and make it invisible to users. That prevents the compile-time bloat many header-only dependencies add. It also avoids distributing a `.cpp` file that has to be compiled and linked separately, which is why so many projects are header-only.
- duped 7mo ago
  What I mean is, I have yet to see projects in the wild _use modules at all_.
  - pjmlp 7mo ago
    Plenty of examples on Github, Microsoft has talks on how Office has migrated to modules, and the Vulkan updated tutorials from Khronos, have an optional learning path with modules.
FrostKiwi 7mo ago
It's the fault of built systems. CMake still doesn't support `import std` officially and undocumented things are done in the ecosystem [1] But once it works and you setup the new stuff, having started a new CPP26 Project with modules now, it's kinda awesome. I'm certainly never going back. The big compilers are also retroactively adding `import std` to CPP20, so support is widening. [1] https://gitlab.kitware.com/cmake/cmake/-/work_items/27706 https://gitlab.kitware.com/cmake/cmake/-/work_items/27706
- duped 7mo ago
  weird to blame build systems for a problem caused by the language

deleted 7mo ago

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