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> incredible amounts of ... energy So tired of seeing this trope. Data center energy expenditure is like less than 1% of worldwide energy expenditure[1]. Have

by dvt 7mo ago

> incredible amounts of ... energy So tired of seeing this trope. Data center energy expenditure is like less than 1% of worldwide energy expenditure[1]. Have you heard of mining? Or agriculture? Or cars/airplanes/ships? It's just factually wrong and alarmist to spread the fake news that AI has any measurable effect on climate change. [1] https://www.iea.org/reports/energy-and-ai/energy-supply-for-ai https://www.iea.org/reports/energy-and-ai/energy-supply-for-...

vrganj 7mo ago
It's not just the absolute expenditure. It's the type of expenditure. https://www.selc.org/news/resistance-against-elon-musks-xai-facility-in-south-memphis-gets-stronger/ https://www.selc.org/news/resistance-against-elon-musks-xai-...
- dvt 7mo ago
  [flagged]
  - runarberg 7mo ago
    Interesting that you accuse your parent of political posturing at the end of your post, which indeed contains plenty political posturing.
  - triceratops 7mo ago
    Those links are about air pollution, not carbon emissions. You're engaging in some political posturing of your own.
    - dvt 7mo ago
      Why are you lying? From literally the first paragraph of the CFR article: > China is the world’s largest source of carbon emissions, and the air quality of many of its major cities fails to meet international health standards.
      - triceratops 7mo ago
        But the focus of the article is on China's air quality. As for carbon emissions: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45108292 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45108292 And even though China emits more carbon annually than the US today, the US and Europe are still ahead in cumulative emissions: https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-co2-emissions-region https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-co2-emissions-.... Cumulative emissions are the carbon that's already in our atmosphere and causing heating today. If you want to apportion "blame" for climate change, then the US is 25% responsible, Europe is 30% responsible, and China is 14% responsible as of 2023. And India is only 3.6% responsible. China's high emissions today power a manufacturing industry that has made cheap decarbonization via solar and batteries a realistic prospect. That's a much better use of their current emissions compared to what the developed countries do with theirs.
      - defrost 7mo ago
        China has a large population and does the dirty work of manufacturing for much of the rest of the entire world. China has done more for renewable energy solutions than any other country, and their per capita population consumption patterns for personal are lower than many G20 countries. In a fair representation of data, the total high carbon dioxide output from China should be assigned to source- the people across the globe with high personal consumption that have off shored their industry to China.
runarberg 7mo ago
1% of worldwide energy expenditure is massive, incredible amounts of energy in fact.
wrqvrwvq 7mo ago
climate change is a hoax, but it's also disingenuous to pretend like ai delivers even an infinitesimal amount of the value of either agriculture or mining. Global population approaches zero without either of those things and if you deleted ai, no one would ever notice.

by dvt 7mo ago

vrganj 7mo ago

It's not just the absolute expenditure. It's the type of expenditure. https://www.selc.org/news/resistance-against-elon-musks-xai-facility-in-south-memphis-gets-stronger/ https://www.selc.org/news/resistance-against-elon-musks-xai-...

dvt 7mo ago
[flagged]
- runarberg 7mo ago
  Interesting that you accuse your parent of political posturing at the end of your post, which indeed contains plenty political posturing.
- triceratops 7mo ago
  Those links are about air pollution, not carbon emissions. You're engaging in some political posturing of your own.
  - dvt 7mo ago
    Why are you lying? From literally the first paragraph of the CFR article: > China is the world’s largest source of carbon emissions, and the air quality of many of its major cities fails to meet international health standards.
    - triceratops 7mo ago
      But the focus of the article is on China's air quality. As for carbon emissions: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45108292 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45108292 And even though China emits more carbon annually than the US today, the US and Europe are still ahead in cumulative emissions: https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-co2-emissions-region https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-co2-emissions-.... Cumulative emissions are the carbon that's already in our atmosphere and causing heating today. If you want to apportion "blame" for climate change, then the US is 25% responsible, Europe is 30% responsible, and China is 14% responsible as of 2023. And India is only 3.6% responsible. China's high emissions today power a manufacturing industry that has made cheap decarbonization via solar and batteries a realistic prospect. That's a much better use of their current emissions compared to what the developed countries do with theirs.
    - defrost 7mo ago
      China has a large population and does the dirty work of manufacturing for much of the rest of the entire world. China has done more for renewable energy solutions than any other country, and their per capita population consumption patterns for personal are lower than many G20 countries. In a fair representation of data, the total high carbon dioxide output from China should be assigned to source- the people across the globe with high personal consumption that have off shored their industry to China.

runarberg 7mo ago

1% of worldwide energy expenditure is massive, incredible amounts of energy in fact.

wrqvrwvq 7mo ago

climate change is a hoax, but it's also disingenuous to pretend like ai delivers even an infinitesimal amount of the value of either agriculture or mining. Global population approaches zero without either of those things and if you deleted ai, no one would ever notice.