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Exactly. I want to have a computer with stable vendor supported OS so _I can do my stuff_ not tweak some os level configs. I _don’t_ want to spend my time pla

by fsloth 7mo ago

Exactly. I want to have a computer with stable vendor supported OS so _I can do my stuff_ not tweak some os level configs. I _don’t_ want to spend my time playing an os systems programmer. OS is a _component_. Like the wifi driver. I think it’s great some people love developing wifi drivers but personally I just want network that-just-works because there are billion other cool things you can do with a computer. Similarly I want an OS that just works! Without asking me to do a anything! Because _i don’t really care_. (I mean i care it works but i expect the engineers actually developing an os offering to have a far better idea than myself what is a good stable default config for the system)

nine_k 7mo ago
> I want an OS that just works! This is exactly why modern Windows is problematic. MacOS is better. A right Linux distro (e.g. Fedora Silverblue) on right hardware (e.g. Thinkpad T series) also just works™; this basically the same kind of limitation as with MacOS. I wish they issued a Windows Rock Stable edition. Ancient as rocks (Win7 look, or maybe even WinXP look), every known bug fixed, every feature either supported fully, or explicitly not supported. No new features added. Security updates issued regularly. It could be highly popular.
- andybak 7mo ago
  MacOS has the drawback today any software compiled more than x years no longer works. That is an unforgivable sin in my eyes.
  - raw_anon_1111 7mo ago
    Yes Apple should have kept supporting 68K software and have emulators for 68K, PPC and 32 bit x86.
    - ZeWaka 7mo ago
      false equivalence much?
      - raw_anon_1111 7mo ago
        So exactly how far should Apple go back?
        andybak 6mo ago
        On Windows I occasionally still run useful software compiled before 2000.
  - fsloth 7mo ago
    IMHO - disagree but it depends on point of view so this is not ”you are wrong” but ”in my view it’s not like that”. I think it’s the role of the software vendor to offer a package for a modern platform. Not the role of OS vendor to support infinite legacy tail. I don’t personally ever need generational program binary compatibility. What I generally want is data compatibility. I don’t want to operate on my data with decades old packages. My point of view is either you innovate or offer backward compatibility. I much prefer forward thinking innovation with clear data migration path rather than having binary compatibility. If I want 100% reproducible computing I think viable options are open source or super stable vendors - and in the latter case one can license the latest build. Or using Windows which mostly _does_ support backward binaries and I agree it is not a useless feature.
    - Arainach 7mo ago
      Software shouldn't rot. If you ignore the cancer of everything as a subscription service, algorithms don't need to be tweaked every 6 months. A tool for accounting or image editing or viewing text files or organizing notes can be written well once and doesn't need to change. Most software that was ever written was done so by companies that no longer exist, or by people (not working for a software company) no longer associated with those company they wrote the tool for. In many of these cases the source is not available, so there is no way to recompile it or update it for a new platform, but the tool works as good as ever. Binary backcompat is incredibly important.
      - fsloth 7mo ago
        I didn't say backcompat isn't important. There are lots of other ways to run old binaries than at your main OS level. There are tons of other platforms that precede the current ones. I would not like the requirements from those platforms to hamper the current gen os. I do think it's valuable to be able to run the programs from those platforms.
- b473a 7mo ago
  Mac works great out of the box. Linux can do whatever you want if you put some work into it. Windows sits kind of in the middle, and it turns out for a lot of people that's a comfortable spot even with its trade-offs.
  - fsloth 7mo ago
    Agree - there are variations to how much tweaking Windows needs. Enterprise Windows config that comes eg in Thinkpads is more ready out of the box than the consumer OEM configss.
- GTP 7mo ago
  They would still need to develop new drivers for new hardware, which could cause issues. But yes, the situation you describe would be much more stable than Win11.
deleted 7mo ago
[deleted]

by fsloth 7mo ago

nine_k 7mo ago

> I want an OS that just works! This is exactly why modern Windows is problematic. MacOS is better. A right Linux distro (e.g. Fedora Silverblue) on right hardware (e.g. Thinkpad T series) also just works™; this basically the same kind of limitation as with MacOS. I wish they issued a Windows Rock Stable edition. Ancient as rocks (Win7 look, or maybe even WinXP look), every known bug fixed, every feature either supported fully, or explicitly not supported. No new features added. Security updates issued regularly. It could be highly popular.

andybak 7mo ago
MacOS has the drawback today any software compiled more than x years no longer works. That is an unforgivable sin in my eyes.
- raw_anon_1111 7mo ago
  Yes Apple should have kept supporting 68K software and have emulators for 68K, PPC and 32 bit x86.
  - ZeWaka 7mo ago
    false equivalence much?
    - raw_anon_1111 7mo ago
      So exactly how far should Apple go back?
      - andybak 6mo ago
        On Windows I occasionally still run useful software compiled before 2000.
- fsloth 7mo ago
  IMHO - disagree but it depends on point of view so this is not ”you are wrong” but ”in my view it’s not like that”. I think it’s the role of the software vendor to offer a package for a modern platform. Not the role of OS vendor to support infinite legacy tail. I don’t personally ever need generational program binary compatibility. What I generally want is data compatibility. I don’t want to operate on my data with decades old packages. My point of view is either you innovate or offer backward compatibility. I much prefer forward thinking innovation with clear data migration path rather than having binary compatibility. If I want 100% reproducible computing I think viable options are open source or super stable vendors - and in the latter case one can license the latest build. Or using Windows which mostly _does_ support backward binaries and I agree it is not a useless feature.
  - Arainach 7mo ago
    Software shouldn't rot. If you ignore the cancer of everything as a subscription service, algorithms don't need to be tweaked every 6 months. A tool for accounting or image editing or viewing text files or organizing notes can be written well once and doesn't need to change. Most software that was ever written was done so by companies that no longer exist, or by people (not working for a software company) no longer associated with those company they wrote the tool for. In many of these cases the source is not available, so there is no way to recompile it or update it for a new platform, but the tool works as good as ever. Binary backcompat is incredibly important.
    - fsloth 7mo ago
      I didn't say backcompat isn't important. There are lots of other ways to run old binaries than at your main OS level. There are tons of other platforms that precede the current ones. I would not like the requirements from those platforms to hamper the current gen os. I do think it's valuable to be able to run the programs from those platforms.
b473a 7mo ago
Mac works great out of the box. Linux can do whatever you want if you put some work into it. Windows sits kind of in the middle, and it turns out for a lot of people that's a comfortable spot even with its trade-offs.
- fsloth 7mo ago
  Agree - there are variations to how much tweaking Windows needs. Enterprise Windows config that comes eg in Thinkpads is more ready out of the box than the consumer OEM configss.
GTP 7mo ago
They would still need to develop new drivers for new hardware, which could cause issues. But yes, the situation you describe would be much more stable than Win11.

deleted 7mo ago

[deleted]