3 ms·

Doesn't PyPy already have a jit compiler? Why aren't we using that?

olivia-banks 7mo ago
As far as I know, PyPy doesn't support all CPython extensions, so pure Python code will probably (very likely) run fine but for other things most bets are off. I believe PyPy also only supports up to 3.11?
JoshTriplett 7mo ago
Because PyPy seems to be defunct. It hasn't updated for quite a while. See https://github.com/numpy/numpy/issues/30416 https://github.com/numpy/numpy/issues/30416 for example. It's not being updated for compatibility with new versions of Python.
- LtWorf 7mo ago
  [flagged]
  - Waterluvian 7mo ago
    It supports at best Python 3.11 code, right? So it’s not unmaintained, no. But the project is currently under resourced to keep up with the latest Python spec.
    - LtWorf 7mo ago
      That is not the same thing at all, and not what he said.
      - JoshTriplett 7mo ago
        It is exactly what I'm referring to. I didn't say there aren't still people around. But they're far enough behind CPython that folks like NumPy are dropping support. Unless they get a substantial injection of new people and new energy, they're likely to continue falling behind.
        bigstrat2003 7mo ago
        > I didn't say there aren't still people around. You said it was defunct, which would mean there aren't still people working on it.
        LtWorf 7mo ago
        Not what you wrote. Also CPython 3.10 is not EOL so library authors won't be using anything from 3.11 anyway.
        JoshTriplett 7mo ago
        [flagged]
        LtWorf 7mo ago
        [flagged]
        tomhow 7mo ago
        You've both been here long enough to know that this kind of sniping should be avoided here.
        tomhow 7mo ago
        You've both been here long enough to know that this kind of sniping should be avoided here.
- mkl 7mo ago
  PyPy's devs disagree: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47293415 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47293415
contravariant 7mo ago
Why shouldn't the reference implementation get JIT? Just because some other implementations already have it is no reason not to. That'd be like skipping list comprehensions because they already exist in CPython.
3laspa 7mo ago
Because the same people who made a big deal about supporting PyPy and PEP 399 when it was fashionable to do so are now told by their corporations that PyPy does not matter. CPython only moves with what is currently fashionable, employer mandated and profitable.
cpburns2009 7mo ago
PyPy is limited to maintenance mode due to a lack of funding/contributors. In the past, I think a few contributors or funding is what helped push "minor" PyPy versions. It's too bad PyPy couldn't take the federal funding the PSF threw away.
- philipallstar 7mo ago
  > It's too bad PyPy couldn't take the federal funding the PSF threw away. The PSF is primarily a political advocacy organisation, so it wouldn't make sense for them to use the money for Python.
hrmtst93837 7mo ago
[flagged]

As far as I know, PyPy doesn't support all CPython extensions, so pure Python code will probably (very likely) run fine but for other things most bets are off. I believe PyPy also only supports up to 3.11?

JoshTriplett 7mo ago

Because PyPy seems to be defunct. It hasn't updated for quite a while. See https://github.com/numpy/numpy/issues/30416 https://github.com/numpy/numpy/issues/30416 for example. It's not being updated for compatibility with new versions of Python.

LtWorf 7mo ago
[flagged]
- Waterluvian 7mo ago
  It supports at best Python 3.11 code, right? So it’s not unmaintained, no. But the project is currently under resourced to keep up with the latest Python spec.
  - LtWorf 7mo ago
    That is not the same thing at all, and not what he said.
    - JoshTriplett 7mo ago
      It is exactly what I'm referring to. I didn't say there aren't still people around. But they're far enough behind CPython that folks like NumPy are dropping support. Unless they get a substantial injection of new people and new energy, they're likely to continue falling behind.
      - bigstrat2003 7mo ago
        > I didn't say there aren't still people around. You said it was defunct, which would mean there aren't still people working on it.
      - LtWorf 7mo ago
        Not what you wrote. Also CPython 3.10 is not EOL so library authors won't be using anything from 3.11 anyway.
        JoshTriplett 7mo ago
        [flagged]
        LtWorf 7mo ago
        [flagged]
        tomhow 7mo ago
        You've both been here long enough to know that this kind of sniping should be avoided here.
        tomhow 7mo ago
        You've both been here long enough to know that this kind of sniping should be avoided here.
mkl 7mo ago
PyPy's devs disagree: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47293415 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47293415

contravariant 7mo ago

Why shouldn't the reference implementation get JIT? Just because some other implementations already have it is no reason not to. That'd be like skipping list comprehensions because they already exist in CPython.

3laspa 7mo ago

Because the same people who made a big deal about supporting PyPy and PEP 399 when it was fashionable to do so are now told by their corporations that PyPy does not matter. CPython only moves with what is currently fashionable, employer mandated and profitable.

cpburns2009 7mo ago

PyPy is limited to maintenance mode due to a lack of funding/contributors. In the past, I think a few contributors or funding is what helped push "minor" PyPy versions. It's too bad PyPy couldn't take the federal funding the PSF threw away.

philipallstar 7mo ago
> It's too bad PyPy couldn't take the federal funding the PSF threw away. The PSF is primarily a political advocacy organisation, so it wouldn't make sense for them to use the money for Python.

hrmtst93837 7mo ago

[flagged]