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Imagine thinking that you're brothers with someone based solely on what religion you both supposedly believe.

JasonADrury 8mo ago
In a sense it's a rather positive way of thinking, no? Surely having a shared set of beliefs is a pretty good starting point. I'm certainly not religious, but it feels rather cynical to make fun of this.
- asadm 8mo ago
  correct.
- lenerdenator 8mo ago
  It's not cynical if centuries of history show that it doesn't work to effectively moderate bad human and societal behavior.
  - JasonADrury 8mo ago
    You can be cynical about Islam without being cynical about this particular principle.
    - lenerdenator 8mo ago
      I'm not being cynical about Islam. The principle is the thing that I'm being cynical about. We look for these shortcuts all the time because we're meant to interact with much smaller groups of people than we do on a societal scale now. For most of human history the average person was born, lived, and died within the same community of maybe a couple hundred people at most. This thing where the average person lives in metro areas of millions and can do business with people on a completely different continent is really new and we're trying to find methods for figuring out who is and isn't trustworthy. Most fail, and you can throw "in group vs out group" in the failure pile. Any sort of shortcut to "this person is an ally and/or worthy of my trust" based primarily on race, religion, nationality, etc. is a very good way to set yourself up for exploitation. You see it all the time. Televangelists scam money out of people's pockets by the same mechanism. A "good Christian" man is asking for your donation after giving you the Almighty's blessings. You also see it in criminal organizations that tend to group themselves by ethnicity like the American La Cosa Nostra, where you have to be full-blooded Italian to be a made man. The people considering your induction into the further depths of the criminal organization won't let you join if you're not full-blooded Italian, because that's the "in group", but the "out group" of everyone else is less likely to kill you in that lifestyle than the members of the "in group".
asadm 8mo ago
Imagine walking into a random neighborhood, finding a stranger and one "Salam" later, you are like brothers; willing to die for them. Oh yeah, it's a superpower in-practice actually. Alhamdulilah!
- lenerdenator 8mo ago
  I wouldn't want that. You know nothing about the guy other than what he says he believes. Which, of course, could be massively different from what he actually believes, and who's to say any of his beliefs result in actions of a good person.
  - asadm 8mo ago
    someone BS'ing about what he believes in, is VERY easy to spot from a mile away.
tradertef 8mo ago
Quran 49:10

In a sense it's a rather positive way of thinking, no? Surely having a shared set of beliefs is a pretty good starting point. I'm certainly not religious, but it feels rather cynical to make fun of this.

asadm 8mo ago
correct.
lenerdenator 8mo ago
It's not cynical if centuries of history show that it doesn't work to effectively moderate bad human and societal behavior.
- JasonADrury 8mo ago
  You can be cynical about Islam without being cynical about this particular principle.
  - lenerdenator 8mo ago
    I'm not being cynical about Islam. The principle is the thing that I'm being cynical about. We look for these shortcuts all the time because we're meant to interact with much smaller groups of people than we do on a societal scale now. For most of human history the average person was born, lived, and died within the same community of maybe a couple hundred people at most. This thing where the average person lives in metro areas of millions and can do business with people on a completely different continent is really new and we're trying to find methods for figuring out who is and isn't trustworthy. Most fail, and you can throw "in group vs out group" in the failure pile. Any sort of shortcut to "this person is an ally and/or worthy of my trust" based primarily on race, religion, nationality, etc. is a very good way to set yourself up for exploitation. You see it all the time. Televangelists scam money out of people's pockets by the same mechanism. A "good Christian" man is asking for your donation after giving you the Almighty's blessings. You also see it in criminal organizations that tend to group themselves by ethnicity like the American La Cosa Nostra, where you have to be full-blooded Italian to be a made man. The people considering your induction into the further depths of the criminal organization won't let you join if you're not full-blooded Italian, because that's the "in group", but the "out group" of everyone else is less likely to kill you in that lifestyle than the members of the "in group".

asadm 8mo ago

Imagine walking into a random neighborhood, finding a stranger and one "Salam" later, you are like brothers; willing to die for them. Oh yeah, it's a superpower in-practice actually. Alhamdulilah!

lenerdenator 8mo ago
I wouldn't want that. You know nothing about the guy other than what he says he believes. Which, of course, could be massively different from what he actually believes, and who's to say any of his beliefs result in actions of a good person.
- asadm 8mo ago
  someone BS'ing about what he believes in, is VERY easy to spot from a mile away.

tradertef 8mo ago

Quran 49:10