4 ms·

Maybe triple. (1) paid higher prices, (2) the government will issue debt to refund the tariffs to importers who we already reimbursed through higher prices, and

by sowbug 7mo ago

Maybe triple. (1) paid higher prices, (2) the government will issue debt to refund the tariffs to importers who we already reimbursed through higher prices, and then (3) Congress will use the extra debt from the refunds as justification for higher individual taxes to pay for the 2025 tax cuts for businesses.

NewJazz 7mo ago
And the supreme court is to blame for all of this because they decided to invalidate lower court injunctions, reasoning that there was no chance for "irreparable harm"... Yeah, right.
- light_hue_1 7mo ago
  No. The people are to blame. Both the people who voted for the criminal to be president. And the people who supported such a horrible Democratic candidate that she couldn't even win against Trump.
  - NewJazz 7mo ago
    1. Nobody supported Kamala as the democratic nominee. 2. The US senate is horribly malapportioned and gates scotus nominations.
    - simonh 7mo ago
      Well, the Democrat apparatchiks that supported her. And the person, and his henchmen and enablers, that implemented these tariffs in the first place. Plenty of blame to go around, but to be fair there's a significant difference between ordering or enabling this debacle and ineffectively opposing it.
  - mft_ 7mo ago
    If you really want to get to the root cause, on the Democratic side it’s the people who promoted/supported/covered up for Biden when it would have been obvious to anyone close that he wasn’t fit for the purpose any more. And Biden himself, for his hubris. That was why things were rushed and there wasn’t a proper primary. Yes, they could have held a very late/quick convention and would likely not have picked Kamala, but anyone getting the nomination at that late stage would still have been hugely in the back foot.
    - nkrisc 7mo ago
      It’s the electoral college. It needs to be abolished.
      - thechao 7mo ago
        Restricted representative size, gerrymandering, FPTP voting, businesses with resident/citizen rights, the restriction of 42 U.S.C. 1983 to not cover Federal actors...
    - tremon 7mo ago
      There is no single root cause in a complex system of checks and balances. Many parts need to fail for things to get as bad as they are now. Trying to reduce everything to a single fault is either stupid populism or blatant propaganda.
      - NewJazz 7mo ago
        IMHO the highest court, which is tasked with delivering timely justice, ought to make their decisions in a reasonable amount of time, and not allow legally questionable executive actions to continue while the legal question is unanswered. You may consider that populist, but my opinion is that SCOTUS has derelicted their constitutional duty in these trying times.
        tremon 7mo ago
        I agree, but derelicition of duty by SCOTUS during this regime does not explain why a 34-times convicted felon and insurrectionist was even allowed to run for office again. Nor does it explain why the entire Senate keeps rolling over for every wet fart coming from the office of the Pedophile Of The United States. You can find many other valid issues with the US system listed in this thread. Most of them are valid criticisms, and many of them identify a different underlying cause. Pointing them out or even focusing on a single one is not necessarily populist -- but insisting that there is a singular root cause is.
    - sgc 7mo ago
  - Mc_Big_G 7mo ago
    So everyone are to blame except the exceedingly small number of people who supported third party candidates that had no chance?
    - komali2 7mo ago
      Yes, because that's several million people, and the elected democrat officials count in the hundreds. It's actually tens of millions, if you count eligible voters that didn't vote. Not to mention the tens of millions of voters for the other Party. People don't lose elections, campaigns do. And when they do, out of a refusal to accept responsibility, they cast blame outwards. They try to get people to blame each other, rather than the frankly quite obvious people at fault.
  - watwut 7mo ago
    And as always, all acts of republicans and conservatives are fault of the democrats. The only people who are innocent are the people who have huge power in their hands and literally made decisions that caused this.
  - braincat31415 7mo ago
    Depends which people. The question is why people voted for Trump en masse.
    - watwut 7mo ago
      People who voted for Trump were pretty clear about what their issues were. They wanted to bully trans and they wanted to stick it to the libs. They were looking forward to liberals suffering. Some of them would never vote for a woman or black person. They liked masculinity Trump projects - aggressive insulting fraudster. There is no mystery about that.
      - braincat31415 7mo ago
        That's exactly the kind of simplistic thinking that I was talking about. People had legitimate concerns about cost of living, food inflation (look at the charts of food prices 2020-2024), ballooning national debt, military adventures, crime, fraud, expensive housing and rent. I could go on. Trump's government is unlikely to offer any solutions to the above, but that's a different story. Voting because they wanted libs to suffer... sheesh. Most people are not that dumb and have objective reasons to vote a certain way. Any party that wants to stay in power longer will have to address these issues. Do you really think an average family is more concerned about trans issues than their inability to afford a house?
        watwut 7mo ago
        Frankly, that is just lying to yourself. None of that favored Trump. National debt, military adventures, crime, fraud - all of those are consistently better under democratic administrations. They are consistently worst under republican administrations. Trump himself committed crimes and it was very clear he will be more corrupt then anyone before him. Trump himself talked like someone who will be aggressive ... and here we are with Venezuela, Iran clusterfuck. > expensive housing and rent People who genuinely cared about those did not voted for Trump. However, some used these as excuse. > Voting because they wanted libs to suffer... sheesh. Yes. I say so because I was actually listening to what conservatives said and did. Yes, if you do not read what they actually say, there was a lot of sane-washing going on. But, you have to ignore what Trump voters were actually saying in conservative places. > Most people are not that dumb and have objective reasons to vote a certain way. Their priorities are not what you say they are. It is simple as that. > Any party that wants to stay in power longer will have to address these issues. Do you really think an average family is more concerned about trans issues than their inability to afford a house? Frankly, yes, MANY conservative people were radicalized by that prospect. That is why Trump team made created culture war about it prior election and why they do it now too.
  - 0xedd 7mo ago
    [dead]
tim-tday 7mo ago
That’s the American way

by sowbug 7mo ago

NewJazz 7mo ago

And the supreme court is to blame for all of this because they decided to invalidate lower court injunctions, reasoning that there was no chance for "irreparable harm"... Yeah, right.

light_hue_1 7mo ago
No. The people are to blame. Both the people who voted for the criminal to be president. And the people who supported such a horrible Democratic candidate that she couldn't even win against Trump.
- NewJazz 7mo ago
  1. Nobody supported Kamala as the democratic nominee. 2. The US senate is horribly malapportioned and gates scotus nominations.
  - simonh 7mo ago
    Well, the Democrat apparatchiks that supported her. And the person, and his henchmen and enablers, that implemented these tariffs in the first place. Plenty of blame to go around, but to be fair there's a significant difference between ordering or enabling this debacle and ineffectively opposing it.
- mft_ 7mo ago
  If you really want to get to the root cause, on the Democratic side it’s the people who promoted/supported/covered up for Biden when it would have been obvious to anyone close that he wasn’t fit for the purpose any more. And Biden himself, for his hubris. That was why things were rushed and there wasn’t a proper primary. Yes, they could have held a very late/quick convention and would likely not have picked Kamala, but anyone getting the nomination at that late stage would still have been hugely in the back foot.
  - nkrisc 7mo ago
    It’s the electoral college. It needs to be abolished.
    - thechao 7mo ago
      Restricted representative size, gerrymandering, FPTP voting, businesses with resident/citizen rights, the restriction of 42 U.S.C. 1983 to not cover Federal actors...
  - tremon 7mo ago
    There is no single root cause in a complex system of checks and balances. Many parts need to fail for things to get as bad as they are now. Trying to reduce everything to a single fault is either stupid populism or blatant propaganda.
    - NewJazz 7mo ago
      IMHO the highest court, which is tasked with delivering timely justice, ought to make their decisions in a reasonable amount of time, and not allow legally questionable executive actions to continue while the legal question is unanswered. You may consider that populist, but my opinion is that SCOTUS has derelicted their constitutional duty in these trying times.
      - tremon 7mo ago
        I agree, but derelicition of duty by SCOTUS during this regime does not explain why a 34-times convicted felon and insurrectionist was even allowed to run for office again. Nor does it explain why the entire Senate keeps rolling over for every wet fart coming from the office of the Pedophile Of The United States. You can find many other valid issues with the US system listed in this thread. Most of them are valid criticisms, and many of them identify a different underlying cause. Pointing them out or even focusing on a single one is not necessarily populist -- but insisting that there is a singular root cause is.
  - sgc 7mo ago
- Mc_Big_G 7mo ago
  So everyone are to blame except the exceedingly small number of people who supported third party candidates that had no chance?
  - komali2 7mo ago
    Yes, because that's several million people, and the elected democrat officials count in the hundreds. It's actually tens of millions, if you count eligible voters that didn't vote. Not to mention the tens of millions of voters for the other Party. People don't lose elections, campaigns do. And when they do, out of a refusal to accept responsibility, they cast blame outwards. They try to get people to blame each other, rather than the frankly quite obvious people at fault.
- watwut 7mo ago
  And as always, all acts of republicans and conservatives are fault of the democrats. The only people who are innocent are the people who have huge power in their hands and literally made decisions that caused this.
- braincat31415 7mo ago
  Depends which people. The question is why people voted for Trump en masse.
  - watwut 7mo ago
    People who voted for Trump were pretty clear about what their issues were. They wanted to bully trans and they wanted to stick it to the libs. They were looking forward to liberals suffering. Some of them would never vote for a woman or black person. They liked masculinity Trump projects - aggressive insulting fraudster. There is no mystery about that.
    - braincat31415 7mo ago
      That's exactly the kind of simplistic thinking that I was talking about. People had legitimate concerns about cost of living, food inflation (look at the charts of food prices 2020-2024), ballooning national debt, military adventures, crime, fraud, expensive housing and rent. I could go on. Trump's government is unlikely to offer any solutions to the above, but that's a different story. Voting because they wanted libs to suffer... sheesh. Most people are not that dumb and have objective reasons to vote a certain way. Any party that wants to stay in power longer will have to address these issues. Do you really think an average family is more concerned about trans issues than their inability to afford a house?
      - watwut 7mo ago
        Frankly, that is just lying to yourself. None of that favored Trump. National debt, military adventures, crime, fraud - all of those are consistently better under democratic administrations. They are consistently worst under republican administrations. Trump himself committed crimes and it was very clear he will be more corrupt then anyone before him. Trump himself talked like someone who will be aggressive ... and here we are with Venezuela, Iran clusterfuck. > expensive housing and rent People who genuinely cared about those did not voted for Trump. However, some used these as excuse. > Voting because they wanted libs to suffer... sheesh. Yes. I say so because I was actually listening to what conservatives said and did. Yes, if you do not read what they actually say, there was a lot of sane-washing going on. But, you have to ignore what Trump voters were actually saying in conservative places. > Most people are not that dumb and have objective reasons to vote a certain way. Their priorities are not what you say they are. It is simple as that. > Any party that wants to stay in power longer will have to address these issues. Do you really think an average family is more concerned about trans issues than their inability to afford a house? Frankly, yes, MANY conservative people were radicalized by that prospect. That is why Trump team made created culture war about it prior election and why they do it now too.
- 0xedd 7mo ago
  [dead]

tim-tday 7mo ago

That’s the American way