4 ms·

Astronomical tariffs in some cases, trade wars and dramas, alienate all allies and from all of this they got only $130B ? Maybe that was never the point. You p

Astronomical tariffs in some cases, trade wars and dramas, alienate all allies and from all of this they got only $130B ? Maybe that was never the point. You present it as retaliation against 'countries that are out to get us'. Introduce the tariffs, companies pay the tariffs by increasing prices for consumers, get the inevitable loss in court, return the tariff money to the companies. You just transferred $130B of wealth from citizens to companies. Bonus: people are now used to the higher prices, so post-tariffs your profits are also higher.

MattDamonSpace 8mo ago
The whole point is “$130B is chump change for the problems caused” and that’s true if companies as well
- functionmouse 8mo ago
  Companies will make far more than 130b off this. There's no way they only raised prices just enough to cover the 130b and the labor required for the internal policy changes. This was a justification for price gouging. Which they will not stop doing.
  - hunterpayne 8mo ago
    Agreed, this is the real take away most people will be left with. Not only did we all pay higher prices, instead of using that money to pay off the debt we give it away to business managers who were never out that money in the first place. Politically, that doesn't accomplish what some think it does. Midterms are coming up in 8 months...and the results of the house are going to be drastic no matter which side wins. Either Trump can do what he wants or the government will be deadlocked and nothing will happen for 2 years. Neither seem like good outcomes.
    - lotsofpulp 8mo ago
      > Either Trump can do what he wants or the government will be deadlocked and nothing will happen for 2 years. That isn’t drastic, that is already how it is.
hollywood_court 8mo ago
Sounds like the opposite of trickle down economics.
- I-M-S 8mo ago
  Trickle down economists were right, they just got the direction wrong
WesleyJohnson 8mo ago
I had the same thought. Even if it wasn't the original intent, it sure is a preferable outcome.
0cf8612b2e1e 8mo ago
It was also used to frame why the new tax cuts were justified, even though the optimistic math never worked out either.
- jijijijij 8mo ago
  Don't forget blatant insider trading every time new tariffs were announced. It's really a win-win-win situation for the US oligarchy.
foxyv 8mo ago
They also put out of business a bunch of upstart businesses that could threaten their oligopoly. In addition they acquired huge tracts of agricultural land for cheap from all the farms that went bankrupt.
bluegatty 8mo ago
No, they are not that smart. Even if the tariffs are not a lot, they are potent negotiating leverage. They def knew they were lying about much they were collecting They def knew they were lying about who is paying They lied to the public about that and got a bit of extra creme in the bag but the effect was mostly leverage, which 'kind of worked'. They could have very effectively used illegal tariffs to actually do 90-deals-in-90 days, knowing the case would take time to draw out. But - they have no plan. Trump does not think 9 months ahead - he has grudges, grievances, and he pursues whatever grievance he wants to that day. He doesn't forget and will push his staff to go against old enemies The point is not to improve the economy, bring back jobs - the point is to 'Look Tough' and 'Stick it to the Libs and Foreigners' and to get elected again, failing that, rig the elections (note, his secret signed Executive order with all sorts of things regarding elections) The 'high visibility' of ICE is not a bad thing for him - it very much in purpose to show MAGA base that he's cracking liberal, immigrant and brown people heads. Jamming those Somalis on the concrete is exactly the optics he wants for his base. It was only until people started dying when newsmax/fox started questioning the legitimacy and some support is lost - and not even that much among the base. Same thing with tariffs: he will play grievance, the 'Liberal Courts' are against, him blah blah and MAGA will be fine with it. The problem is that Core MAGA is maybe really only 20% and Soft MAGA another 15% and that's not enough to win. But it's almost. Narrative, performance, grievance, populism, social media, information sphere - that's it. It's Post-Truth. People keep talking about these through the lens of the 'issues', it's completely wrong headed - policies don't matter, only perception etc. Reality does have a way of sneaking through though, and 'hardball reality' can change minds. People do understand Epstein, tariffs when they pay attention, unemployment, prices, 'war mostly bad' etc. etc.. This is White House Reality TV, not really policy and that's the best way to understand it. The entire Cabinet have completely been unable to explain the tariff policy - they keep changing their views there is no consistency - it's the same with the war in Iran - everyone's saying different things, objectives are unclear. It's irrational too think that there is 'policy' here, this is whim, impulse, populism.
- kgwxd 8mo ago
  You really think Trump is orchestrating any of this? He reads the script he's given.
omgJustTest 8mo ago
i've said this is better than tax breaks.

MattDamonSpace 8mo ago

The whole point is “$130B is chump change for the problems caused” and that’s true if companies as well

functionmouse 8mo ago
Companies will make far more than 130b off this. There's no way they only raised prices just enough to cover the 130b and the labor required for the internal policy changes. This was a justification for price gouging. Which they will not stop doing.
- hunterpayne 8mo ago
  Agreed, this is the real take away most people will be left with. Not only did we all pay higher prices, instead of using that money to pay off the debt we give it away to business managers who were never out that money in the first place. Politically, that doesn't accomplish what some think it does. Midterms are coming up in 8 months...and the results of the house are going to be drastic no matter which side wins. Either Trump can do what he wants or the government will be deadlocked and nothing will happen for 2 years. Neither seem like good outcomes.
  - lotsofpulp 8mo ago
    > Either Trump can do what he wants or the government will be deadlocked and nothing will happen for 2 years. That isn’t drastic, that is already how it is.

hollywood_court 8mo ago

Sounds like the opposite of trickle down economics.

I-M-S 8mo ago
Trickle down economists were right, they just got the direction wrong

WesleyJohnson 8mo ago

I had the same thought. Even if it wasn't the original intent, it sure is a preferable outcome.

0cf8612b2e1e 8mo ago

It was also used to frame why the new tax cuts were justified, even though the optimistic math never worked out either.

jijijijij 8mo ago
Don't forget blatant insider trading every time new tariffs were announced. It's really a win-win-win situation for the US oligarchy.

foxyv 8mo ago

They also put out of business a bunch of upstart businesses that could threaten their oligopoly. In addition they acquired huge tracts of agricultural land for cheap from all the farms that went bankrupt.

bluegatty 8mo ago

No, they are not that smart. Even if the tariffs are not a lot, they are potent negotiating leverage. They def knew they were lying about much they were collecting They def knew they were lying about who is paying They lied to the public about that and got a bit of extra creme in the bag but the effect was mostly leverage, which 'kind of worked'. They could have very effectively used illegal tariffs to actually do 90-deals-in-90 days, knowing the case would take time to draw out. But - they have no plan. Trump does not think 9 months ahead - he has grudges, grievances, and he pursues whatever grievance he wants to that day. He doesn't forget and will push his staff to go against old enemies The point is not to improve the economy, bring back jobs - the point is to 'Look Tough' and 'Stick it to the Libs and Foreigners' and to get elected again, failing that, rig the elections (note, his secret signed Executive order with all sorts of things regarding elections) The 'high visibility' of ICE is not a bad thing for him - it very much in purpose to show MAGA base that he's cracking liberal, immigrant and brown people heads. Jamming those Somalis on the concrete is exactly the optics he wants for his base. It was only until people started dying when newsmax/fox started questioning the legitimacy and some support is lost - and not even that much among the base. Same thing with tariffs: he will play grievance, the 'Liberal Courts' are against, him blah blah and MAGA will be fine with it. The problem is that Core MAGA is maybe really only 20% and Soft MAGA another 15% and that's not enough to win. But it's almost. Narrative, performance, grievance, populism, social media, information sphere - that's it. It's Post-Truth. People keep talking about these through the lens of the 'issues', it's completely wrong headed - policies don't matter, only perception etc. Reality does have a way of sneaking through though, and 'hardball reality' can change minds. People do understand Epstein, tariffs when they pay attention, unemployment, prices, 'war mostly bad' etc. etc.. This is White House Reality TV, not really policy and that's the best way to understand it. The entire Cabinet have completely been unable to explain the tariff policy - they keep changing their views there is no consistency - it's the same with the war in Iran - everyone's saying different things, objectives are unclear. It's irrational too think that there is 'policy' here, this is whim, impulse, populism.

kgwxd 8mo ago
You really think Trump is orchestrating any of this? He reads the script he's given.

omgJustTest 8mo ago

i've said this is better than tax breaks.