4 ms·

At least it has been decades since China Gov bombed innocent people in other countries. A peaceful and responsible government.

by neves 7mo ago

petcat 7mo ago
> A peaceful and responsible government. People in Hong Kong died. Over 10,000 were arrested and many are still in prison. The rest are permanently disgraced in their social-credit society. Again, USA is not perfect, but let's not dream up some fantasy about the CCP.
- cyberax 7mo ago
  This "social credit" thing is dead in China.
  - petcat 7mo ago
    As an American, I have no fear of calling the US President a pedo or saying Fuck the Police on my Twitter. Not the case in China. It's horrifying. https://reclaimthenet.org/china-man-chair-interrogation-social-credit https://reclaimthenet.org/china-man-chair-interrogation-soci...
    - cyberax 7mo ago
      Oh, China absolutely does not tolerate _public_ dissent very much including highly visible social media posts. Everybody there knows that. But this: > According to the social credit system, Chinese citizens are punishable if they indulge in buying too many video games, buying too much junk food, having a friend online who has a low credit score, visiting unauthorized websites, posting “fake news” online, and more. ...is just pure bullshit. There were _ideas_ about including these kinds of stuff into the score, but they have never been implemented. At this point, the social credit score is only used to find people who dodge court decisions.
      - fc417fc802 7mo ago
        "At this point" being the key phrase.
        kelipso 7mo ago
        A key phrase that can be used to speculate about whatever bs one can think of.
        fc417fc802 7mo ago
        A low effort and bad faith rebuttal on your part. Please ignore the gun pointed at your head / social credit score / masked goons roving about Minnesota / flock cameras / etc as it hasn't been used against you at this point.
        phatfish 7mo ago
        It seems to me your argument is in bad faith because (taking the parents analysis at face value) you created a straw man "social credit score" that doesn't exist. But there ARE masked goons roving Minnesota.
        fc417fc802 7mo ago
        I did no such thing - you are the one creating a straw man. The comment chain I responded to has several different parties making various claims about the social credit score. My comments are consistent with those I responded to. If you wish to dispute the veracity of one or more comments in the thread, by all means do so. But please make a substantive argument and (given the nature of the topic) cite sources.
    - Barrin92 7mo ago
      > I have no fear of calling the US President a pedo or saying Fuck the Police on my Twitter. Does that matter? In China people don't judge the state of their civilization by how easily you can insult the police but whether you need to be afraid to meet them on the street. "I can insult my pedophile president" (who doesn't care if you do) isn't exactly a flex. It does tell us something though that the evaluation of American life now consists of parasocial interactions with the president on social media. I'm starting to belief Bruno Maçães, ex Portuguese secretary of state, was prescient with his diagnosis that American material society has rotted to the point where life is now entirely defined by virtual interactions. That's the difference between China and the US today. The president's a pedophile, a criminal, undeterred by democracy, economy or social disorder but you can freely yell into the void. Have you considered that in the US one can freely say all these things precisely because that's irrelevant?
      - petcat 7mo ago
        > The president's a pedophile, a criminal, undeterred by democracy, economy or social disorder but you can freely yell into the void. Have you considered that in the US one can freely say all these things precisely because that's irrelevant? Americans will vote for their Congress representatives in November. They will have a chance to decide how they want their government to be run. The US President was already shot-down once by the Supreme Court (tariffs). The system is working. Let the voters decide, and then let it work.
        vintermann 7mo ago
        > They will have a chance to decide how they want their government to be run. That depends on what's on the ballot. > The system is working. If it is, how did you end up here again?
- throw5t432 7mo ago
  > People in Hong Kong died Do you have a legit source for this? When I search for information, I only found this case, “Luo Changqing, a 70-year-old Hong Kong cleaner, died from head injuries sustained after he was hit by a brick thrown by a Hong Kong protester during a violent confrontation between two groups in Sheung Shui, Hong Kong on 13 November 2019.” None of the other legit sources claim the police killed any of the rioters.
  - MarsIronPI 7mo ago
    Sure, sure. The CCP probably has gotten a lot better since Tienanmen Square.
WarmWash 7mo ago
What's ironic is that China is desperately trying to be that country, but the US has then in a geographic/geopolitical choke hold.
strangegecko 7mo ago
Constant military drills around Taiwan isn't peaceful or responsible. China is bullying lots of countries in the SCS (ramming Philippine coast guard ships, building military installations in the SCS, ...). Not peaceful or responsible.
- throw5t432 7mo ago
  > building military installations in the SCS Many countries in the SCS are doing this. In fact China was late to the game, as Vietnam did it much earlier.
- maxglute 7mo ago
  AKA defending itself against separatists and sovereignty intrusions from much less powerful aggressors with unreasonable amount of restraint. One would argue overly peaceful, and irresponsible to the point of detrimental peace disease. BTW PRC settled most border disputes in recorded history with most concessions, majority over 50%, that objectively makes PRC the most peaceful rising power in recent history. Even in SCS PRC was second last to militarize, the other disputees started land reclamations and militarization first (apart from Brunei), aka a fucked around and find out situation. Even then all PRC did was build a bigger island, instead of glassing theirs, PRC coast guard last to weaponize as well.
- phatfish 7mo ago
  If China was serious about a military solution for Taiwan they would be invading right now while the US is unloading into the desert.
  - MarsIronPI 7mo ago
    The US would get out of the desert and to Taiwan fast if that happened.

At least it has been decades since China Gov bombed innocent people in other countries. A peaceful and responsible government.

by neves 7mo ago

At least it has been decades since China Gov bombed innocent people in other countries. A peaceful and responsible government.

petcat 7mo ago

> A peaceful and responsible government. People in Hong Kong died. Over 10,000 were arrested and many are still in prison. The rest are permanently disgraced in their social-credit society. Again, USA is not perfect, but let's not dream up some fantasy about the CCP.

cyberax 7mo ago
This "social credit" thing is dead in China.
- petcat 7mo ago
  As an American, I have no fear of calling the US President a pedo or saying Fuck the Police on my Twitter. Not the case in China. It's horrifying. https://reclaimthenet.org/china-man-chair-interrogation-social-credit https://reclaimthenet.org/china-man-chair-interrogation-soci...
  - cyberax 7mo ago
    Oh, China absolutely does not tolerate _public_ dissent very much including highly visible social media posts. Everybody there knows that. But this: > According to the social credit system, Chinese citizens are punishable if they indulge in buying too many video games, buying too much junk food, having a friend online who has a low credit score, visiting unauthorized websites, posting “fake news” online, and more. ...is just pure bullshit. There were _ideas_ about including these kinds of stuff into the score, but they have never been implemented. At this point, the social credit score is only used to find people who dodge court decisions.
    - fc417fc802 7mo ago
      "At this point" being the key phrase.
      - kelipso 7mo ago
        A key phrase that can be used to speculate about whatever bs one can think of.
        fc417fc802 7mo ago
        A low effort and bad faith rebuttal on your part. Please ignore the gun pointed at your head / social credit score / masked goons roving about Minnesota / flock cameras / etc as it hasn't been used against you at this point.
        phatfish 7mo ago
        It seems to me your argument is in bad faith because (taking the parents analysis at face value) you created a straw man "social credit score" that doesn't exist. But there ARE masked goons roving Minnesota.
        fc417fc802 7mo ago
        I did no such thing - you are the one creating a straw man. The comment chain I responded to has several different parties making various claims about the social credit score. My comments are consistent with those I responded to. If you wish to dispute the veracity of one or more comments in the thread, by all means do so. But please make a substantive argument and (given the nature of the topic) cite sources.
  - Barrin92 7mo ago
    > I have no fear of calling the US President a pedo or saying Fuck the Police on my Twitter. Does that matter? In China people don't judge the state of their civilization by how easily you can insult the police but whether you need to be afraid to meet them on the street. "I can insult my pedophile president" (who doesn't care if you do) isn't exactly a flex. It does tell us something though that the evaluation of American life now consists of parasocial interactions with the president on social media. I'm starting to belief Bruno Maçães, ex Portuguese secretary of state, was prescient with his diagnosis that American material society has rotted to the point where life is now entirely defined by virtual interactions. That's the difference between China and the US today. The president's a pedophile, a criminal, undeterred by democracy, economy or social disorder but you can freely yell into the void. Have you considered that in the US one can freely say all these things precisely because that's irrelevant?
    - petcat 7mo ago
      > The president's a pedophile, a criminal, undeterred by democracy, economy or social disorder but you can freely yell into the void. Have you considered that in the US one can freely say all these things precisely because that's irrelevant? Americans will vote for their Congress representatives in November. They will have a chance to decide how they want their government to be run. The US President was already shot-down once by the Supreme Court (tariffs). The system is working. Let the voters decide, and then let it work.
      - vintermann 7mo ago
        > They will have a chance to decide how they want their government to be run. That depends on what's on the ballot. > The system is working. If it is, how did you end up here again?
throw5t432 7mo ago
> People in Hong Kong died Do you have a legit source for this? When I search for information, I only found this case, “Luo Changqing, a 70-year-old Hong Kong cleaner, died from head injuries sustained after he was hit by a brick thrown by a Hong Kong protester during a violent confrontation between two groups in Sheung Shui, Hong Kong on 13 November 2019.” None of the other legit sources claim the police killed any of the rioters.
- MarsIronPI 7mo ago
  Sure, sure. The CCP probably has gotten a lot better since Tienanmen Square.

WarmWash 7mo ago

What's ironic is that China is desperately trying to be that country, but the US has then in a geographic/geopolitical choke hold.

strangegecko 7mo ago

Constant military drills around Taiwan isn't peaceful or responsible. China is bullying lots of countries in the SCS (ramming Philippine coast guard ships, building military installations in the SCS, ...). Not peaceful or responsible.

throw5t432 7mo ago
> building military installations in the SCS Many countries in the SCS are doing this. In fact China was late to the game, as Vietnam did it much earlier.
maxglute 7mo ago
AKA defending itself against separatists and sovereignty intrusions from much less powerful aggressors with unreasonable amount of restraint. One would argue overly peaceful, and irresponsible to the point of detrimental peace disease. BTW PRC settled most border disputes in recorded history with most concessions, majority over 50%, that objectively makes PRC the most peaceful rising power in recent history. Even in SCS PRC was second last to militarize, the other disputees started land reclamations and militarization first (apart from Brunei), aka a fucked around and find out situation. Even then all PRC did was build a bigger island, instead of glassing theirs, PRC coast guard last to weaponize as well.
phatfish 7mo ago
If China was serious about a military solution for Taiwan they would be invading right now while the US is unloading into the desert.
- MarsIronPI 7mo ago
  The US would get out of the desert and to Taiwan fast if that happened.