4 ms·

> And I remember vividly because we had the board elections. I was running for the board. He was running for the board. We had six people elected. And then tied

> And I remember vividly because we had the board elections. I was running for the board. He was running for the board. We had six people elected. And then tied in seventh place were Eric Raymond and I. And he suggested a shootout. I mean playfully, suggested a gun duel because that’s his thing and you said how about pies instead and then Greg said no we’ll just have another round of elections and then I won (Guido laughs) and then in the first years of the PSF we were talking a lot about, I don’t know where to get income and how to get companies to support Python and that kind of thing. And obviously the IRS status and what we should do. And I remember at one point I made a analogy with gun laws or gun regulation or something. And you sent a reply saying, I’m so glad that you won instead of Eric Raymond. WHEW they literally dodged a bullet there!

gschizas 8mo ago
What's the story with Eric Raymond?
- wraptile 8mo ago
  If I understand correctly it's just a reflection on different governing styles where Eric Raymond was a bit louder (pro gun libertarian) while Guido's strategy was more consensus-orentied and pragmatic which turned out be the winning one. PSF got IRS non-profit status etc and became incredibly successful. Maybe someone else can fill in more but there's nothing particularly dramatic here that I could find other than Eric has become more political in culture wars era. Also see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric_S._Raymond#Political_beliefs_and_activism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric_S._Raymond#Political_beli...
  - DonHopkins 8mo ago
    Guido is not racist like ESR is, and it would have been a disaster to have somebody as racist and obsessed with dragging the organizations he leads into the pro-racism side of political culture war battles that have absolutely nothing to do with their mission, as ESR has a track record of trying to do: He threw down the gauntlet and attempted to drag OSI into supporting Russ Nelson after his infamous "Blacks are Lazy" blog posting that caused him to resign for the good of OSI, who ESR wanted to spend their resources and reputation fighting his culture war against (dog whistle alert:) "thugs" who don't want to follow a racist leader. That kind of blatant racism and totally non-python-related racist culture warfare bullshit political battles would have been extremely detrimental to the python community, just as his other antics and his and Russel's racist rants were detrimental to the open source community. OSI has enough problems attracting women and minorities that they don't need white male leaders telling black people they're lazy and accusing people who disagree of being "fools and thugs". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russ_Nelson https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russ_Nelson "Blacks are lazy" -Russ Nelson https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Russ_Nelson#Blacks_are_lazy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Russ_Nelson#Blacks_are_la... New OSI President Steps Down https://www.eweek.com/servers/new-osi-president-steps-down/#sthash.EJtgGdxJ.dpuf https://www.eweek.com/servers/new-osi-president-steps-down/#... >“The people who knew Russ as a Quaker, a pacifist and a gentleman, and no racist, but nevertheless pressured OSI to do the responsible thing and fire him in order to avoid political damage should be equally ashamed,” Raymond said. “Abetting somebody elses witch hunt is no less disgusting than starting your own.” >“Personally, I wanted to fight this on principle,” Raymond said. “Russ resigned the presidency rather than get OSI into that fight, and the board quite properly respected his wishes in the matter. That sacrifice makes me angrier at the fools and thugs who pulled him down.”
    - wraptile 8mo ago
      Oh wow TIL, thanks for expanding

gschizas 8mo ago

What's the story with Eric Raymond?

wraptile 8mo ago
If I understand correctly it's just a reflection on different governing styles where Eric Raymond was a bit louder (pro gun libertarian) while Guido's strategy was more consensus-orentied and pragmatic which turned out be the winning one. PSF got IRS non-profit status etc and became incredibly successful. Maybe someone else can fill in more but there's nothing particularly dramatic here that I could find other than Eric has become more political in culture wars era. Also see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric_S._Raymond#Political_beliefs_and_activism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric_S._Raymond#Political_beli...
- DonHopkins 8mo ago
  Guido is not racist like ESR is, and it would have been a disaster to have somebody as racist and obsessed with dragging the organizations he leads into the pro-racism side of political culture war battles that have absolutely nothing to do with their mission, as ESR has a track record of trying to do: He threw down the gauntlet and attempted to drag OSI into supporting Russ Nelson after his infamous "Blacks are Lazy" blog posting that caused him to resign for the good of OSI, who ESR wanted to spend their resources and reputation fighting his culture war against (dog whistle alert:) "thugs" who don't want to follow a racist leader. That kind of blatant racism and totally non-python-related racist culture warfare bullshit political battles would have been extremely detrimental to the python community, just as his other antics and his and Russel's racist rants were detrimental to the open source community. OSI has enough problems attracting women and minorities that they don't need white male leaders telling black people they're lazy and accusing people who disagree of being "fools and thugs". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russ_Nelson https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russ_Nelson "Blacks are lazy" -Russ Nelson https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Russ_Nelson#Blacks_are_lazy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Russ_Nelson#Blacks_are_la... New OSI President Steps Down https://www.eweek.com/servers/new-osi-president-steps-down/#sthash.EJtgGdxJ.dpuf https://www.eweek.com/servers/new-osi-president-steps-down/#... >“The people who knew Russ as a Quaker, a pacifist and a gentleman, and no racist, but nevertheless pressured OSI to do the responsible thing and fire him in order to avoid political damage should be equally ashamed,” Raymond said. “Abetting somebody elses witch hunt is no less disgusting than starting your own.” >“Personally, I wanted to fight this on principle,” Raymond said. “Russ resigned the presidency rather than get OSI into that fight, and the board quite properly respected his wishes in the matter. That sacrifice makes me angrier at the fools and thugs who pulled him down.”
  - wraptile 8mo ago
    Oh wow TIL, thanks for expanding