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And have you compared the output of three junior devs to hiring one mid level ticket taker who isn’t that much more expensive + AI coding agents?

Retric 8mo ago
You don’t want 3 Jr devs at the same time because of diminishing returns. Most projects have grunt work where attention to detail is important but experience doesn’t really help much. AI can quickly come up with alt text for images, but ensuring it’s actually useful for someone using a screen reader is a different story. 1 new Jr every 2 years works quite well for a team of 7+ developers.
- raw_anon_1111 8mo ago
  And that junior dev will probably leave in 2 years because HR won’t allow you to give them a raise to match their market comp. But with a team of 7, I can’t believe that giving them all a Claude Code subscription wouldn’t be much cheaper and much more productive than hiring a junior. A junior though with AI is more dangerous than a junior without.
  - Retric 8mo ago
    That’s not really an either or situation, you can have 7 team members with Claud Code and 1 Jr without. I’ve seen many people stick around for a surprising amount of time while severely under compensated. I suspect that’s why HR does it.
    - raw_anon_1111 8mo ago
      What’s the use of the junior? You have just widen the gap between mid and junior developers making them less useful
      - deleted 8mo ago
        [deleted]
      - Retric 8mo ago
        Working on problems that are a poor fit for a mid level developer with AI assistance of which there are still plenty. I find AI tools make everyone better at exactly the same kind of problems, which means a larger percentage of what’s left over is more cheaply done by Jr’s working without AI assistance.
        bdangubic 8mo ago
        > I find AI tools make everyone better at exactly the same kind of problems Fascinating. I am finding the exact opposite, like complete 180
        Retric 8mo ago
        How exactly do some people leverage AI to rearrange the furniture in the conference room for an office party? Physical labor may be a tiny fraction of what a team of developers do, but I’ve seen what amounts to several thousand dollars spent on that kind of silly task because teams leverage the tools they have.
        raw_anon_1111 8mo ago
        You pay contractors and caterers - that’s a poor excuse ti have dead weight.
        Retric 8mo ago
        You just replaced one task that an AI is useless for with a different task that an AI is useless for. The point obviously still stands, and no I am not suggesting using Jr devs for physical labor alone is worth adding them to the team. Rather that “Work” includes a very wide variety of tasks that need to get done.
        8mo ago

Retric 8mo ago

You don’t want 3 Jr devs at the same time because of diminishing returns. Most projects have grunt work where attention to detail is important but experience doesn’t really help much. AI can quickly come up with alt text for images, but ensuring it’s actually useful for someone using a screen reader is a different story. 1 new Jr every 2 years works quite well for a team of 7+ developers.

raw_anon_1111 8mo ago
And that junior dev will probably leave in 2 years because HR won’t allow you to give them a raise to match their market comp. But with a team of 7, I can’t believe that giving them all a Claude Code subscription wouldn’t be much cheaper and much more productive than hiring a junior. A junior though with AI is more dangerous than a junior without.
- Retric 8mo ago
  That’s not really an either or situation, you can have 7 team members with Claud Code and 1 Jr without. I’ve seen many people stick around for a surprising amount of time while severely under compensated. I suspect that’s why HR does it.
  - raw_anon_1111 8mo ago
    What’s the use of the junior? You have just widen the gap between mid and junior developers making them less useful
    - deleted 8mo ago
      [deleted]
    - Retric 8mo ago
      Working on problems that are a poor fit for a mid level developer with AI assistance of which there are still plenty. I find AI tools make everyone better at exactly the same kind of problems, which means a larger percentage of what’s left over is more cheaply done by Jr’s working without AI assistance.
      - bdangubic 8mo ago
        > I find AI tools make everyone better at exactly the same kind of problems Fascinating. I am finding the exact opposite, like complete 180
        Retric 8mo ago
        How exactly do some people leverage AI to rearrange the furniture in the conference room for an office party? Physical labor may be a tiny fraction of what a team of developers do, but I’ve seen what amounts to several thousand dollars spent on that kind of silly task because teams leverage the tools they have.
        raw_anon_1111 8mo ago
        You pay contractors and caterers - that’s a poor excuse ti have dead weight.
        Retric 8mo ago
        You just replaced one task that an AI is useless for with a different task that an AI is useless for. The point obviously still stands, and no I am not suggesting using Jr devs for physical labor alone is worth adding them to the team. Rather that “Work” includes a very wide variety of tasks that need to get done.
        8mo ago