7 ms·

Greg Knauss Is Losing Himself

69 points by wallflower 7mo ago

deleted 7mo ago
[deleted]
sunir 7mo ago
I don't feel like the abstraction away from assembly language resulted in fewer software engineering jobs. Nor do I feel like Java's virtual machine resulted in fewer systems engineering jobs. Somehow I don't feel that writing in English rather than pure logic will result in fewer engineering problems either. A lot more actually. But at least we'll get the requirements out of users into something concrete faster. What is definitely going to be abundantly clear is just how much better machines can get at creating correct code and how bad each of us truly is at this. That's an ego hit. The loving effort an artisan puts into a perfect pot still has wabi sabi from the human error; whereas a factory produced pot is way more perfect and possesses both a Quality from closeness to Idealism and an eerieness from its unnaturalness. However, the demand for artisan pottery has niched out compared to Ikea bowls, so that's just how it is.
Nevermark 7mo ago
> I don't feel like the abstraction away from assembly language resulted in fewer software engineering jobs. Given the models are unlikely to stop getting better, I think it is fair to say the human contribution is going to keep getting "leaner". That is going to change the job, but also head count. But I agree harnessing models opens up opportunities for better product design, ... but only ... everywhere. The people who design the most usable software have always been in a minority. They will be valuable for some time.
gtowey 7mo ago
LLMs can't be strategic because they do not understand the big picture -- that the real work of good software is balancing a hundred different constraints in a way that produces the optimal result for the humans who use it. It's not all that different from the state of big corp software today! Large organizations with layers of management tend to lose all abiliy to keep a consistent strategy. They tend to go all in on a single dimension such as ROI for the next quarter, but it misses the bigger picture. Good software is about creating longer term value and takes consistent skill & vision to execute. Those software engineers who focus on this big picture thinking are going to be more valuable than ever.
- pixl97 7mo ago
  >LLMs can't be strategic because they do not understand the big picture While I do tend to believe you, what evidence based data do you have to prove this is true?
  - gtowey 7mo ago
    > While I do tend to believe you, what evidence based data do you have to prove this is true? IMO the onus is to prove that they can be strategic. Otherwise you're asking me to prove a negative.
    - pixl97 7mo ago
      Saying the tiger has to prove it can eat you is not a great strategy to survive a tiger attack.
      - bigstrat2003 7mo ago
        Well so far the tiger faceplants in an embarrassing fashion every time it tries to eat someone. So I'm not really worried about that.
        pixl97 7mo ago
        Gary Marcus: "LLMs will never be able to a..... wait, what do you mean they can already do that?"
    - vonneumannstan 7mo ago
      Task Time horizons are improving exponentially with doubling times around 4 months per METR. At what timescale would you accept that they "can be strategic"? Theres little reason to think they wont be at multi week or month time horizons very soon. Do you need to be strategic to complete multi month tasks?
      - gtowey 7mo ago
slibhb 7mo ago
> It was a nice little feature that I knew exactly how to do, but I hadn’t prioritized getting done yet because there were a bunch of other things on my plate. But with a little assist, it was quick to implement. Exactly how I feel. AI has allowed me to work on projects that I've wanted to work on but didn't have the time/energy for.
- wartywhoa23 7mo ago
  > AI has allowed me to work on projects that I've wanted to work on but didn't have the time/energy for. So let's flood the world with projects nobody, including their authors in the first place, cared for enough to dedicate time and energy to.
cc-d 7mo ago
Are you the wallflower from the legendary fugg efnet rap video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=evBderwVKKE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=evBderwVKKE
- MarcelOlsz 7mo ago
  This song bangs, looping this all day. What a throwback. Reminds me of ytcracker/digitalgangster days. Also reminds me of Das Racist. Thanks for posting this lol. Love that grime-ish electro beat. Can you email me? Would love to chat/get more tunes from you.
  - cc-d 7mo ago
    Sure what is your email? Mine is ccarterdev@gmail.com I watch this comment more closely though :) Mob currently controls my email
    - MarcelOlsz 7mo ago
      Emailed! Mines in my profile.
kshri24 7mo ago
> I’m starting to think that’s going to be personality and feel and polish, but turned up a notch. That’s what I used to do when I started writing apps, but in some ways I have really toned it down in favor of OS alignment. That's all that is really required. I mean look at the Microslop fiasco. They ruined a perfectly good editor: Notepad with AI slop. But this is not reflecting in their sales. They still are showing record revenues. Just because a competing product exists does not mean your product is suddenly obsolete. There will always be people who will want to buy (provided the market is not oversaturated). Because that is how humans do things. AI won't change that behavior overnight [1]. Look around you and you will see every product you hold in your hand has at least 5-10 competitors. [1] Think about all the things that are still not computerized and which requires you to fill some or the other form of paperwork. We have had computers for over nearly 6 decades now. We STILL have physical forms that we fill from time to time. Computerization was touted to revolutionize this and yet here we are. Still not achieved 100% digitalization. The same will happen with AI as well. There is this initial burst of excitement (which is the phase we are in) until reality sets in and that's when people will learn how to best use the technology. What you are seeing today (vibe coding et all) is NOT IT.
brbrodude 7mo ago
So now we're supposed to become the idea guy? Goddamnit.
allreduce 7mo ago
Honestly I feel like something important was yanked from under my feet. Computers were always an escape for me, then a starting career, something that helped me get started in life. Wow, those things I learned while spending nights making things move on the computer are actually worth something. And now a lot of it is just gone, worthless, right when I started having a bit of success. That wasn't supposed to happen. Not that I can complain much, worse things have happened to better people bla bla. But it's disorienting. I still have non-automatable skills and enjoy learning, but who says they are not going to come up with Claude Opus 4.9 or something and turns out it can do that too, ha ha. How is a young person supposed to establish themselves in this new world?

69 points by wallflower 7mo ago

deleted 7mo ago

[deleted]

sunir 7mo ago

I don't feel like the abstraction away from assembly language resulted in fewer software engineering jobs. Nor do I feel like Java's virtual machine resulted in fewer systems engineering jobs. Somehow I don't feel that writing in English rather than pure logic will result in fewer engineering problems either. A lot more actually. But at least we'll get the requirements out of users into something concrete faster. What is definitely going to be abundantly clear is just how much better machines can get at creating correct code and how bad each of us truly is at this. That's an ego hit. The loving effort an artisan puts into a perfect pot still has wabi sabi from the human error; whereas a factory produced pot is way more perfect and possesses both a Quality from closeness to Idealism and an eerieness from its unnaturalness. However, the demand for artisan pottery has niched out compared to Ikea bowls, so that's just how it is.

Nevermark 7mo ago

> I don't feel like the abstraction away from assembly language resulted in fewer software engineering jobs. Given the models are unlikely to stop getting better, I think it is fair to say the human contribution is going to keep getting "leaner". That is going to change the job, but also head count. But I agree harnessing models opens up opportunities for better product design, ... but only ... everywhere. The people who design the most usable software have always been in a minority. They will be valuable for some time.

gtowey 7mo ago

LLMs can't be strategic because they do not understand the big picture -- that the real work of good software is balancing a hundred different constraints in a way that produces the optimal result for the humans who use it. It's not all that different from the state of big corp software today! Large organizations with layers of management tend to lose all abiliy to keep a consistent strategy. They tend to go all in on a single dimension such as ROI for the next quarter, but it misses the bigger picture. Good software is about creating longer term value and takes consistent skill & vision to execute. Those software engineers who focus on this big picture thinking are going to be more valuable than ever.

pixl97 7mo ago
>LLMs can't be strategic because they do not understand the big picture While I do tend to believe you, what evidence based data do you have to prove this is true?
- gtowey 7mo ago
  > While I do tend to believe you, what evidence based data do you have to prove this is true? IMO the onus is to prove that they can be strategic. Otherwise you're asking me to prove a negative.
  - pixl97 7mo ago
    Saying the tiger has to prove it can eat you is not a great strategy to survive a tiger attack.
    - bigstrat2003 7mo ago
      Well so far the tiger faceplants in an embarrassing fashion every time it tries to eat someone. So I'm not really worried about that.
      - pixl97 7mo ago
        Gary Marcus: "LLMs will never be able to a..... wait, what do you mean they can already do that?"
  - vonneumannstan 7mo ago
    Task Time horizons are improving exponentially with doubling times around 4 months per METR. At what timescale would you accept that they "can be strategic"? Theres little reason to think they wont be at multi week or month time horizons very soon. Do you need to be strategic to complete multi month tasks?
    - gtowey 7mo ago

slibhb 7mo ago

> It was a nice little feature that I knew exactly how to do, but I hadn’t prioritized getting done yet because there were a bunch of other things on my plate. But with a little assist, it was quick to implement. Exactly how I feel. AI has allowed me to work on projects that I've wanted to work on but didn't have the time/energy for.

wartywhoa23 7mo ago
> AI has allowed me to work on projects that I've wanted to work on but didn't have the time/energy for. So let's flood the world with projects nobody, including their authors in the first place, cared for enough to dedicate time and energy to.

cc-d 7mo ago

Are you the wallflower from the legendary fugg efnet rap video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=evBderwVKKE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=evBderwVKKE

MarcelOlsz 7mo ago
This song bangs, looping this all day. What a throwback. Reminds me of ytcracker/digitalgangster days. Also reminds me of Das Racist. Thanks for posting this lol. Love that grime-ish electro beat. Can you email me? Would love to chat/get more tunes from you.
- cc-d 7mo ago
  Sure what is your email? Mine is ccarterdev@gmail.com I watch this comment more closely though :) Mob currently controls my email
  - MarcelOlsz 7mo ago
    Emailed! Mines in my profile.

kshri24 7mo ago

> I’m starting to think that’s going to be personality and feel and polish, but turned up a notch. That’s what I used to do when I started writing apps, but in some ways I have really toned it down in favor of OS alignment. That's all that is really required. I mean look at the Microslop fiasco. They ruined a perfectly good editor: Notepad with AI slop. But this is not reflecting in their sales. They still are showing record revenues. Just because a competing product exists does not mean your product is suddenly obsolete. There will always be people who will want to buy (provided the market is not oversaturated). Because that is how humans do things. AI won't change that behavior overnight [1]. Look around you and you will see every product you hold in your hand has at least 5-10 competitors. [1] Think about all the things that are still not computerized and which requires you to fill some or the other form of paperwork. We have had computers for over nearly 6 decades now. We STILL have physical forms that we fill from time to time. Computerization was touted to revolutionize this and yet here we are. Still not achieved 100% digitalization. The same will happen with AI as well. There is this initial burst of excitement (which is the phase we are in) until reality sets in and that's when people will learn how to best use the technology. What you are seeing today (vibe coding et all) is NOT IT.

brbrodude 7mo ago

So now we're supposed to become the idea guy? Goddamnit.

allreduce 7mo ago

Honestly I feel like something important was yanked from under my feet. Computers were always an escape for me, then a starting career, something that helped me get started in life. Wow, those things I learned while spending nights making things move on the computer are actually worth something. And now a lot of it is just gone, worthless, right when I started having a bit of success. That wasn't supposed to happen. Not that I can complain much, worse things have happened to better people bla bla. But it's disorienting. I still have non-automatable skills and enjoy learning, but who says they are not going to come up with Claude Opus 4.9 or something and turns out it can do that too, ha ha. How is a young person supposed to establish themselves in this new world?