5 ms·

The turning point happened when Trump was reelected. One could argue the turning point happened Jan. 6 2020 and nobody truly cared. The consequence should have

by bambax 8mo ago

The turning point happened when Trump was reelected. One could argue the turning point happened Jan. 6 2020 and nobody truly cared. The consequence should have been for all insurrectionists and Trump himself to be tried for treason and be imprisoned indefinitely. Yet here we are.

shevy-java 8mo ago
I'd agree - Trump fulfils the criteria of treason. It's interesting to see that nothing happens despite this. Now he started another war to distract from his involvement in the huge Epstein network. Also, by the way, quite interesting to see how many people were involved here; there is no way Ghislaine could solo-organise all of that yet she is the only one in prison. That makes objectively no sense.
- formerly_proven 8mo ago
  Another flawed democracy just sentenced their ex-president who attempted a insurrection (and similarly claimed broad presidential powers and immunity) to life in prison. Interesting contrast. e: Americans seem to be surprised to learn that their democracy is indeed classified as a flawed democracy for more than a decade by The Economist due to decades of backsliding (the more rapid regression lately is not yet accounted for, but I wouldn't be surprised if the outcome of the 2026 elections results in a hybrid regime assessment in 2027).
- tim333 8mo ago
  You'd have a job arguing it's treason legally. In the US that's "levying War against [the United States], or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort". They were going to do him for conspiracy to defraud the United States and conspiracy to obstruct an official proceeding, re. the 2020 stuff before he got reelected.
jmull 8mo ago
> The consequence should have been for all insurrectionists and Trump himself to be tried for treason and be imprisoned indefinitely. People have this intuitive sense that there's some kind of authority of truth or justice, an available recourse that we could've and should've used. But that sense is incorrect. What we actually have the political and justice systems that Trump and his adherent have, so far, quite successfully subverted.
childintime 8mo ago
It was when the supreme court judged he could act like a king, the summer before he was elected, inventing things the constitution never said and setting the example of lawlessness Trump now follows up on confidently.
- anon84873628 8mo ago
  And continuing to pull on that thread, when the Senate refused to vote on Supreme Court nominees for the president in 2016.
  - troyvit 8mo ago
    Call it the pebble that started the landslide but I lay it at the Patriot Act, which was passed in October, 2001. The passing of the law was bad enough but the subsequent extensions of the law by both parties cemented the government's intent. In other words we might have killed Osama Bin Laden, but he won. The U.S truly is a "shadow of it's former self."
xerox13ster 8mo ago
[flagged]
- pirate787 8mo ago
  Your take is a call for civil war. You're obviously wrong about "treason" since even larger majorities voted for Trump in 2024.
  - lostlogin 8mo ago
    How things played out isn’t what decides if it was treason or not.
  - krapp 8mo ago
    The US is already in a state of civil war, that war was declared in 2016. Half the country just hasn't accepted the reality that the other half refuses to share a society with them and wants them dead.
scottyah 7mo ago
Jan 6th getting overplayed by a lot of media was very damning for the left, I definitely gave Trump et al more benefit of the doubt after seeing the actual footage of the event.
- fdsjgfklsfd 7mo ago
  "Overplayed"? Did you see the actual footage of the event? The event in which people attacked Capitol Police and broke into the Capitol and tried to take power by force?
  - scottyah 7mo ago
    Yes, I saw a lot of footage and kept doing so as more was released. Not sure what power you thought they were trying to take by force, it was like the Dark Knight scene on Wall Street. There's no "power" in that building. A guy took Pelosi's podium- is that the power you're referring to? I saw non-rioters open doors for them, the calm and polite lines of rioters walking out, a person asking where they should be giving their speech, and a few people doing funny pictures like they were in their elementary school classroom on a weekend. I also saw two BBC leaders resigning because they purposefully doctored footage to fit their narrative. I saw how selective the footage shown was, and how specific the phrasing was to incite rage and/or fear. If there wasn't so much manipulation and so many lies around it, I wouldn't have to question the integrity of the people pushing the narrative.

by bambax 8mo ago

shevy-java 8mo ago

I'd agree - Trump fulfils the criteria of treason. It's interesting to see that nothing happens despite this. Now he started another war to distract from his involvement in the huge Epstein network. Also, by the way, quite interesting to see how many people were involved here; there is no way Ghislaine could solo-organise all of that yet she is the only one in prison. That makes objectively no sense.

formerly_proven 8mo ago
Another flawed democracy just sentenced their ex-president who attempted a insurrection (and similarly claimed broad presidential powers and immunity) to life in prison. Interesting contrast. e: Americans seem to be surprised to learn that their democracy is indeed classified as a flawed democracy for more than a decade by The Economist due to decades of backsliding (the more rapid regression lately is not yet accounted for, but I wouldn't be surprised if the outcome of the 2026 elections results in a hybrid regime assessment in 2027).
tim333 8mo ago
You'd have a job arguing it's treason legally. In the US that's "levying War against [the United States], or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort". They were going to do him for conspiracy to defraud the United States and conspiracy to obstruct an official proceeding, re. the 2020 stuff before he got reelected.

jmull 8mo ago

> The consequence should have been for all insurrectionists and Trump himself to be tried for treason and be imprisoned indefinitely. People have this intuitive sense that there's some kind of authority of truth or justice, an available recourse that we could've and should've used. But that sense is incorrect. What we actually have the political and justice systems that Trump and his adherent have, so far, quite successfully subverted.

childintime 8mo ago

It was when the supreme court judged he could act like a king, the summer before he was elected, inventing things the constitution never said and setting the example of lawlessness Trump now follows up on confidently.

anon84873628 8mo ago
And continuing to pull on that thread, when the Senate refused to vote on Supreme Court nominees for the president in 2016.
- troyvit 8mo ago
  Call it the pebble that started the landslide but I lay it at the Patriot Act, which was passed in October, 2001. The passing of the law was bad enough but the subsequent extensions of the law by both parties cemented the government's intent. In other words we might have killed Osama Bin Laden, but he won. The U.S truly is a "shadow of it's former self."

xerox13ster 8mo ago

[flagged]

pirate787 8mo ago
Your take is a call for civil war. You're obviously wrong about "treason" since even larger majorities voted for Trump in 2024.
- lostlogin 8mo ago
  How things played out isn’t what decides if it was treason or not.
- krapp 8mo ago
  The US is already in a state of civil war, that war was declared in 2016. Half the country just hasn't accepted the reality that the other half refuses to share a society with them and wants them dead.

scottyah 7mo ago

Jan 6th getting overplayed by a lot of media was very damning for the left, I definitely gave Trump et al more benefit of the doubt after seeing the actual footage of the event.

fdsjgfklsfd 7mo ago
"Overplayed"? Did you see the actual footage of the event? The event in which people attacked Capitol Police and broke into the Capitol and tried to take power by force?
- scottyah 7mo ago
  Yes, I saw a lot of footage and kept doing so as more was released. Not sure what power you thought they were trying to take by force, it was like the Dark Knight scene on Wall Street. There's no "power" in that building. A guy took Pelosi's podium- is that the power you're referring to? I saw non-rioters open doors for them, the calm and polite lines of rioters walking out, a person asking where they should be giving their speech, and a few people doing funny pictures like they were in their elementary school classroom on a weekend. I also saw two BBC leaders resigning because they purposefully doctored footage to fit their narrative. I saw how selective the footage shown was, and how specific the phrasing was to incite rage and/or fear. If there wasn't so much manipulation and so many lies around it, I wouldn't have to question the integrity of the people pushing the narrative.