4 ms·

Sorry - being dim - I don't get that.

WarmWash 8mo ago
Apple has offered products with little value over competitors for a long time now, but they still get to command a large premium on their products because "the vibes are right". When engineers analyze things they look at the specs, stats, and metrics. When consumers analyze things they look at what others are doing, feel for vibes, roll into the convenience, and stick with the familiar.
- jasonjmcghee 8mo ago
  > Apple has offered products with little value over competitors I'm genuinely surprised by this comment. For example, I thought there was universal sentiment that apple silicon / M-series computers are pretty unmatched.
  - WarmWash 8mo ago
    The overwhelming volume of Apples sales comes from people who wouldn't notice if their device was running 2016 level hardware.
    - jasonjmcghee 8mo ago
      If software didn't keep getting worse this might be true but the average consumer notices if their computer is slow or dies too quickly.
      - adithyassekhar 8mo ago
        It's sad how hardware improves leaps every year but software still does the same things but slower.
      - kelvinjps10 8mo ago
        But competitors do the same
    - nozzlegear 8mo ago
      > The overwhelming volume of Apples sales comes from people who wouldn't notice if their device was running 2016 level hardware. How could we possibly know this? This is just an argument from elitism, as though the plebes should be happy playing Farmville on their gateway computers, while us haughty developers sit in our ivory towers and herald in the end of the anthropocene using machines we can actually appreciate.
      - bigyabai 8mo ago
        > How could we possibly know this? They make a good point. Apple's most-popular device is a smartphone that doesn't handle workloads any heavier than Snapchat or Instagram. The value prop of the iPhone is not rooted in the performance or battery life (as Liquid Glass showed us) but just the branding. Apple makes more money selling iPhone accessories than they make selling Macs. The desktop market share isn't going up, the Mac's lifeline is depreciation of old hardware to force Mac owners into the upgrade cycle: https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/desktop/worldwide/ https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/desktop/worldwide...
        jasonjmcghee 8mo ago
        iPhones are some sci-fi magic computers. It's incredible how powerful they are. Most smartphones are.
        bigyabai 8mo ago
        Be that as it may, I can guarantee you with complete confidence that 90% of iPhone owners are not engaged in heavy workloads. The overwhelming majority of people just don't notice.
        nozzlegear 8mo ago
        > They make a good point. Apple's most-popular device is a smartphone that doesn't handle workloads any heavier than Snapchat or Instagram. The value prop of the iPhone is not rooted in the performance or battery life (as Liquid Glass showed us) but just the branding. It's not a good point, it's an assumption based on elitism, just like your assumption that nobody is doing anything other than Snapchat or Instagram on their phones, or that they're only buying an iPhone because of the branding and not also the performance and battery life. In your head, what do you think the average iPhone user looks like? Are they drooling simpletons? > Apple makes more money selling iPhone accessories than they make selling Macs. You look at the desktop market share in 2026 and it's very apparent that the Mac's regular upgrade cycle is driving Apple's sales, not direct competition: https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/desktop/worldwide/ https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/desktop/worldwide... What point are you trying to make here? People like the iPhone, the iPhone makes a shitload of money, so therefore people who have Macs don't appreciate the hardware? Or what? Also, StatCounter is not an accurate website: https://daringfireball.net/2026/01/ios_26_adoption_rate_is_not_bizarrely_low https://daringfireball.net/2026/01/ios_26_adoption_rate_is_n... https://daringfireball.net/2026/02/apple_releases_ios_26_adoption_rates https://daringfireball.net/2026/02/apple_releases_ios_26_ado...
  - hojiyaka 8mo ago
    I think the point was supposed to be default apps in an OS, similar to default search engine.. What I am missing is that OpenAI is in no way that default. Every OS, browser, etc should be able to find a more profitable default than sending someone to OpenAI.
  - ac29 8mo ago
    > For example, I thought there was universal sentiment that apple silicon / M-series computers are pretty unmatched. 5 years ago, sure, but the x86 world has come a long way since Apple dumped Intel. I'd certainly take a 2026 Intel machine over something with an M1-M3.
- chasd00 8mo ago
  it's a very different world when you switch from an iphone to an android phone or vice versa. However, Claude.ai and chatgpt.com are not very different at all. If one has ads and the other does not, it's easy to switch.
- cardanome 8mo ago
  Apple is one of the very few companies committed to (hardware) quality. They make sure their entry level models are very decent. You can't buy a apple product that is complete shite. Yes, the software side is getting worse in recent years but is it at least slightly better than the competition for average consumers. Plus being a tech monopolist they can offer a whole ecosystem of software and hardware that works great with each other. So the value proposition is greater than the sum of its parts. That is the problem with OpenAI, they have only one thing. Google can bleed money all day long and they don't need to care because they have other profitable business ventures. The way to make money with LLMs is to either be technically superior which only works short term until the competition catches up or create a monopoly. The second option is dead in the water with the advent of the Chinese models. I guess they can lobby to have them banned and create a cartel with their other US based competitors. Otherwise they are screwed. That is why they are allowing military use of their model now. They need that sweet government money to survive. Also they keep talking about AGI so the government gets scared about the Chinese reaching it first and supports them. Complete scam.
- manishsharan 8mo ago
  >> Apple has offered products with little value over competitors My Pixel dropped connections unexpectedly. The battery would barely last till end of day. Apple hardware is simply better value for the money
adithyassekhar 8mo ago
There's this thing called power of defaults. If a setting is default, if an app is presented on the front they'll continue to use it as it is. The crowd here always overestimates how competent/interested the general public are in these things. 99.9% (source: my life) of users never even open the second level of the settings app. 99% don't even open the settings app. They don't know how much they can even change or care. iPhones auto surfacing airpods to pair with was not for convenience it was a necessity. People don't know how to pair with bluetooth. Now android does it as well. There's a generation that grew up with appliances that accounted for their mistakes rather than failing. There's no need to learn or understand how something works.
- DrScientist 8mo ago
  Sure defaults are extremely powerful - but that's rather my point - where is the default that OpenAI controls? Google, Apple, Samsung, Microsoft ( and various Chinese companies ) etc are largely are in control of defaults - via devices and browsers. Perhaps in Github copilot ( via MS ) - but software developers are not typical consumers. Perhaps Sam and johnnies new assistant thing will transform the market - but until that ships it's vapour ware.
  - adithyassekhar 8mo ago
    Yes this was not relevant to the main topic of openai. I'm just responding to the statement made by the parent comment.

Apple has offered products with little value over competitors for a long time now, but they still get to command a large premium on their products because "the vibes are right". When engineers analyze things they look at the specs, stats, and metrics. When consumers analyze things they look at what others are doing, feel for vibes, roll into the convenience, and stick with the familiar.

jasonjmcghee 8mo ago
> Apple has offered products with little value over competitors I'm genuinely surprised by this comment. For example, I thought there was universal sentiment that apple silicon / M-series computers are pretty unmatched.
- WarmWash 8mo ago
  The overwhelming volume of Apples sales comes from people who wouldn't notice if their device was running 2016 level hardware.
  - jasonjmcghee 8mo ago
    If software didn't keep getting worse this might be true but the average consumer notices if their computer is slow or dies too quickly.
    - adithyassekhar 8mo ago
      It's sad how hardware improves leaps every year but software still does the same things but slower.
    - kelvinjps10 8mo ago
      But competitors do the same
  - nozzlegear 8mo ago
    > The overwhelming volume of Apples sales comes from people who wouldn't notice if their device was running 2016 level hardware. How could we possibly know this? This is just an argument from elitism, as though the plebes should be happy playing Farmville on their gateway computers, while us haughty developers sit in our ivory towers and herald in the end of the anthropocene using machines we can actually appreciate.
    - bigyabai 8mo ago
      > How could we possibly know this? They make a good point. Apple's most-popular device is a smartphone that doesn't handle workloads any heavier than Snapchat or Instagram. The value prop of the iPhone is not rooted in the performance or battery life (as Liquid Glass showed us) but just the branding. Apple makes more money selling iPhone accessories than they make selling Macs. The desktop market share isn't going up, the Mac's lifeline is depreciation of old hardware to force Mac owners into the upgrade cycle: https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/desktop/worldwide/ https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/desktop/worldwide...
      - jasonjmcghee 8mo ago
        iPhones are some sci-fi magic computers. It's incredible how powerful they are. Most smartphones are.
        bigyabai 8mo ago
        Be that as it may, I can guarantee you with complete confidence that 90% of iPhone owners are not engaged in heavy workloads. The overwhelming majority of people just don't notice.
      - nozzlegear 8mo ago
        > They make a good point. Apple's most-popular device is a smartphone that doesn't handle workloads any heavier than Snapchat or Instagram. The value prop of the iPhone is not rooted in the performance or battery life (as Liquid Glass showed us) but just the branding. It's not a good point, it's an assumption based on elitism, just like your assumption that nobody is doing anything other than Snapchat or Instagram on their phones, or that they're only buying an iPhone because of the branding and not also the performance and battery life. In your head, what do you think the average iPhone user looks like? Are they drooling simpletons? > Apple makes more money selling iPhone accessories than they make selling Macs. You look at the desktop market share in 2026 and it's very apparent that the Mac's regular upgrade cycle is driving Apple's sales, not direct competition: https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/desktop/worldwide/ https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/desktop/worldwide... What point are you trying to make here? People like the iPhone, the iPhone makes a shitload of money, so therefore people who have Macs don't appreciate the hardware? Or what? Also, StatCounter is not an accurate website: https://daringfireball.net/2026/01/ios_26_adoption_rate_is_not_bizarrely_low https://daringfireball.net/2026/01/ios_26_adoption_rate_is_n... https://daringfireball.net/2026/02/apple_releases_ios_26_adoption_rates https://daringfireball.net/2026/02/apple_releases_ios_26_ado...
- hojiyaka 8mo ago
  I think the point was supposed to be default apps in an OS, similar to default search engine.. What I am missing is that OpenAI is in no way that default. Every OS, browser, etc should be able to find a more profitable default than sending someone to OpenAI.
- ac29 8mo ago
  > For example, I thought there was universal sentiment that apple silicon / M-series computers are pretty unmatched. 5 years ago, sure, but the x86 world has come a long way since Apple dumped Intel. I'd certainly take a 2026 Intel machine over something with an M1-M3.
chasd00 8mo ago
it's a very different world when you switch from an iphone to an android phone or vice versa. However, Claude.ai and chatgpt.com are not very different at all. If one has ads and the other does not, it's easy to switch.
cardanome 8mo ago
Apple is one of the very few companies committed to (hardware) quality. They make sure their entry level models are very decent. You can't buy a apple product that is complete shite. Yes, the software side is getting worse in recent years but is it at least slightly better than the competition for average consumers. Plus being a tech monopolist they can offer a whole ecosystem of software and hardware that works great with each other. So the value proposition is greater than the sum of its parts. That is the problem with OpenAI, they have only one thing. Google can bleed money all day long and they don't need to care because they have other profitable business ventures. The way to make money with LLMs is to either be technically superior which only works short term until the competition catches up or create a monopoly. The second option is dead in the water with the advent of the Chinese models. I guess they can lobby to have them banned and create a cartel with their other US based competitors. Otherwise they are screwed. That is why they are allowing military use of their model now. They need that sweet government money to survive. Also they keep talking about AGI so the government gets scared about the Chinese reaching it first and supports them. Complete scam.
manishsharan 8mo ago
>> Apple has offered products with little value over competitors My Pixel dropped connections unexpectedly. The battery would barely last till end of day. Apple hardware is simply better value for the money

adithyassekhar 8mo ago

There's this thing called power of defaults. If a setting is default, if an app is presented on the front they'll continue to use it as it is. The crowd here always overestimates how competent/interested the general public are in these things. 99.9% (source: my life) of users never even open the second level of the settings app. 99% don't even open the settings app. They don't know how much they can even change or care. iPhones auto surfacing airpods to pair with was not for convenience it was a necessity. People don't know how to pair with bluetooth. Now android does it as well. There's a generation that grew up with appliances that accounted for their mistakes rather than failing. There's no need to learn or understand how something works.

DrScientist 8mo ago
Sure defaults are extremely powerful - but that's rather my point - where is the default that OpenAI controls? Google, Apple, Samsung, Microsoft ( and various Chinese companies ) etc are largely are in control of defaults - via devices and browsers. Perhaps in Github copilot ( via MS ) - but software developers are not typical consumers. Perhaps Sam and johnnies new assistant thing will transform the market - but until that ships it's vapour ware.
- adithyassekhar 8mo ago
  Yes this was not relevant to the main topic of openai. I'm just responding to the statement made by the parent comment.