4 ms·

> It burned through a mountain of tokens, but 10/10 - would generate tens of thousands of lines of useless code again. This is the biggest bottleneck at this p

> It burned through a mountain of tokens, but 10/10 - would generate tens of thousands of lines of useless code again. This is the biggest bottleneck at this point. I'm looking forward to RAM production increasing, and getting to a point where every high-end PC (workstation & gaming) has a dedicated NPU next to the GPU. You'll be able to do this kind of stuff as much as you want, using any local model you want. Run a ralph loop continuously for 72 hours? No problem.

Sharlin 8mo ago
Wasting electricity to "generate tens of thousands of lines of useless code" at will? Why is that in any way a desirable future?
- Barbing 8mo ago
  Optimists will imagine it to one day be as taxing and thus as wasteful as firing up MS Paint. No that’s a stretch, but firing up a AAA game.
  - Sharlin 8mo ago
    At least you (hopefully) get hours of entertainment from firing up an AAA game. Whereas generating vast amounts of code that you're never going to use has… some novelty value, I suppose. Luckily the novelty is going to wear off soon, I can't really see many people getting their daily happiness boost from making code machine say brrrrt straight to /dev/null. Even generating smut is a vastly more understandable (and vastly more commonplace, even now) use case for running genAI every day for hours.
    - embedding-shape 8mo ago
      > I can't really see many people getting their daily happiness boost from making code machine say brrrrt straight to /dev/null How long time do we have to wait before these people get bored? Or might they actually find what they generate useful and it doesn't all go straight to /dev/null, since seemingly it seems to gain usage, not drop in usage?
    - nineteen999 8mo ago
      The bigger use for case for AAA games? Employment for highly talented artists, 3D modellers and sculptors, texture artists, sound and music artists, and even programmers. At least it gives _something_ back. Until of course we've obsoleted all of them as well. Most of the AAA games I've paid for sit there in my Steam library and never get played. At least _some_ of the money probably went to those talented people whose work was used for training GenAI and coding models (and yes I say this as someone who has used all of these tools to prototype my own games, and still think human created content is of a much higher quality, just more expensive to produce).
- hathawsh 8mo ago
  A lot of code is "useless" only in the sense that no one wants to buy it and it will never find its way into an end user product. On the other hand, that same code might have enormous value for education, research, planning, exploration, simulation, testing, and so on. Being able to generate reams of "useless" code is a highly desirable future.
  - Sharlin 8mo ago
    Obviously "useful" doesn't just involve making money. Code that will be used for education and all of these things is clearly not useless. But let's be honest to ourselves, the sort of useless code the GP meant will never ever be used for any of that. The code will never leave their personal storage. In that sense it's about as valuable for the society at large as the combined exabytes of GenAI smut that people have been filling their drives with by running their 4090s 24/7.
- shoobiedoo 8mo ago
  The climate change alarms have been sounding for decades and yet vehicles keep getting bigger. Even in formerly "doing it right" countries like Japan. Turns out humans will always choose vanity and status symbols over facts. Oh well
- flatline 8mo ago
  One person's waste is another's value. Do you have any idea how "wasteful" tik tok or any other streaming platform is? I'll grant that AI is driving unprecedented data center development but it's far from the root cause, or even a leading clause, of our climate issues. I always find it strange that this is the first response so many have to AI, when it poses other more imminent existential threats IMO.
  - Sharlin 8mo ago
    It was a reply to what the GP said about running local generation 24/7 for no good reason, just because it's possible (and electricity is too cheap, apparently). There are many more threats, but those are beside the point in this specific context.
- mikkupikku 8mo ago
  Wait until you find out about video games.
LoganDark 8mo ago
I bet RAM production will only increase to meet AI demand and there will be none left for you. Or me. Or anyone. Crucial is already going probably forever and I'm sure more will follow...
- nextaccountic 8mo ago
  Yeah, OpenAI play was to cripple local AI "forever" (until the bubble pops), not to just deny RAM to competitors

Sharlin 8mo ago

Wasting electricity to "generate tens of thousands of lines of useless code" at will? Why is that in any way a desirable future?

Barbing 8mo ago
Optimists will imagine it to one day be as taxing and thus as wasteful as firing up MS Paint. No that’s a stretch, but firing up a AAA game.
- Sharlin 8mo ago
  At least you (hopefully) get hours of entertainment from firing up an AAA game. Whereas generating vast amounts of code that you're never going to use has… some novelty value, I suppose. Luckily the novelty is going to wear off soon, I can't really see many people getting their daily happiness boost from making code machine say brrrrt straight to /dev/null. Even generating smut is a vastly more understandable (and vastly more commonplace, even now) use case for running genAI every day for hours.
  - embedding-shape 8mo ago
    > I can't really see many people getting their daily happiness boost from making code machine say brrrrt straight to /dev/null How long time do we have to wait before these people get bored? Or might they actually find what they generate useful and it doesn't all go straight to /dev/null, since seemingly it seems to gain usage, not drop in usage?
  - nineteen999 8mo ago
    The bigger use for case for AAA games? Employment for highly talented artists, 3D modellers and sculptors, texture artists, sound and music artists, and even programmers. At least it gives _something_ back. Until of course we've obsoleted all of them as well. Most of the AAA games I've paid for sit there in my Steam library and never get played. At least _some_ of the money probably went to those talented people whose work was used for training GenAI and coding models (and yes I say this as someone who has used all of these tools to prototype my own games, and still think human created content is of a much higher quality, just more expensive to produce).
hathawsh 8mo ago
A lot of code is "useless" only in the sense that no one wants to buy it and it will never find its way into an end user product. On the other hand, that same code might have enormous value for education, research, planning, exploration, simulation, testing, and so on. Being able to generate reams of "useless" code is a highly desirable future.
- Sharlin 8mo ago
  Obviously "useful" doesn't just involve making money. Code that will be used for education and all of these things is clearly not useless. But let's be honest to ourselves, the sort of useless code the GP meant will never ever be used for any of that. The code will never leave their personal storage. In that sense it's about as valuable for the society at large as the combined exabytes of GenAI smut that people have been filling their drives with by running their 4090s 24/7.
shoobiedoo 8mo ago
The climate change alarms have been sounding for decades and yet vehicles keep getting bigger. Even in formerly "doing it right" countries like Japan. Turns out humans will always choose vanity and status symbols over facts. Oh well
flatline 8mo ago
One person's waste is another's value. Do you have any idea how "wasteful" tik tok or any other streaming platform is? I'll grant that AI is driving unprecedented data center development but it's far from the root cause, or even a leading clause, of our climate issues. I always find it strange that this is the first response so many have to AI, when it poses other more imminent existential threats IMO.
- Sharlin 8mo ago
  It was a reply to what the GP said about running local generation 24/7 for no good reason, just because it's possible (and electricity is too cheap, apparently). There are many more threats, but those are beside the point in this specific context.
mikkupikku 8mo ago
Wait until you find out about video games.

LoganDark 8mo ago

I bet RAM production will only increase to meet AI demand and there will be none left for you. Or me. Or anyone. Crucial is already going probably forever and I'm sure more will follow...

nextaccountic 8mo ago
Yeah, OpenAI play was to cripple local AI "forever" (until the bubble pops), not to just deny RAM to competitors