4 ms·

Maybe in the US. In Europe it never convinced anyone, as it never would since anything minimally related to Trump is discarded automatically.

petcat 8mo ago
Also because internet censorship and censorship in general has largely become normalized in Europe.
- bdangubic 8mo ago
  US is infinitely worse than EU but selectively based on what ruling party wants you to both see and post. try to get some coverage from gaza or west bank and/or post something slightly critical of israel and see how that works out for you. EU, China… are at least up front about what they want to censor and why, US censors every fucking imaginable thing while people are too stupid to see it and go “oh my, look how bad EU/China are…”
  - CamperBob2 8mo ago
    US censors every fucking imaginable thing while people are too stupid to see it and go “oh my, look how bad EU/China are No, we do not. You've been lied to. You should go back to whoever told you that, ask them why, and ask them not to do it again.
    - blackcatsec 8mo ago
      I mean there are an increasing number of states that are requiring age gating for pornography access for sites like PornHub. It's only a matter of time before that age gating expands to non-pornographic entities, which is the ultimate goal of the plan.
      - CamperBob2 8mo ago
        Unfortunately you're probably not wrong, but the fact remains, none of this is happening at a national level. Yet.
        bdangubic 8mo ago
        shit is and has been happening at the national level for a while. gave you an example you can take for a spin (would not advise you do though)
        CamperBob2 8mo ago
        If you're not in the US, you probably don't understand how our system of federalism works. We have 50 different states, some of which are basically run by the Christian equivalent of the Taliban or the Shiite mullahs of Iran. These state governments often come up with goofy, performative laws such as age verification that are normally set aside by higher courts as First Amendment violations. I say "normally" because the same religious factions are rapidly expanding their dominance over those very courts. Absolutely no historical freedoms can be taken for granted in the US right now. Nevertheless, the fact is, there is no national Internet censorship regime including age verification. No such laws are currently under consideration at the national level. (Yes, you can be prosecuted for downloading or distributing child pornography, but that is not an Internet-specific issue, and there is no other country I'm aware of where such laws are not also on the books.) Edit: if you are willing to move the goalposts that far, there is probably no way to convince you that the facts are as stated. Nevertheless... those are the facts. For further reading, look up the term "prior restraint." That's what's actually different in the US versus other countries that use technical means to enforce legal restrictions on Internet speech.
        zdragnar 8mo ago
        What are you smoking? Access to porn has been legally restricted in every state to 18+ for decades. Adding the Internet only made things easier because nobody enforced it the same way they were already enforcing brick and mortar stores that had the exact same materials. Likewise, there are plenty of rules and regulations around adult content on broadcast airwaves managed by the FCC. Challenging adult content as "free speech" has happened and already settled precedent at the Supreme Court. Yes, individual states are still trying to figure out how to actually best enforce the laws on the books at the Internet level, but there's no pretending that it is just a few states that actually have those laws.
    - bdangubic 8mo ago
      no one told me silly :)
  - AnthonyMouse 8mo ago
    > try to get some coverage from gaza or west bank and/or post something slightly critical of israel and see how that works out for you. On a US ISP aljazeera.com loads right up, as does The Guardian and RT.
- potatototoo99 8mo ago
  No it isn't. For example in my EU country I can see the list of all websites blocked, and all of them are for piracy/copyright infringement and illegal betting (legal betting is allowed, but must register and pay taxes). That and rt.com. I can also say/post whatever I want in social media except stalk and harass individual people. There is no "censorship" at all compared to virtually anywhere else in the world, US included.
  - CamperBob2 8mo ago
    That's normalization.
  - kvemkon 8mo ago
    > That and ... lenta.ru ? (aha, management personnel has been replaced 2014 [1]) [1] https://t.me/systemasystema/89 https://t.me/systemasystema/89 [RU]
  - SanjayMehta 8mo ago
    Blocking RT is not censorship? Nor is sanctioning your own journalists? Or a former intelligence agent, a Swiss national who worked for NATO, and now lives in Belgium? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46969722 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46969722
    - goobatrooba 8mo ago
      You link to a comment which lists a number of russian-paid propaganda actors spreading lies and hate. They have not been censored by a government but by courts which based on evidence identified breaches of law. It's something very different from censorship.
      - blell 8mo ago
        RT was not censored by any courts of law. It was censored by an unelected executive branch.
        8mo ago

petcat 8mo ago

Also because internet censorship and censorship in general has largely become normalized in Europe.

bdangubic 8mo ago
US is infinitely worse than EU but selectively based on what ruling party wants you to both see and post. try to get some coverage from gaza or west bank and/or post something slightly critical of israel and see how that works out for you. EU, China… are at least up front about what they want to censor and why, US censors every fucking imaginable thing while people are too stupid to see it and go “oh my, look how bad EU/China are…”
- CamperBob2 8mo ago
  US censors every fucking imaginable thing while people are too stupid to see it and go “oh my, look how bad EU/China are No, we do not. You've been lied to. You should go back to whoever told you that, ask them why, and ask them not to do it again.
  - blackcatsec 8mo ago
    I mean there are an increasing number of states that are requiring age gating for pornography access for sites like PornHub. It's only a matter of time before that age gating expands to non-pornographic entities, which is the ultimate goal of the plan.
    - CamperBob2 8mo ago
      Unfortunately you're probably not wrong, but the fact remains, none of this is happening at a national level. Yet.
      - bdangubic 8mo ago
        shit is and has been happening at the national level for a while. gave you an example you can take for a spin (would not advise you do though)
        CamperBob2 8mo ago
        If you're not in the US, you probably don't understand how our system of federalism works. We have 50 different states, some of which are basically run by the Christian equivalent of the Taliban or the Shiite mullahs of Iran. These state governments often come up with goofy, performative laws such as age verification that are normally set aside by higher courts as First Amendment violations. I say "normally" because the same religious factions are rapidly expanding their dominance over those very courts. Absolutely no historical freedoms can be taken for granted in the US right now. Nevertheless, the fact is, there is no national Internet censorship regime including age verification. No such laws are currently under consideration at the national level. (Yes, you can be prosecuted for downloading or distributing child pornography, but that is not an Internet-specific issue, and there is no other country I'm aware of where such laws are not also on the books.) Edit: if you are willing to move the goalposts that far, there is probably no way to convince you that the facts are as stated. Nevertheless... those are the facts. For further reading, look up the term "prior restraint." That's what's actually different in the US versus other countries that use technical means to enforce legal restrictions on Internet speech.
        zdragnar 8mo ago
        What are you smoking? Access to porn has been legally restricted in every state to 18+ for decades. Adding the Internet only made things easier because nobody enforced it the same way they were already enforcing brick and mortar stores that had the exact same materials. Likewise, there are plenty of rules and regulations around adult content on broadcast airwaves managed by the FCC. Challenging adult content as "free speech" has happened and already settled precedent at the Supreme Court. Yes, individual states are still trying to figure out how to actually best enforce the laws on the books at the Internet level, but there's no pretending that it is just a few states that actually have those laws.
  - bdangubic 8mo ago
    no one told me silly :)
- AnthonyMouse 8mo ago
  > try to get some coverage from gaza or west bank and/or post something slightly critical of israel and see how that works out for you. On a US ISP aljazeera.com loads right up, as does The Guardian and RT.
potatototoo99 8mo ago
No it isn't. For example in my EU country I can see the list of all websites blocked, and all of them are for piracy/copyright infringement and illegal betting (legal betting is allowed, but must register and pay taxes). That and rt.com. I can also say/post whatever I want in social media except stalk and harass individual people. There is no "censorship" at all compared to virtually anywhere else in the world, US included.
- CamperBob2 8mo ago
  That's normalization.
- kvemkon 8mo ago
  > That and ... lenta.ru ? (aha, management personnel has been replaced 2014 [1]) [1] https://t.me/systemasystema/89 https://t.me/systemasystema/89 [RU]
- SanjayMehta 8mo ago
  Blocking RT is not censorship? Nor is sanctioning your own journalists? Or a former intelligence agent, a Swiss national who worked for NATO, and now lives in Belgium? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46969722 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46969722
  - goobatrooba 8mo ago
    You link to a comment which lists a number of russian-paid propaganda actors spreading lies and hate. They have not been censored by a government but by courts which based on evidence identified breaches of law. It's something very different from censorship.
    - blell 8mo ago
      RT was not censored by any courts of law. It was censored by an unelected executive branch.
      - 8mo ago