22 ms·
The Israeli spyware firm that accidentally just exposed itself
- a2tech 8mo agoTop notch work. I assume the person picture is a test account, but it still shows how deep these companies can get. This surveillance tech is a real problem--it's making everyone unsafe and should be regulated. I know its too convenient and useful for government/big companies so it'll never happen...but it should
- flipped 8mo agoRegulated by whom exactly? Since you can't even read, the spyware is being exclusively used by all govts of the world. Regulation never works, if you need a secure phone use GrapheneOS. There's always a comment for "regulation" by an ignorant HN normie under anything related to surveillance. I feel like it's mostly bots at this point.
- embedding-shape 8mo ago> Regulation never works Woah there cowboy, sure you want such a broad and strong claim? Maybe you've eaten too much asbestos, breathed too much lead-gasoline fumes or otherwise inhaled something strange, because I'm sure there are countless of examples of regulation working just fine. Not to say it isn't without problems, but come on, "never"?
- flipped 8mo agoRegulation never works in the interwebs*
- markus_zhang 8mo ago"Regulated" in reality basically means your messages are not only read by private companies that collect them, intelligence agencies that access them, but also by people sitting in the regulation panels. When officials say regulation they basically mean "I want a piece of action, too, dumbass, otherwise I'm gonna shut you down!".
- SiempreViernes 8mo agoYes, that's exactly how regulation works and is why everyone with a drivers licence are always complaining when the gu the government sent to hold the steering wheel that morning is late. /s
- grishka 8mo agoOr maybe, you know, we should stop writing security-critical software in memory-unsafe languages. Mobile devices not treating their owner as an adversary would also be nice.
- microtonal 8mo agoThat's only part of it. That all security issues would be gone after writing code in a memory-safe language is a fairytale (though it does help a lot). The other parts layered defense, reducing the number of privileged/non-sandboxed applications/processes, not shipping spyware/adware, etc. Only Apple/GrapheneOS and to a slightly lesser extend Google Pixel are good at this. Many phone manufacturers still use the TrustZone TEE on the main CPU (rather than a separate security processor), isolated radios, hardware memory tagging, and dozens of other defense-in-depth features.
- Obscurity4340 8mo agoCould you elaborate more on this?
- lorakamina 8mo agoHow do you defend against supply chain attacks??? The problem is that Israelis and their firms have access to the full chain due to their influence.
- grishka 8mo agoIf you mean the software supply chain, minimize third-party dependencies and carefully review any updates. I mean read and understand code diffs before you bump versions. If you mean the hardware supply chain, has that ever actually happened? I've only ever seen it mentioned as a theoretical possibility so far.
- microtonal 8mo agoThis surveillance tech is a real problem--it's making everyone unsafe and should be regulated. The other thing is that people willingly buy phones full of spyware. E.g. quite many Samsung models have the Israeli AppCloud installed (supposedly to recommend applications): https://www.malwarebytes.com/blog/news/2025/11/budget-samsung-phones-shipped-with-unremovable-spyware-say-researchers https://www.malwarebytes.com/blog/news/2025/11/budget-samsun... Even though AppCloud itself may be for recommendations it apparently mines a lot of data and each such background application, it is another potential attack vector, and I suppose that the Isreali government can compel the company to use their software for different purposes (not sure). In contrast to what some news articles state, some Samsung models sold in Europe also have it and nobody seems to really care about it (nor the persistent Meta services, etc.).
- embedding-shape 8mo ago> Paragon’s founding team not includes the former Israeli PM Ehud Barak, it also includes former Unit 8200 commander Ehud Schneorson, exposing how Israeli intelligence expertise metastisizes into private markets. Interestingly enough, turns out Ehud Barak was close to Epstein as well, frequently mentioned in the "newly" released files. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ehud_Barak#Relationship_with_Jeffrey_Epstein https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ehud_Barak#Relationship_with_J...
- pbiggar 8mo ago[flagged]
- huijzer 8mo agoMeanwhile "Pending Criminal Charges" is still at zero [1]. [1]: https://www.pedoarrestcounter.fun/ https://www.pedoarrestcounter.fun/
- embedding-shape 8mo agoTo be fair, real investigations just started, the US seems to have been trying to cover it up during these years, but efforts in countries where the government hasn't been compromised (at least on the same level) just got started.
- fh9302 8mo agoI would be careful with such allegations. The emails show Ehud Barak first visited the island in 2014, while Virginia claimed the rape happened on the island in 2002.
- embedding-shape 8mo ago> The emails show Ehud Barak first visited the island in 2014 The current DOJ dump seems to not even be half of all the documents they have available, so don't think we can know for sure yet when the first contact was. https://www.justice.gov/epstein/files/DataSet%2010/EFTA01775504.pdf https://www.justice.gov/epstein/files/DataSet%2010/EFTA01775... mentions in 2011 for example a meeting with Barak, so who knows when the "first visit to the island" really was. You might be right, I just don't think we know for sure yet.
- howmayiannoyyou 8mo ago[flagged]
- huijzer 8mo agoPlease don't make this a left vs. right issue. It's a good vs. evil issue.
- meowface 8mo agoMy main concern is that these companies will sell to almost anyone willing to buy. The technology itself is not inherently evil (I do want spyware on, say, Ghislaine Maxwell's phone, were she to be released), but the fact that almost any despot can purchase it and use it to brutally suppress dissent is horrible. As for Israel itself, same kind of thing. Spyware on Sinwar's phone: completely justified. Spyware on journalists' phones because they're accurately recording and reporting genocidal actions: dystopian. And they're likely to do both.
- gzread 8mo agoGP didn't say left or right
- ExoticPearTree 8mo agoKeep your devices always up to date and limit the number of apps you use (lower attack surface). If paranoid, use a different device to access suspicios apps/sites with nothing on it.
- hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm 8mo agoHow do we know it is not rigged with an explosive like the Pagers? Edit: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45763674 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45763674 "Cohen (former head of Mossad) insisted that the publicly recognized success against Hezbollah was merely one element of a far wider, systematic deployment of sophisticated devices worldwide, although notably abscent in the Gaza Strip."
- magicalhippo 8mo agoTake it with you on an international trip or three. Surely those airport scanners will pick it up.
- hparadiz 8mo agoThat's actually a great point. Out of the hundreds of pagers that were out in the wild you'd think one of them went through an airport check at some point and got flagged.
- embedding-shape 8mo agoWhy would it get flagged? Weren't they just slightly modified pagers essentially rigged to overheat, rather than they actually put explosives in them? Besides, if I was in a terrorist cell, had a pager for communicating, and was taking a vacation flight, I think I might leave that pager behind for a week.
- hparadiz 8mo agoLol no. They had actual explosives in them. Small but enough to kill and maim.
- baklavaEmperor 8mo agoWhat stands out to me here is the pipeline. Israel has built an unusually tight feedback loop between military intelligence, private startups, and global markets. When that ecosystem scales internationally, it’s fair to ask whether partners are buying technology or importing unilateral leverage that only benefits Israel here.
- hparadiz 8mo agoWhy is everyone surprised that a country of less than 10 million has a tech sector where everyone effectively knows each other?
- helge9210 8mo agoI would put the upper bound on the population relevant to _the_ tech sector at 28000.
- hparadiz 8mo agoImpressive how effective they are with such a small foot print. The rest of us should be taking notes.
- RobotToaster 8mo agoAmazing what you can achieve with the kind of kompromat Epstein gathered.
- Pay08 8mo agoDo you believe everything else Holocaust deniers[0] say? [0] https://www.semafor.com/newsletter/02/08/2026/semafor-media-reputational-damage?utm_source=nowshare&utm_medium=media&utm_campaign=flagshipnumbered5#g https://www.semafor.com/newsletter/02/08/2026/semafor-media-... (paragraph 5)
- 8mo ago
- hparadiz 8mo agoPretending like this some gotcha is pretty funny. The effectiveness of the software hasn't changed. In fact the targets don't even know it's there.
- deleted 8mo ago[deleted]
- throwaway_fjmr 8mo ago[dead]
- Pay08 8mo ago[flagged]
- Matl 8mo ago90% of startups coming out of Israel seem to be some dodgy 'security' or spyware startups. This in addition to them boasting of having 'field tested' their stuff on Palestinians, which is also why U.S. cops go there for training. I suppose to learn from the 'real experts' how to suppress the masses.
- dietr1ch 8mo agoIsrael is the British colonialism foreign base where the Brits and the US can dodge their own laws while developing their own "defence" hardware, software, tactics, and ideology.
- rainworld 8mo ago> British colonialism So the Palestinians and Arabs thought a hundred years ago. It served them badly. It’s not that US/UK and others don’t get anything out of the relationship, as you note. But the arrows have been mostly pointing the other way for a long time. Trump and his background, as well as Epstein/Mandelson/McSweeney/Labour are just the latest, blatant examples of how this works.
- epolanski 8mo agoMeh, imho it's much simpler: Israel has had insane security needs since it's birth, thus naturally security firms concentrated where there was an immediate market and testing possibility. Which makes the failure of October 7th even more striking. It's insane Israeli leadership hasn't paid for this.
- baq 8mo ago> the failure of October 7th you would be wise to reconsider what it actually was
- lorakamina 8mo agoI think they got tired after doing that Pager supply chain attack and went to celebrate on some private island.
- rwmj 8mo agoIs this company a candidate for being "Jia Tan"?
- halflife 8mo ago> Palestinians have long lived under one of the most extensively documented surveillance regimes in the world. The deployment of facial recognition systems, predictive analytics, and device monitoring technologies in the occupied Palestinian territories are widely documented by human-rights organizations and digital researchers. At the same time Israel has world renowned success of thwarting terrorist plots, and best in class intelligence shared with other countries (like the many, many, terrorist attacks stopped in European capitals thanks to Israeli intelligence). You can choose either surveillance, or terrorism.
- almokhtar 8mo ago[flagged]
- almokhtar 8mo agolet me add that fucker in the picture who invest in this serviallance was raping babies with epstien make sense to me what side to stand with am aginst raping babies and eat them
- almokhtar 8mo agohttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ehud_Barak#Relationship_with_Jeffrey_Epstein https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ehud_Barak#Relationship_with_J...
- lkey 8mo agoWhen you choose build an apartheid, you choose surveillance, because how else would you enforce a top to bottom racial order on the populace? When you end apartheid, you end 'terrorism' (legal and ethical resistance against having your life, land, and water stolen). History shows this to be possible, preferable, and moral.
- mupuff1234 8mo agoHistory has also shown that whenever Jews are in a minority of the population something bad tends to a happen to them. So a two state solution makes much more sense.
- throwaway_fjmr 8mo ago[dead]
- markus_zhang 8mo agoI don't see WeChat, which is weird, considering it has been out for decades and not particularly famous for being secure. Maybe it is rarely used by people in Western countries, I guess. But anyway the Chinese government can conveniently read your WeChat messages. Congratulations to all tech brothers and sisters who bring upon the love of governments to us.
- microtonal 8mo agoThe example is from a Czech citizen, unlikely that they use WeChat (Line neither though).
- markus_zhang 8mo agoYeah my thought, too. I'm also wondering whether they hire in-house engineers or mostly just buy it from some other places. Maybe they also hire people straight out from intelligence?
- mrweasel 8mo agoMaybe it's just me being old, but it generally seems unlikely that 5 or 6 messaging apps. I can understand having both TikTok and Snapchat (plus a number of other social media apps). My take is that this is probably a test account.
- microtonal 8mo agoYeah, it is probably a test account, but a test account that is somewhat plausible. I don't find 5 or 6 messaging apps unlikely and I see people with a lot of them, because there is little perceived cost of installing more and it improves reachability. Like, I have Threema installed, even though none of my contacts use it. But if one does happen to use it in the future, I'm reachable if necessary.
- PlatoIsADisease 8mo agoStuff like that is wild to me. At least in the US, we have internal laws democratically elected that can force things to happen (Epstein transparency act for example). In China, it can be illegal to even talk about changing the status quo. When I see people on the internet saying things like: "Yeah screw the US, we just made a deal with China!" I wonder how oblivious they are to the domestic conditions in China.
- PlatoIsADisease 8mo agoQuestions: Why hasnt this been used for stealing Crypto? Is there evidence Android OS has been compromised? (I know Samsung phones had an issue) Is there any evidence a Fedora, Debian-family, or linux has been compromised?
- bpt3 8mo ago> Why hasnt this been used for stealing Crypto? Because the information obtained is much more valuable than imaginary tokens. > Is there evidence Android OS has been compromised? (I know Samsung phones had an issue) I assume every OS can be compromised by a determined adversary. > Is there any evidence a Fedora, Debian-family, or linux has been compromised? I'm not sure what evidence you would need, but see above.
- PlatoIsADisease 8mo agoAndroid and Linux's source code is available. So its easy to find flaws and report them. Linux has live a long time and hasn't had major security issues. (Sometimes you get a compromised vendor down the chain in a single distro) But also, imaginary tokens are really really valuable. I'm sure there are normal-ish people with ~100-1000 bitcoin, let alone a few of the outspoken people who are bitcoin billionaires.
- bpt3 8mo ago"Valuable" is a relative term, and I am confident that the intelligence gathered using these tools is much more valuable to nations that coins that are primarily used for money laundering and other scams.
- PlatoIsADisease 8mo ago[flagged]
- bpt3 8mo ago
- iririririr 8mo agothis is an Advertisement. those companies have very little technical know how. they are just money movers. they buy zero days and package them in a (likely insecure) dashboard. now with PE and growth demand, they have to advertise something that is hard to advertise. hence these "slip ups" and articles.
- PlatoIsADisease 8mo agoInteresting marketing idea. But yeah I don't think its anything too surprising about buying exploits and packaging them. I think the article is more of a commentary on how these companies can exist in the open, where as a teenage hacker goes to jail for stuff like this.
- iririririr 8mo agoWow. your threshold for a literal crime and imoral behavior is extremely low. I do hope you realizes that is weird and not normal.
- epolanski 8mo agoI've learned from a former college colleague that got into cyber security that Israeli intelligence facial recognition is virtually error free. It has been trained on decades of Palestinians crossing check points, some being Hamas camouflaging with beards, glasses and what not. Also the data it's fed for third party customers is as flawless as it can be: if you ever took an international flight your biometrics are fully recorded and available to virtually every agency in the world. If you're walking in a random mall on the other end of the world, even if you have no phone, you have covered your tracks and you're wearing a hat and glasses, etc, you are going to be recognized by the software if a camera gets even a mediocre shot at you. Compound this with all the information people put online on their own on socials, you're gonna be tracked and recognized, whether you want it or no.
- nick_ 8mo agoIs the Israeli intelligence facial recognition system in the room with us now?
- epolanski 8mo agoOosto, Corsight AI.
- sejje 8mo ago> if you ever took an international flight your biometrics are fully recorded and available to virtually every agency in the world Approximately what year did this start?
- epolanski 8mo agoI have no clue because my first extra EU flight has been in 2022 and I definitely got a full face scan.
- gruez 8mo agoThe part I'm skeptical about is "available to virtually every agency in the world". I think every immigration checkpoint I've been to have some sort of camera setup, but the extent of data sharing is unclear. Is China sharing data with the US? Or US sharing with Canada? US with Germany? etc.
- YeGoblynQueenne 8mo agoIt's really unbelievable how much data most people put online about themselves. "Valentina" has probably shared all the information about here the alleged system dashboard showed. Any interested party would only have to search the open internet (and some walled gardens like Facebook) and aggregate the information found in there. Spy agencies and spyware companies don't have some magickal tech nobody else knows anything about. They take advantage of peoples' careless style of interacting online.
- Pay08 8mo agoI've known people who were manually stalked through just information they posted to the internet. It really doesn't take anything more than a name and a few usernames.
- dikozaken 8mo ago[flagged]
- bigyabai 8mo agoYour account is a politics-only throwaway on a tech journalism website. Be careful throwing "bias" stones from a glass house.
- Rakshith 8mo ago[dead]
- raks619 8mo ago[dead]
- ChrisArchitect 8mo agoPreviously: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46979819 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46979819
- rhier 8mo agoHow are they intercepting Signal?
- gzread 8mo agoThey are attacking the end-point app on your device.