5 ms·

> I didn't know how to learn. I'm not trolling here, but don't you think it's more accurate to say you didn't know how to work?

oz 14y ago
Perhaps...
bennyg 14y ago
Maybe. Understanding metacognition and how best you, yourself, learn can have major strides in your own knowledge accumulation. Sometimes working harder at something isn't always the best solution. Sometimes the problem needs to be flipped on its head.
forrestthewoods 14y ago
I disagree. College is the first time many students have to learn how to teach themselves. I did quite well in a small town high school with minimal effort. Not perfect, but I graduated 11 out of 399. I can probably count the number of times I did any work or studying at home on my fingers. During the day I listened in class, focused on school, and gave forth effort. It's pretty easy when classes move at a snail's pace lest any student get left behind. When I went to college my first physics class kicked me in the face so damn hard and I didn't even see it coming. Lectures moved at blistering pace and entire chapters were covered in just one or two class periods. I remember going into the first big test, thinking I did well, and getting a grade so low the teacher pulled me aside and asked if I should drop it. Holy crap that was embarrassing. After that I realized I needed to learn how to learn. I had to learn how to take the book, break everything down, ask questions when necessary, and master the material without guidance. It was a slow process but my scores got better with every single test to the point I tied for the highest score on the final. You could argue that I had to learn how to work but I don't think that's accurate. I knew how to put in work rate. I was an Eagle scout and played on the high school soccer team. Both required tons of work. Learning how to learn certainly requires work and effort, but I think it's a skill the same as any other.
- tubbzor 14y ago
  I can't speak more to the 'learn how to learn' statement. I have a very similar story (Eagle scout/football and wrestling team) and had good marks in high school. I arrived at college and was destroyed by Calc 2 and having to learn at that pace when in high school I never studied at all. After a rough freshman year I knew I had to change how I work and learn. My dad handed me 'Moon-walking with Einstein' and I found calnewport.com (along with other study blogs) and developed a study plan that I still use (I'm currently a Junior).
nickpinkston 14y ago
I'm similar to the author in that I hated school forever, yada yada, but I feel like there's something between learn and work. I've always been (hubris alert) far more learned than my peers in nearly every subject, but the things that didn't come easily I was weak on - higher math was really the only thing that didn't. I think the main problem wasn't learning per se - I learned whatever I needed to do my technical personal projects with ease (chemistry, programming, electronics, etc.), but what I lacked was something like "how to work" which was really a kind of short-term dedicated focus that math so requires. Higher math is banging your head against a concept until ::pop:: - that's easy! I never banged my head enough - so whatever that is - it's a major problem that we need to overcome. This all goes back to why so many engineering students, like me, dropout of these programs because we have shortcomings in overcoming these initial problems. Schools need to identify this aggressively and provide some kind of scaffold that will allow these students to learn this focus/work type of skill. Also - the baggage the term "work" in our (US) culture makes it a bad item to focus on when improving a system. "Bad work ethic" is often a symptom of these types of problems.
rsaarelm 14y ago
Thought experiment: What would you think a struggling college student would try doing if you told them, "you need to learn how to work"? What about if you said, "you need to learn how to learn"? At least for me, the "work" priming hurts learning, since I do very inefficient work on something I've just started learning.

oz 14y ago

Perhaps...

bennyg 14y ago

Maybe. Understanding metacognition and how best you, yourself, learn can have major strides in your own knowledge accumulation. Sometimes working harder at something isn't always the best solution. Sometimes the problem needs to be flipped on its head.

forrestthewoods 14y ago

I disagree. College is the first time many students have to learn how to teach themselves. I did quite well in a small town high school with minimal effort. Not perfect, but I graduated 11 out of 399. I can probably count the number of times I did any work or studying at home on my fingers. During the day I listened in class, focused on school, and gave forth effort. It's pretty easy when classes move at a snail's pace lest any student get left behind. When I went to college my first physics class kicked me in the face so damn hard and I didn't even see it coming. Lectures moved at blistering pace and entire chapters were covered in just one or two class periods. I remember going into the first big test, thinking I did well, and getting a grade so low the teacher pulled me aside and asked if I should drop it. Holy crap that was embarrassing. After that I realized I needed to learn how to learn. I had to learn how to take the book, break everything down, ask questions when necessary, and master the material without guidance. It was a slow process but my scores got better with every single test to the point I tied for the highest score on the final. You could argue that I had to learn how to work but I don't think that's accurate. I knew how to put in work rate. I was an Eagle scout and played on the high school soccer team. Both required tons of work. Learning how to learn certainly requires work and effort, but I think it's a skill the same as any other.

tubbzor 14y ago
I can't speak more to the 'learn how to learn' statement. I have a very similar story (Eagle scout/football and wrestling team) and had good marks in high school. I arrived at college and was destroyed by Calc 2 and having to learn at that pace when in high school I never studied at all. After a rough freshman year I knew I had to change how I work and learn. My dad handed me 'Moon-walking with Einstein' and I found calnewport.com (along with other study blogs) and developed a study plan that I still use (I'm currently a Junior).

nickpinkston 14y ago

I'm similar to the author in that I hated school forever, yada yada, but I feel like there's something between learn and work. I've always been (hubris alert) far more learned than my peers in nearly every subject, but the things that didn't come easily I was weak on - higher math was really the only thing that didn't. I think the main problem wasn't learning per se - I learned whatever I needed to do my technical personal projects with ease (chemistry, programming, electronics, etc.), but what I lacked was something like "how to work" which was really a kind of short-term dedicated focus that math so requires. Higher math is banging your head against a concept until ::pop:: - that's easy! I never banged my head enough - so whatever that is - it's a major problem that we need to overcome. This all goes back to why so many engineering students, like me, dropout of these programs because we have shortcomings in overcoming these initial problems. Schools need to identify this aggressively and provide some kind of scaffold that will allow these students to learn this focus/work type of skill. Also - the baggage the term "work" in our (US) culture makes it a bad item to focus on when improving a system. "Bad work ethic" is often a symptom of these types of problems.

rsaarelm 14y ago

Thought experiment: What would you think a struggling college student would try doing if you told them, "you need to learn how to work"? What about if you said, "you need to learn how to learn"? At least for me, the "work" priming hurts learning, since I do very inefficient work on something I've just started learning.