3 ms·

I think in atomic families in the US, more and more people are brought up without really interacting with children much once they are a teen and stop being a ch

I think in atomic families in the US, more and more people are brought up without really interacting with children much once they are a teen and stop being a child themselves. What used to be normal teen rights of passage like hanging out with your younger extended family, holding a baby, babysitting the neighbors kids, being a summer camp counselor, helping with youth sports, etc.. are less common. Teens are busy cramming SATs, doing homework, and polishing up their resume for college.

alephnerd 9mo ago
> Teens are busy cramming SATs, doing homework, and polishing up their resume for college So are Israelis. Getting into the best IDF units is much more difficult and stressful than getting into an Ivy - it's both academic and physical. But if you get into those units, you will be set for life financially. Otherwise, your just an infantry grunt who wasted a couple years with no discernible skills and facing a future of (best case) working a dead end job that pays $40k a year in a country with a CoL similar to the Bay Area. This is why immigrating abroad is still somewhat popular amongst non-techie Israelis (Zohran's electronics store [0] still hits somewhat close to home). [0] - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BSdIAajX_sI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BSdIAajX_sI
porridgeraisin 9mo ago
Yes, this is closer to my take: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44098431 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44098431
- steveBK123 9mo ago
  Agreed with your take. The lifestyle choices lead to the costs, and it's sort of a circular problem in the end. My dad's (European immigrant) family lived in one of those multi-generational homes you mentioned, and so there was just far less of this self enforced age segregation you see in atomic families. From when I was young, I'd see my extended family at least every 2-3 weeks or more, every other holiday was hanging out with people from newborn to 90 years old. Babies and elderly were pretty regular fixtures of my regular life. By comparison my mom's side which had been here a few generations, I never really saw kids other than when I was a kid myself. I don't think my wife ever held a baby until she was an aunt in her 30s.
  - porridgeraisin 9mo ago
    Yeah, and it forces kids to need to do "activities" to even see other kids. Makes proper development for kids much more expensive than the essentially free "existing alongside other kids" that happens in the multi-generational home. In many cities in india, there is somewhat of a revival of this setup. What happened was that people weren't able to get homes with their aspirational square footage in the location they want. So what they end up doing these days is taking their family, the wifes family and the kids and buying 2-3 apartments in the same building. It's the closest you get to a multi-gen home. Will be interesting to see if this trend affects TFR. Note that the recent +10% increase in TFR in rich indian states (you would expect a decline) is mostly due to better IVF availability/affordability, not due to any of the reasons I mentioned. > Babies and elderly were pretty regular fixtures of my regular life. Yeah, this exposure also blunts some of the fear&uncertainty that puts people off of having kids.

alephnerd 9mo ago

> Teens are busy cramming SATs, doing homework, and polishing up their resume for college So are Israelis. Getting into the best IDF units is much more difficult and stressful than getting into an Ivy - it's both academic and physical. But if you get into those units, you will be set for life financially. Otherwise, your just an infantry grunt who wasted a couple years with no discernible skills and facing a future of (best case) working a dead end job that pays $40k a year in a country with a CoL similar to the Bay Area. This is why immigrating abroad is still somewhat popular amongst non-techie Israelis (Zohran's electronics store [0] still hits somewhat close to home). [0] - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BSdIAajX_sI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BSdIAajX_sI

porridgeraisin 9mo ago

Yes, this is closer to my take: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44098431 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44098431

steveBK123 9mo ago
Agreed with your take. The lifestyle choices lead to the costs, and it's sort of a circular problem in the end. My dad's (European immigrant) family lived in one of those multi-generational homes you mentioned, and so there was just far less of this self enforced age segregation you see in atomic families. From when I was young, I'd see my extended family at least every 2-3 weeks or more, every other holiday was hanging out with people from newborn to 90 years old. Babies and elderly were pretty regular fixtures of my regular life. By comparison my mom's side which had been here a few generations, I never really saw kids other than when I was a kid myself. I don't think my wife ever held a baby until she was an aunt in her 30s.
- porridgeraisin 9mo ago
  Yeah, and it forces kids to need to do "activities" to even see other kids. Makes proper development for kids much more expensive than the essentially free "existing alongside other kids" that happens in the multi-generational home. In many cities in india, there is somewhat of a revival of this setup. What happened was that people weren't able to get homes with their aspirational square footage in the location they want. So what they end up doing these days is taking their family, the wifes family and the kids and buying 2-3 apartments in the same building. It's the closest you get to a multi-gen home. Will be interesting to see if this trend affects TFR. Note that the recent +10% increase in TFR in rich indian states (you would expect a decline) is mostly due to better IVF availability/affordability, not due to any of the reasons I mentioned. > Babies and elderly were pretty regular fixtures of my regular life. Yeah, this exposure also blunts some of the fear&uncertainty that puts people off of having kids.