6 ms·

Does anybody know how they deal with the smart chips on the credit card? Almost no retailer uses the swipe anymore.

moolcool 14y ago
Almost all cards here have NFC, chip, and swipe
msbarnett 14y ago
They seemingly don't. Which gives the current reader a, what, 2 year lifespan max? They shut swipe-based transactions down entirely at the beginning of 2015, IIRC. My Visa already is far more likely to flag a transaction as suspicious if it isn't chip-authenticated. Between that and the total lack of Interac support, this is honestly a pretty lame offering. It feels like Square has absolutely no awareness of the current state of Canadian payment systems.
- cbhl 14y ago
  Visa debit is the norm in the US, and I have had immense difficulty finding anyone with a working NFC or Chip&PIN terminal at the cash register. Canada is on the cutting edge of payment systems, for all that we have crummy shipping infrastructure.
  - bolotye 14y ago
    Actually, our shipping infrastructure is fine. It's our geography, population density and relatively small population that gets in the way. Square in Canada is good thing, and I'd say potentially far more disruptive than they were even in the US. Having been in a seat where I had to negotiate and deal with almost every payment provider in Canada, and all of them verging on being downright evil IMO, a service that focuses on the customer experience (both merchant and end consumer) will be a fun disruption to watch.
- xxpor 14y ago
  Wait, this is a big deal if swipe is being phased out. Very few us cards have a chip. That will make it impossible for US tourists to use cards in Canada.
  - msbarnett 14y ago
    To clarify slightly: Starting in 2015, if your card has a chip, the bank/credit card company will blanket reject all transactions authenticated by swipe. If you have a card from a Canadian institution, it will be replaced by one with both a chip and magnetic strip by that time (and it probably was years ago already). If your card only has swipe (like US tourists), presumably their institutions will still accept a swipe as valid authentication.
    - jonny_eh 14y ago
      What if you use a Canadian card in the US?
      - msbarnett 14y ago
        They detect that and use swipe-authorization in those cases. But you can, and probably should, use the chip in Europe/Asia/Latin America where chip readers are widespread. The banks have been distributing FAQs with all of these answers for years, btw.
        masklinn 14y ago
        > But you can, and probably should, use the chip in Europe/Asia/Latin America where chip readers are widespread. It's still pretty common to have 2-mode readers there (wehere you can chip or swipe), though they're slowly becoming rarer and I can't remember anybody actually using swipe.
      - run4yourlives 14y ago
        It will be backwards compatible. :-)
- mikeash 14y ago
  They give the reader away for free, and it costs them almost nothing to make it. Who cares if it's only good for a couple of years?
  - jarek 14y ago
    Your environment.
  - msbarnett 14y ago
    If I'm going to use Square for my business, I want to know I'm not going to be changing horses frantically in 24 months when the strip is no longer an option. The problem here is that Square is launching with, for the Canadian market, antiquated, rapidly approaching EOL technology, and given no indications if or when they'll catch up to the standard -- or even that they realize that their offering is substandard here compared to the US. Will they issue a new reader next month? A week before the deadline? Will they just pull out in 24 months? No answers forthcoming. (and that's on top of the other issues, like the vast majority of customers demand debit, and chip card credit cards that get swiped for transactions get declined at very high rates because it's highly correlated with skim fraud)
clarky07 14y ago
seriously? where are you located? I can't think of a place that doesn't use swipe.
- kelvie 14y ago
  Here in Vancouver, practically all retailers use chip and PIN.
  - danudey 14y ago
    But they all support swipe as well, if there's an issue with the chip (or if you put the card in backwards so it can't read the chip, and repeat until it gives up on you). Personally, I'm hoping Square adds a new dongle with tap-to-pay (Paywave/Paypass/Interac Flash), which would be even more convenient.
    - msbarnett 14y ago
      > But they all support swipe as well, if there's an issue with the chip (or if you put the card in backwards so it can't read the chip, and repeat until it gives up on you). For the time being, as a temporary measure while peoples cards are replaced with chip cards. Swipe is being fazed out entirely by 2015. You're already far more likely to get a rejected transaction or trip anti-fraud heuristics if your transaction is not chip-auth'd.
    - rdrake 14y ago
      A lot of retailers I've been to require you to show government issued ID to prove your identity when your chip fails. Some downright refuse to accept your credit card.
- msbarnett 14y ago
  Out of curiosity, where are you located? Edmonton I'd say > 95% of retailers are chip-and-pin. Every other place I've been is about the same. Which given that there's two years until they turn the legacy swipe system off entirely, is about where you'd expect everywhere to be in the transition.

Almost all cards here have NFC, chip, and swipe

They seemingly don't. Which gives the current reader a, what, 2 year lifespan max? They shut swipe-based transactions down entirely at the beginning of 2015, IIRC. My Visa already is far more likely to flag a transaction as suspicious if it isn't chip-authenticated. Between that and the total lack of Interac support, this is honestly a pretty lame offering. It feels like Square has absolutely no awareness of the current state of Canadian payment systems.

cbhl 14y ago
Visa debit is the norm in the US, and I have had immense difficulty finding anyone with a working NFC or Chip&PIN terminal at the cash register. Canada is on the cutting edge of payment systems, for all that we have crummy shipping infrastructure.
- bolotye 14y ago
  Actually, our shipping infrastructure is fine. It's our geography, population density and relatively small population that gets in the way. Square in Canada is good thing, and I'd say potentially far more disruptive than they were even in the US. Having been in a seat where I had to negotiate and deal with almost every payment provider in Canada, and all of them verging on being downright evil IMO, a service that focuses on the customer experience (both merchant and end consumer) will be a fun disruption to watch.
xxpor 14y ago
Wait, this is a big deal if swipe is being phased out. Very few us cards have a chip. That will make it impossible for US tourists to use cards in Canada.
- msbarnett 14y ago
  To clarify slightly: Starting in 2015, if your card has a chip, the bank/credit card company will blanket reject all transactions authenticated by swipe. If you have a card from a Canadian institution, it will be replaced by one with both a chip and magnetic strip by that time (and it probably was years ago already). If your card only has swipe (like US tourists), presumably their institutions will still accept a swipe as valid authentication.
  - jonny_eh 14y ago
    What if you use a Canadian card in the US?
    - msbarnett 14y ago
      They detect that and use swipe-authorization in those cases. But you can, and probably should, use the chip in Europe/Asia/Latin America where chip readers are widespread. The banks have been distributing FAQs with all of these answers for years, btw.
      - masklinn 14y ago
        > But you can, and probably should, use the chip in Europe/Asia/Latin America where chip readers are widespread. It's still pretty common to have 2-mode readers there (wehere you can chip or swipe), though they're slowly becoming rarer and I can't remember anybody actually using swipe.
    - run4yourlives 14y ago
      It will be backwards compatible. :-)
mikeash 14y ago
They give the reader away for free, and it costs them almost nothing to make it. Who cares if it's only good for a couple of years?
- jarek 14y ago
  Your environment.
- msbarnett 14y ago
  If I'm going to use Square for my business, I want to know I'm not going to be changing horses frantically in 24 months when the strip is no longer an option. The problem here is that Square is launching with, for the Canadian market, antiquated, rapidly approaching EOL technology, and given no indications if or when they'll catch up to the standard -- or even that they realize that their offering is substandard here compared to the US. Will they issue a new reader next month? A week before the deadline? Will they just pull out in 24 months? No answers forthcoming. (and that's on top of the other issues, like the vast majority of customers demand debit, and chip card credit cards that get swiped for transactions get declined at very high rates because it's highly correlated with skim fraud)

clarky07 14y ago

seriously? where are you located? I can't think of a place that doesn't use swipe.

kelvie 14y ago
Here in Vancouver, practically all retailers use chip and PIN.
- danudey 14y ago
  But they all support swipe as well, if there's an issue with the chip (or if you put the card in backwards so it can't read the chip, and repeat until it gives up on you). Personally, I'm hoping Square adds a new dongle with tap-to-pay (Paywave/Paypass/Interac Flash), which would be even more convenient.
  - msbarnett 14y ago
    > But they all support swipe as well, if there's an issue with the chip (or if you put the card in backwards so it can't read the chip, and repeat until it gives up on you). For the time being, as a temporary measure while peoples cards are replaced with chip cards. Swipe is being fazed out entirely by 2015. You're already far more likely to get a rejected transaction or trip anti-fraud heuristics if your transaction is not chip-auth'd.
  - rdrake 14y ago
    A lot of retailers I've been to require you to show government issued ID to prove your identity when your chip fails. Some downright refuse to accept your credit card.
msbarnett 14y ago
Out of curiosity, where are you located? Edmonton I'd say > 95% of retailers are chip-and-pin. Every other place I've been is about the same. Which given that there's two years until they turn the legacy swipe system off entirely, is about where you'd expect everywhere to be in the transition.