4 ms·

Agree to disagree here. I see a world where developers need to think about (reasonable) scale from day one, or at least very early. We’ve been seeing this play

Agree to disagree here. I see a world where developers need to think about (reasonable) scale from day one, or at least very early. We’ve been seeing this play out at ClickHouse - the need for purpose-built OLAP is reducing from years to months. Also integration with ClickHouse is few weeks of effort for potentially significantly faster performance for analytics.

hermanzegerman 9mo ago
[flagged]
- saisrirampur 9mo ago
  That wasn’t my intention though to mention my workplace multiple times for the sake of PR. Try to avoid being that, atleast on hn. :)
  - daotoad 9mo ago
    What I really want to know is, is it mighty mighty? And does it let it all hang out?
  - direwolf20 9mo ago
    Unless you have YC funding. Conflicts of interest go brrr! HN doesn't even try to hide it.
    - tomhow 9mo ago
      We do the opposite, in fact [1]. Negative stories about YC-funded companies (or YC itself) are given greater visibility than equivalent stories about non-YC-related entities. When YC-funded companies are featured in Launch HN or Show HN posts, it's clearly denoted in the title or top-text. YC-funded companies don't get preferential treatment in the rankings for any type of post other than Launch HN posts. ClickHouse isn't a YC-funded company. We don't penalize people for mentioning their employer in the comments unless it's blatantly promotional, in which case it breaks the guideline against promotional posting, and such comments should be flagged by the community. [1] https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&query=by%3Adang%20pg%20chair&sort=byDate&type=comment https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que...
bcrosby95 9mo ago
Reasonable scale means... what exactly? Here's my opinion: just use postgres. If you're experienced enough to not when I say that, go for it, the advice isn't for you. If you aren't, I'm probably saving you from yourself. "Reasonable scale" to these people could mean dozens of inserts per second, which is why people talking vagueries around scale is madenning to me. If you aren't going to actually say what that means, you will lead people who don't know better down the wrong path.
strken 9mo ago
I see a world where developers need to think about REASONABLE scale from day one, with all caps and no parentheses. I've sat in on meetings about adding auth rate limiting, using Redis, to an on-premise electron client/Node.js server where the largest installation had 20 concurrent users and the largest foreseeable installation had a few thousand, in which every existing installation had an average server CPU utilisation of less than a percent. Redis should not even be a possibility under those circumstances. It's a ridiculous suggestion based purely on rote whiteboard interview cramming. Stick a token_bucket table in Postgres. I'm also not convinced that thinking about reasonable scale would lead to a different implementation for most other greenfield projects. The nice thing about shoving everything into Postgres is that you nearly always have a clear upgrade path, whereas using Redis right from the start might actually make the system less future-proof by complicating any eventual migration.
- saisrirampur 9mo ago
  Ack, agreed. But there’s a better way to communicate than making blanket statements like “just use Postgres.” For example, you could say “Postgres is the default database,” etc. Don’t get me wrong—I’m a huge huge fan of Postgres. I’ve worked at Postgres companies for a decade, started a Postgres company, and now lead a Postgres service within a company! But I prefer being real rather than doing marketing hype and blanket love.
  - Izkata 9mo ago
    "Just" doesn't solely mean "only", this phrase is using it in the spirit of "just do it" - meaning "stop dawdling around". "Just use postgres" is the snappy phrase you're looking for.
    - saisrirampur 8mo ago
      Ack, makes sense. When making public posts that reach a large audience, it’s better to be clear with the messaging rather than risk it being blurry for even a subset of the audience, especially if that could lead to misguidance and affect their day-to-day work.

hermanzegerman 9mo ago

[flagged]

saisrirampur 9mo ago
That wasn’t my intention though to mention my workplace multiple times for the sake of PR. Try to avoid being that, atleast on hn. :)
- daotoad 9mo ago
  What I really want to know is, is it mighty mighty? And does it let it all hang out?
- direwolf20 9mo ago
  Unless you have YC funding. Conflicts of interest go brrr! HN doesn't even try to hide it.
  - tomhow 9mo ago
    We do the opposite, in fact [1]. Negative stories about YC-funded companies (or YC itself) are given greater visibility than equivalent stories about non-YC-related entities. When YC-funded companies are featured in Launch HN or Show HN posts, it's clearly denoted in the title or top-text. YC-funded companies don't get preferential treatment in the rankings for any type of post other than Launch HN posts. ClickHouse isn't a YC-funded company. We don't penalize people for mentioning their employer in the comments unless it's blatantly promotional, in which case it breaks the guideline against promotional posting, and such comments should be flagged by the community. [1] https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&query=by%3Adang%20pg%20chair&sort=byDate&type=comment https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que...

bcrosby95 9mo ago

Reasonable scale means... what exactly? Here's my opinion: just use postgres. If you're experienced enough to not when I say that, go for it, the advice isn't for you. If you aren't, I'm probably saving you from yourself. "Reasonable scale" to these people could mean dozens of inserts per second, which is why people talking vagueries around scale is madenning to me. If you aren't going to actually say what that means, you will lead people who don't know better down the wrong path.

strken 9mo ago

I see a world where developers need to think about REASONABLE scale from day one, with all caps and no parentheses. I've sat in on meetings about adding auth rate limiting, using Redis, to an on-premise electron client/Node.js server where the largest installation had 20 concurrent users and the largest foreseeable installation had a few thousand, in which every existing installation had an average server CPU utilisation of less than a percent. Redis should not even be a possibility under those circumstances. It's a ridiculous suggestion based purely on rote whiteboard interview cramming. Stick a token_bucket table in Postgres. I'm also not convinced that thinking about reasonable scale would lead to a different implementation for most other greenfield projects. The nice thing about shoving everything into Postgres is that you nearly always have a clear upgrade path, whereas using Redis right from the start might actually make the system less future-proof by complicating any eventual migration.

saisrirampur 9mo ago
Ack, agreed. But there’s a better way to communicate than making blanket statements like “just use Postgres.” For example, you could say “Postgres is the default database,” etc. Don’t get me wrong—I’m a huge huge fan of Postgres. I’ve worked at Postgres companies for a decade, started a Postgres company, and now lead a Postgres service within a company! But I prefer being real rather than doing marketing hype and blanket love.
- Izkata 9mo ago
  "Just" doesn't solely mean "only", this phrase is using it in the spirit of "just do it" - meaning "stop dawdling around". "Just use postgres" is the snappy phrase you're looking for.
  - saisrirampur 8mo ago
    Ack, makes sense. When making public posts that reach a large audience, it’s better to be clear with the messaging rather than risk it being blurry for even a subset of the audience, especially if that could lead to misguidance and affect their day-to-day work.