4 ms·

Real ID is/was needed because every state has different requirements to get one. The whole debate is hilarious, you need one or two extra documents to get Real

by 0x457 9mo ago

Real ID is/was needed because every state has different requirements to get one. The whole debate is hilarious, you need one or two extra documents to get RealID. The exact same amount of time and trips to DMV.

tdeck 9mo ago
The fact that Real ID was introduced when I was in college and has been pushed back every year since shows that we don't actually need it.
- 0x457 9mo ago
  That's because many Americans are against national ID at all cost for some reason. The very same Americans think that immigrants need to have their "I'm legal" folder with them at all times.
  - tdeck 9mo ago
    What are the practical benefits we're supposed to get from the RealID system? All I've ever heard is "national security" which is the excuse for every harmful thing.
    - KptMarchewa 9mo ago
      For example, all those stupid voter debates becomes moot.
      - tdeck 9mo ago
        RealID has nothing to do with voting. Residency and citizenship is already verified when you register to vote. RealID is not a requirement to vote.
    - 0x457 9mo ago
      For started, we stop talking about "Is Real ID worth it" and annual "Real ID for sure will be required next year"
      - tdeck 9mo ago
        Cancelling RealID would have those same benefits.
  - fc417fc802 9mo ago
    Blatant strawman. I'm a concrete counterexample if you insist on having one. The federal government should not have any involvement in routine photo ID. If that makes certain things difficult I see that as a feature, not a bug.
  - mikkupikku 9mo ago
    > The very same Americans think that immigrants ... Only half of the opposition to federal IDs comes from the right wing people who are hand wringing about ""The Mark of the Beast"" while saying that immigrants need to identify themselves. The other half of the opposition to federal IDs comes from the left who insist that federal IDs are a conspiracy to stop poor people from voting. This is a bipartisan issue, but you only acknowledged one half.
username223 9mo ago
I had the option to get a "Real ID" the last time I renewed my driver's license, and did not. I forget which stupid bit of paper gave me trouble, but I had a valid passport (the Mother of All IDs), which was both insufficient to get a "Real ID" and sufficient to fly. It's a joke, a nuisance, and now a revenue source.
- 0x457 9mo ago
  You're not going to believe it, but if you already have a passport - you don't need Real ID (in ideal world). I only got Real ID because I want to have zero questions about my immigration status.
  - nobody9999 9mo ago
    >You're not going to believe it, but if you already have a passport - you don't need Real ID (in ideal world). I only got Real ID because I want to have zero questions about my immigration status. DHS says they don't consider RealID to be reliable "proof" of immigration status[0][1], so you might consider rethinking that strategy. [0] https://www.biometricupdate.com/202601/dhs-agent-tells-court-real-id-cant-be-used-to-confirm-us-citizenship https://www.biometricupdate.com/202601/dhs-agent-tells-court... [1] https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.alsd.76579/gov.uscourts.alsd.76579.44.1.pdf https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.alsd.76...
    - 0x457 9mo ago
      > DHS says they don't consider RealID to be reliable "proof" of immigration status[0][1], so you might consider rethinking that strategy. I did, I became American and now have a US passport. That is just moving of the goal post by current admin.
macintux 9mo ago
A general reminder that every extra obstacle to getting a valid ID (or voting) disproportionately impacts the poor. They often lack the paperwork, the free time, and the money to deal with the extra process involved.
- smelendez 9mo ago
  Absolutely. With Real ID, the biggest pain for a lot of people is proof of residency. Rich people just print out some combination of a bank statement, a pay stub, and a copy of their mortgage or lease or the electric bill, but poor people may not have much of that. Think of someone staying with family and getting paid by a gig economy job to a Cash App card or just working under the table/doing odd jobs. Once you start with less common documents, there seem to be more arcane rules, and the documents poor people do have often don’t quite fit the rules that were basically written around what people middle class and up are likely to have.
  - 0x457 9mo ago
    You need two documents for proof. It's really not that hard. Poor that can't produce these documents probably can't afford a plane ticket either, so how is it a problem? Y'all have some weird ideas about how poor people are incapable of have two pieces of paper that have: 1) their name 2) their address
    - fc417fc802 9mo ago
      Rather you lack perspective on the wider world. It is not uncommon to have an "unofficial" living situation and work under the table. In that scenario which documents would have your name and address on it? Will the DMV accept a purchase order from Amazon? Get real.
      - 0x457 9mo ago
        Even when I worked under the table and was out of status, I always had enough documents to get Real ID (but couldn't due to status). For context, at one point I couldn't even get AB60 license in California because I didn't have a single photo ID that isn't expired, and you just need some photo id and pulse to get AB60. > Will the DMV accept a purchase order from Amazon? DMV accepted my marriage license and bank statement. Bank accepted "I will mail you my card, bring back in sealed envelope". > Rather you lack perspective on the wider world. I don't think so.
tag2103 9mo ago
Major points are also missed. The fee is enabled at the federal law level: 49 U.S.C. § 114 & 49 U.S.C. § 44901

by 0x457 9mo ago

tdeck 9mo ago

The fact that Real ID was introduced when I was in college and has been pushed back every year since shows that we don't actually need it.

0x457 9mo ago
That's because many Americans are against national ID at all cost for some reason. The very same Americans think that immigrants need to have their "I'm legal" folder with them at all times.
- tdeck 9mo ago
  What are the practical benefits we're supposed to get from the RealID system? All I've ever heard is "national security" which is the excuse for every harmful thing.
  - KptMarchewa 9mo ago
    For example, all those stupid voter debates becomes moot.
    - tdeck 9mo ago
      RealID has nothing to do with voting. Residency and citizenship is already verified when you register to vote. RealID is not a requirement to vote.
  - 0x457 9mo ago
    For started, we stop talking about "Is Real ID worth it" and annual "Real ID for sure will be required next year"
    - tdeck 9mo ago
      Cancelling RealID would have those same benefits.
- fc417fc802 9mo ago
  Blatant strawman. I'm a concrete counterexample if you insist on having one. The federal government should not have any involvement in routine photo ID. If that makes certain things difficult I see that as a feature, not a bug.
- mikkupikku 9mo ago
  > The very same Americans think that immigrants ... Only half of the opposition to federal IDs comes from the right wing people who are hand wringing about ""The Mark of the Beast"" while saying that immigrants need to identify themselves. The other half of the opposition to federal IDs comes from the left who insist that federal IDs are a conspiracy to stop poor people from voting. This is a bipartisan issue, but you only acknowledged one half.

username223 9mo ago

I had the option to get a "Real ID" the last time I renewed my driver's license, and did not. I forget which stupid bit of paper gave me trouble, but I had a valid passport (the Mother of All IDs), which was both insufficient to get a "Real ID" and sufficient to fly. It's a joke, a nuisance, and now a revenue source.

0x457 9mo ago
You're not going to believe it, but if you already have a passport - you don't need Real ID (in ideal world). I only got Real ID because I want to have zero questions about my immigration status.
- nobody9999 9mo ago
  >You're not going to believe it, but if you already have a passport - you don't need Real ID (in ideal world). I only got Real ID because I want to have zero questions about my immigration status. DHS says they don't consider RealID to be reliable "proof" of immigration status[0][1], so you might consider rethinking that strategy. [0] https://www.biometricupdate.com/202601/dhs-agent-tells-court-real-id-cant-be-used-to-confirm-us-citizenship https://www.biometricupdate.com/202601/dhs-agent-tells-court... [1] https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.alsd.76579/gov.uscourts.alsd.76579.44.1.pdf https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.alsd.76...
  - 0x457 9mo ago
    > DHS says they don't consider RealID to be reliable "proof" of immigration status[0][1], so you might consider rethinking that strategy. I did, I became American and now have a US passport. That is just moving of the goal post by current admin.

macintux 9mo ago

A general reminder that every extra obstacle to getting a valid ID (or voting) disproportionately impacts the poor. They often lack the paperwork, the free time, and the money to deal with the extra process involved.

smelendez 9mo ago
Absolutely. With Real ID, the biggest pain for a lot of people is proof of residency. Rich people just print out some combination of a bank statement, a pay stub, and a copy of their mortgage or lease or the electric bill, but poor people may not have much of that. Think of someone staying with family and getting paid by a gig economy job to a Cash App card or just working under the table/doing odd jobs. Once you start with less common documents, there seem to be more arcane rules, and the documents poor people do have often don’t quite fit the rules that were basically written around what people middle class and up are likely to have.
- 0x457 9mo ago
  You need two documents for proof. It's really not that hard. Poor that can't produce these documents probably can't afford a plane ticket either, so how is it a problem? Y'all have some weird ideas about how poor people are incapable of have two pieces of paper that have: 1) their name 2) their address
  - fc417fc802 9mo ago
    Rather you lack perspective on the wider world. It is not uncommon to have an "unofficial" living situation and work under the table. In that scenario which documents would have your name and address on it? Will the DMV accept a purchase order from Amazon? Get real.
    - 0x457 9mo ago
      Even when I worked under the table and was out of status, I always had enough documents to get Real ID (but couldn't due to status). For context, at one point I couldn't even get AB60 license in California because I didn't have a single photo ID that isn't expired, and you just need some photo id and pulse to get AB60. > Will the DMV accept a purchase order from Amazon? DMV accepted my marriage license and bank statement. Bank accepted "I will mail you my card, bring back in sealed envelope". > Rather you lack perspective on the wider world. I don't think so.

tag2103 9mo ago

Major points are also missed. The fee is enabled at the federal law level: 49 U.S.C. § 114 & 49 U.S.C. § 44901