3 ms·

This is exactly the kind of thing government is for, even though it's missing the other half: subsidies. At the very least buying heat pumps for the next 5 year

This is exactly the kind of thing government is for, even though it's missing the other half: subsidies. At the very least buying heat pumps for the next 5 years should be tax deductible. Even better: a $2000 or similar rebate.

DangitBobby 8mo ago
That's probably exactly what will happen. Energy property - Heat pumps and biomass stoves and boilers Heat pumps that meet or exceed the CEE highest efficiency tier, not including any advanced tier, in effect at the beginning of the year when the property is installed, and biomass stoves and boilers with a thermal efficiency rating of at least 75% qualify for a credit up to $2,000 per year. Costs may include labor for installation. Qualified property includes new: Electric or natural gas heat pumps Electric or natural gas heat pump water heaters Biomass stoves and boilers https://www.irs.gov/credits-deductions/energy-efficient-home-improvement-credit https://www.irs.gov/credits-deductions/energy-efficient-home...
- hnburnsy 8mo ago
  These are credits that only work if you have owe federal taxes and they cannot be carried forward. I've seen estimates that 40-45% of taxpayers owe 0 or close to 0.
  - mrd999 8mo ago
    Eh? If you have income you owe taxes, Uncle Sam just takes it before you even see it
    - direwolf20 8mo ago
      Federal taxes specifically.
    - JoblessWonder 8mo ago
      I think something like 25% of the population reports 0 household income. (I don't understand the implications, it was just surprising when I heard that.)
    - DangitBobby 8mo ago
      They are right, tax credits can't reduce your tax burden below 0 so this incentive does nothing for very low income families.
  - DangitBobby 8mo ago
    You can also get considerable rebates if your state participates in the "Inflation Reduction Act Home Energy Rebate Program", especially if you are low income. My state is still working on rolling it out but hopefully many people who can't use tax credits will be able to take advantage. https://www.tn.gov/environment/program-areas/energy/state-energy-office--seo-/programs-projects/programs-and-projects/inflation-reduction-act/home-energy-rebate-programs.html https://www.tn.gov/environment/program-areas/energy/state-en...
- DangitBobby 8mo ago
  I can't edit it anymore, but I've since learned that Republicans accelerated the expiration on these credits from 2030 to 2025 so they are no longer available. Passed it in the OBBB.
lm28469 8mo ago
> even though it's missing the other half: subsidies It's a double edged sword. In my country everyone bought pellet stoves because of the subsidies, hundreds of companies popped up, now that the subsidies have been phased out, 90% of the companies went down, with their support and warranties of course. The 10% that managed to survive increased their prices, which is easy to do once 90% of your competitors went bust People who thought they'd save money by having the government (their taxes really) pay the bill are waking up 5 years later with expensive maintenance, the first units are starting to fail and need to be replaced but they can't afford it without the 50%+ subsidies. Not to mention that the prices pellets goes up and down faster than your average shitcoin.
rayiner 8mo ago
The subsidies and rebates are a scam. The installers just jack up the prices until they capture the entire value of the rebate.
- amazingman 8mo ago
  This assumes the consumer doesn't know and can't look up the price of the hardware.
  - rayiner 8mo ago
    The cost of installation vastly exceeds the cost of the hardware. And the installers will only warranty hardware you buy from them.
    - amazingman 8mo ago
      Yes I agree that labor costs money.
seiferteric 8mo ago
The problem is, energy use is only one part of the equation. Often times new appliances that are more efficient end up being more prone to breaking due to more complexity and companies trying to cut costs to meet a price point. This leads to people needing to replace there appliances much more often which really makes me question how much energy is actually saved if you include the energy used to produce them...

DangitBobby 8mo ago

That's probably exactly what will happen. Energy property - Heat pumps and biomass stoves and boilers Heat pumps that meet or exceed the CEE highest efficiency tier, not including any advanced tier, in effect at the beginning of the year when the property is installed, and biomass stoves and boilers with a thermal efficiency rating of at least 75% qualify for a credit up to $2,000 per year. Costs may include labor for installation. Qualified property includes new: Electric or natural gas heat pumps Electric or natural gas heat pump water heaters Biomass stoves and boilers https://www.irs.gov/credits-deductions/energy-efficient-home-improvement-credit https://www.irs.gov/credits-deductions/energy-efficient-home...

hnburnsy 8mo ago
These are credits that only work if you have owe federal taxes and they cannot be carried forward. I've seen estimates that 40-45% of taxpayers owe 0 or close to 0.
- mrd999 8mo ago
  Eh? If you have income you owe taxes, Uncle Sam just takes it before you even see it
  - direwolf20 8mo ago
    Federal taxes specifically.
  - JoblessWonder 8mo ago
    I think something like 25% of the population reports 0 household income. (I don't understand the implications, it was just surprising when I heard that.)
  - DangitBobby 8mo ago
    They are right, tax credits can't reduce your tax burden below 0 so this incentive does nothing for very low income families.
- DangitBobby 8mo ago
  You can also get considerable rebates if your state participates in the "Inflation Reduction Act Home Energy Rebate Program", especially if you are low income. My state is still working on rolling it out but hopefully many people who can't use tax credits will be able to take advantage. https://www.tn.gov/environment/program-areas/energy/state-energy-office--seo-/programs-projects/programs-and-projects/inflation-reduction-act/home-energy-rebate-programs.html https://www.tn.gov/environment/program-areas/energy/state-en...
DangitBobby 8mo ago
I can't edit it anymore, but I've since learned that Republicans accelerated the expiration on these credits from 2030 to 2025 so they are no longer available. Passed it in the OBBB.

lm28469 8mo ago

> even though it's missing the other half: subsidies It's a double edged sword. In my country everyone bought pellet stoves because of the subsidies, hundreds of companies popped up, now that the subsidies have been phased out, 90% of the companies went down, with their support and warranties of course. The 10% that managed to survive increased their prices, which is easy to do once 90% of your competitors went bust People who thought they'd save money by having the government (their taxes really) pay the bill are waking up 5 years later with expensive maintenance, the first units are starting to fail and need to be replaced but they can't afford it without the 50%+ subsidies. Not to mention that the prices pellets goes up and down faster than your average shitcoin.

rayiner 8mo ago

The subsidies and rebates are a scam. The installers just jack up the prices until they capture the entire value of the rebate.

amazingman 8mo ago
This assumes the consumer doesn't know and can't look up the price of the hardware.
- rayiner 8mo ago
  The cost of installation vastly exceeds the cost of the hardware. And the installers will only warranty hardware you buy from them.
  - amazingman 8mo ago
    Yes I agree that labor costs money.

seiferteric 8mo ago

The problem is, energy use is only one part of the equation. Often times new appliances that are more efficient end up being more prone to breaking due to more complexity and companies trying to cut costs to meet a price point. This leads to people needing to replace there appliances much more often which really makes me question how much energy is actually saved if you include the energy used to produce them...