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In politics things work differently: you have people that "spat on each other" today and tomorrow they'll act like they are brothers and the spitting never happ

In politics things work differently: you have people that "spat on each other" today and tomorrow they'll act like they are brothers and the spitting never happened.

tzs 8mo ago
What's different this time is that the US has an extensive system of checks and balances that nearly everyone thought would make the current situation impossible, and now we are learning that they aren't nearly as effective as we thought. No matter how reasonable the next few administrations are it is hard to see anyone else trusting the US nearly as much as they did before 2024.
- christophilus 8mo ago
  This has been creeping up on us for some time. For my entire life, the US executive branch has done nothing but accumulate powers and slowly undermine constitutional checks and balances. It’s all fun and games while your guy does it, but it’s inevitable that you’ll get someone in power who you don’t want. That’s the entire point of the checks and balances, but few seemed to care until now. Even if we get a “normal” president after this, I’d bet a lot of money that he/she won’t do anything to reduce the power of the executive.
generic92034 9mo ago
It is a bit more than "spitting on each other" which now is between the USA and its former allies. I seriously doubt that we will just go back to normal the moment there is a US president from the Democratic party. Possibly in some areas of politics and economy, in others (real) trust is more essential.
- ben_w 9mo ago
  I believe at the moment it's still in the "spitting on each other" phase. Had Trump actually invaded Greenland* (and likewise if he does so in the future), that's where the Rubicon gets crossed and there's no going back. I kinda do want it to have passed that point, but not as much as I'm glad he TACOed. * There's other metaphorical Rubicons available, this is just the one most in my mind given I live in the EU
  - Throaway3126 9mo ago
    Trump and his team repeatedly saying they have no problems using force against Greenland and Canada were the red lines and they have already been crossed.
    - ben_w 9mo ago
      I want those actions to have been the red line, and wish my representatives to treat it so if they are not yet. It is important to keep separate what I want to be and what is.
      - Throaway3126 9mo ago
        They are the red lines. There is no going back. The USA is too dangerous to rely on, that's quite clear. People don't quite realize how big a deal "invading" Greenland would have been. That's literally an act of war! What's next, occupying France? Saying that it's at all a possibility is far beyond any red line that the EU thought it would have to deal with. Not only would the rest of the world ditch the USA, but the Democrats themselves would take the opportunity to publically announce that they do not recognize Donald Trump's government.
        ExoticPearTree 8mo ago
        I'll bite. Nothing would have come of it. Ehe EU would have been upset for 3-6 months, then it would have got onboard with the idea that Greenland is now a US territory and that's that. France has a too good of a cuisine to be invaded. I think Germany would be next, they are running their mouth more than they should and they suck at food. Unless the mid-terms change the political majority in the US, the Democrats can wine all they want and recognize or not recognize whoever they want as president. It will not change the actual situation.
        Throaway3126 8mo ago
        Sorry but you're just wrong. This isn't a situation to be upset about. Its war. There's no universe where the USA invasion of Greenland doesn't end in disaster for Trump. There's already been articles in Politico where USA lawmakers admit that there would have been a War Measures Act passed if Trump invaded Greenland. Unlike Venezuela. It would definitely change the political situation if the state governments of California, New York et al stopped recognizing the federal government.
SideburnsOfDoom 9mo ago
> and tomorrow they'll act like they are brothers That's mostly how it was during the last US presidential term. The president even said that "America is back" (1) The fact is, it didn't last. America going away was not a one-off. It happened a second time, worse. The lesson that the USA just is a country that does this from time to time. People in the rest of the world who learn that lesson will prepare for the next time. As another US president accurately said: "Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice ... you can't get fooled again." 1) https://www.war.gov/News/News-Stories/Article/Article/2509091/president-biden-tells-world-america-is-back/ https://www.war.gov/News/News-Stories/Article/Article/250909...
Throaway3126 9mo ago
This isn't politicking though. This is national security. In matters of national security, you take no chances. There's no going back to the relationship the world had with the USA.

In politics things work differently: you have people that "spat on each other" today and tomorrow they'll act like they are brothers and the spitting never happened.

tzs 8mo ago

What's different this time is that the US has an extensive system of checks and balances that nearly everyone thought would make the current situation impossible, and now we are learning that they aren't nearly as effective as we thought. No matter how reasonable the next few administrations are it is hard to see anyone else trusting the US nearly as much as they did before 2024.

christophilus 8mo ago
This has been creeping up on us for some time. For my entire life, the US executive branch has done nothing but accumulate powers and slowly undermine constitutional checks and balances. It’s all fun and games while your guy does it, but it’s inevitable that you’ll get someone in power who you don’t want. That’s the entire point of the checks and balances, but few seemed to care until now. Even if we get a “normal” president after this, I’d bet a lot of money that he/she won’t do anything to reduce the power of the executive.

generic92034 9mo ago

It is a bit more than "spitting on each other" which now is between the USA and its former allies. I seriously doubt that we will just go back to normal the moment there is a US president from the Democratic party. Possibly in some areas of politics and economy, in others (real) trust is more essential.

ben_w 9mo ago
I believe at the moment it's still in the "spitting on each other" phase. Had Trump actually invaded Greenland* (and likewise if he does so in the future), that's where the Rubicon gets crossed and there's no going back. I kinda do want it to have passed that point, but not as much as I'm glad he TACOed. * There's other metaphorical Rubicons available, this is just the one most in my mind given I live in the EU
- Throaway3126 9mo ago
  Trump and his team repeatedly saying they have no problems using force against Greenland and Canada were the red lines and they have already been crossed.
  - ben_w 9mo ago
    I want those actions to have been the red line, and wish my representatives to treat it so if they are not yet. It is important to keep separate what I want to be and what is.
    - Throaway3126 9mo ago
      They are the red lines. There is no going back. The USA is too dangerous to rely on, that's quite clear. People don't quite realize how big a deal "invading" Greenland would have been. That's literally an act of war! What's next, occupying France? Saying that it's at all a possibility is far beyond any red line that the EU thought it would have to deal with. Not only would the rest of the world ditch the USA, but the Democrats themselves would take the opportunity to publically announce that they do not recognize Donald Trump's government.
      - ExoticPearTree 8mo ago
        I'll bite. Nothing would have come of it. Ehe EU would have been upset for 3-6 months, then it would have got onboard with the idea that Greenland is now a US territory and that's that. France has a too good of a cuisine to be invaded. I think Germany would be next, they are running their mouth more than they should and they suck at food. Unless the mid-terms change the political majority in the US, the Democrats can wine all they want and recognize or not recognize whoever they want as president. It will not change the actual situation.
        Throaway3126 8mo ago
        Sorry but you're just wrong. This isn't a situation to be upset about. Its war. There's no universe where the USA invasion of Greenland doesn't end in disaster for Trump. There's already been articles in Politico where USA lawmakers admit that there would have been a War Measures Act passed if Trump invaded Greenland. Unlike Venezuela. It would definitely change the political situation if the state governments of California, New York et al stopped recognizing the federal government.

SideburnsOfDoom 9mo ago

> and tomorrow they'll act like they are brothers That's mostly how it was during the last US presidential term. The president even said that "America is back" (1) The fact is, it didn't last. America going away was not a one-off. It happened a second time, worse. The lesson that the USA just is a country that does this from time to time. People in the rest of the world who learn that lesson will prepare for the next time. As another US president accurately said: "Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice ... you can't get fooled again." 1) https://www.war.gov/News/News-Stories/Article/Article/2509091/president-biden-tells-world-america-is-back/ https://www.war.gov/News/News-Stories/Article/Article/250909...

Throaway3126 9mo ago

This isn't politicking though. This is national security. In matters of national security, you take no chances. There's no going back to the relationship the world had with the USA.