3 ms·

I don't think that's really credible, simply because having sex with a 16-year-old and an 18-year-old isn't going to be significantly different. Additionally, y

I don't think that's really credible, simply because having sex with a 16-year-old and an 18-year-old isn't going to be significantly different. Additionally, you can't reliably tell apart a 16-year-old and an 18-year-old without looking at their identification documents. Being specifically attracted to underage girls that could very well be adults seems vastly weirder than pedophilia, given the obvious alternative of being attracted to adult women who look like teenagers. Looking at the pictures of the women that have been in the media, "conventionally attractive young women, a significant portion of whom were under 18" seems like a far more accurate description than "children". While "children" may be technically correct, someone trying to effectively describe what happened would not choose that word.

mschuster91 9mo ago
> I don't think that's really credible, simply because having sex with a 16-year-old and an 18-year-old isn't going to be significantly different. Additionally, you can't reliably tell apart a 16-year-old and an 18-year-old without looking at their identification documents. Yeah, but we're not just talking about 16 year olds here, we're talking about (way) younger than that. And besides, okay, an 18 year old, for hookups that's fine up to age 25 in my book. 30 is also fine in most of Europe's moral view, in France they'd probably accept 35. But ffs. Gates was around 58 back at the time. That's far too old to hang out with 18 year olds, much less having sex with them.
- JasonADrury 9mo ago
  >Yeah, but we're not just talking about 16 year olds here, we're talking about (way) younger than that. There's been little indication that Epstein was interested in prepubescent girls. There's "as young as 14" in the indictment, still old enough to feasibly be visually indistinguishable from 18 year olds. >And besides, okay, an 18 year old, for hookups that's fine up to age 25 in my book. 30 is also fine in most of Europe's moral view, in France they'd probably accept 35. But ffs. Gates was around 58 back at the time. That's far too old to hang out with 18 year olds, much less having sex with them. There's little doubt that this stuff was weird, and that Epstein was a predator. It's less than obvious that those hanging out with him were any weirder than your average john engaged in buying sex from young attractive women.
  - cherry_tree 9mo ago
    This is a sickening series of messages you chose to write out and submit offering apologia and defense for a group of sex trafficking pedophiles.
    - JasonADrury 9mo ago
      Sure, the topic is sickening and any analytical conversation about it will inherently be sickening.
      - jmye 9mo ago
        “But 14 year olds basically look 18 so it’s ok” is not analytical, it’s apologia. It’s weird how there’s always someone on the internet who really wants to talk about which children it’s actually ok to have sex with.
        JasonADrury 9mo ago
        Why would it be ok? That's a very weird thing to suggest.
        jmye 9mo ago
        You tell me, bud.
        JasonADrury 9mo ago
        You're the one saying it.
        deleted 9mo ago
        [deleted]
    - rkomorn 9mo ago
      This thread is reminding me of Gianmarco Soresi's bit about R Kelly not being a pedophile (technically speaking).
- JumpinJack_Cash 9mo ago
  > > And besides, okay, an 18 year old, for hookups that's fine up to age 25 in my book. 30 is also fine in most of Europe's moral view, in France they'd probably accept 35. But ffs. Gates was around 58 back at the time. That's far too old to hang out with 18 year olds, much less having sex with them. Yeah? Well, you know, that's just like uh, your opinion, man. It's not the law. As a matter of fact there are special provision to lower the age of consent if some conditions apply, although this is not one of them. How about we right all the wrongs that stemmed from violating laws (as there is plenty of work to be done there) before we try to pass personal opinions as laws
  - mschuster91 9mo ago
    > It's not the law. Indeed. But some common fucking sense would have prevented everyone in the Epstein Files to be named in these. Like, it's bad enough if you notice that someone is hooking up with questionably legal women or girls and don't say anything... but it's even worse to actively participate. "I thought they were 18" is not a good defense and people have gone to jail despite claiming that.
austin-cheney 9mo ago
If you are not an adult, according to state law definitions, you are a child. It doesn’t matter what the victims look like. I am not going to make excuses for pedophiles.
- JasonADrury 9mo ago
  While that wasn't a very good explanation to begin with, state laws typically use terms like "minor". "Child" is most often a young human below the age of puberty. Consider how ridiculous you'd sound if you claimed that jurisdictions with an age of consent of 16 allow sex with children.
  - austin-cheney 9mo ago
    Fine. If people want to get worked up about "child" then I can step back to terms like "human trafficking" or "sex slave". Then all ages and individual legal status states are covered.

mschuster91 9mo ago

> I don't think that's really credible, simply because having sex with a 16-year-old and an 18-year-old isn't going to be significantly different. Additionally, you can't reliably tell apart a 16-year-old and an 18-year-old without looking at their identification documents. Yeah, but we're not just talking about 16 year olds here, we're talking about (way) younger than that. And besides, okay, an 18 year old, for hookups that's fine up to age 25 in my book. 30 is also fine in most of Europe's moral view, in France they'd probably accept 35. But ffs. Gates was around 58 back at the time. That's far too old to hang out with 18 year olds, much less having sex with them.

JasonADrury 9mo ago
>Yeah, but we're not just talking about 16 year olds here, we're talking about (way) younger than that. There's been little indication that Epstein was interested in prepubescent girls. There's "as young as 14" in the indictment, still old enough to feasibly be visually indistinguishable from 18 year olds. >And besides, okay, an 18 year old, for hookups that's fine up to age 25 in my book. 30 is also fine in most of Europe's moral view, in France they'd probably accept 35. But ffs. Gates was around 58 back at the time. That's far too old to hang out with 18 year olds, much less having sex with them. There's little doubt that this stuff was weird, and that Epstein was a predator. It's less than obvious that those hanging out with him were any weirder than your average john engaged in buying sex from young attractive women.
- cherry_tree 9mo ago
  This is a sickening series of messages you chose to write out and submit offering apologia and defense for a group of sex trafficking pedophiles.
  - JasonADrury 9mo ago
    Sure, the topic is sickening and any analytical conversation about it will inherently be sickening.
    - jmye 9mo ago
      “But 14 year olds basically look 18 so it’s ok” is not analytical, it’s apologia. It’s weird how there’s always someone on the internet who really wants to talk about which children it’s actually ok to have sex with.
      - JasonADrury 9mo ago
        Why would it be ok? That's a very weird thing to suggest.
        jmye 9mo ago
        You tell me, bud.
        JasonADrury 9mo ago
        You're the one saying it.
        deleted 9mo ago
        [deleted]
  - rkomorn 9mo ago
    This thread is reminding me of Gianmarco Soresi's bit about R Kelly not being a pedophile (technically speaking).
JumpinJack_Cash 9mo ago
> > And besides, okay, an 18 year old, for hookups that's fine up to age 25 in my book. 30 is also fine in most of Europe's moral view, in France they'd probably accept 35. But ffs. Gates was around 58 back at the time. That's far too old to hang out with 18 year olds, much less having sex with them. Yeah? Well, you know, that's just like uh, your opinion, man. It's not the law. As a matter of fact there are special provision to lower the age of consent if some conditions apply, although this is not one of them. How about we right all the wrongs that stemmed from violating laws (as there is plenty of work to be done there) before we try to pass personal opinions as laws
- mschuster91 9mo ago
  > It's not the law. Indeed. But some common fucking sense would have prevented everyone in the Epstein Files to be named in these. Like, it's bad enough if you notice that someone is hooking up with questionably legal women or girls and don't say anything... but it's even worse to actively participate. "I thought they were 18" is not a good defense and people have gone to jail despite claiming that.

austin-cheney 9mo ago

If you are not an adult, according to state law definitions, you are a child. It doesn’t matter what the victims look like. I am not going to make excuses for pedophiles.

JasonADrury 9mo ago
While that wasn't a very good explanation to begin with, state laws typically use terms like "minor". "Child" is most often a young human below the age of puberty. Consider how ridiculous you'd sound if you claimed that jurisdictions with an age of consent of 16 allow sex with children.
- austin-cheney 9mo ago
  Fine. If people want to get worked up about "child" then I can step back to terms like "human trafficking" or "sex slave". Then all ages and individual legal status states are covered.