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From the README: > Security model > The sandbox runs inside WebAssembly with WASI for a minimal syscall interface. WASM provides memory isolation by design—li

From the README: > Security model > The sandbox runs inside WebAssembly with WASI for a minimal syscall interface. WASM provides memory isolation by design—linear memory is bounds-checked, and there's no way to escape to the host address space. The wasmtime runtime we use is built with defense-in-depth and has been formally verified for memory safety. > On top of WASM isolation, every tool call goes through capability validation: [...] > The design draws from capability-based security as implemented in systems like seL4—access is explicitly granted, not implicitly available. Agents don't get ambient authority just because they're running in your process.

westurner 9mo ago
From "Show HN: NPM install a WASM based Linux VM for your agents" re: https://github.com/deepclause/agentvm https://github.com/deepclause/agentvm .. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46686346 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46686346 : >> How to run vscode-container-wasm-gcc-example with c2w, with joelseverin/linux-wasm? > linux-wasm is apparently faster than c2w. container2wasm issue #550: https://github.com/container2wasm/container2wasm/issues/550#issue-3709559065 https://github.com/container2wasm/container2wasm/issues/550#... vscode-container-wasm-gcc-example : https://github.com/ktock/vscode-container-wasm-gcc-example https://github.com/ktock/vscode-container-wasm-gcc-example Cloudflare Runners also run WASM; with workerd: cloudflare/workerd : https://github.com/cloudflare/workerd https://github.com/cloudflare/workerd ... "Cage" implements ARM64 MTE Memory Tagging Extensions support for WASM with LLVM emscripten iirc: - "Cage: Hardware-Accelerated Safe WebAssembly" (2024) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46151170 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46151170 : > [ llvm-memsafe-wasm , wasmtime-mte , ]
- souvik1997 9mo ago
  agentvm looks very cool! They are taking a different approach - full Linux VM emulated in WASM. It's very impressive technically. We differentiate from agentvm by being lightweight (~11 MB Wasm binary, compared to 173 MB for agentvm). Though there is still a lot we can learn from agentvm, thank you for sharing their project.
  - schmuhblaster 9mo ago
    Thank you! When I started working on agentvm my original goal was similar to yours, build a kind of Mingw or Cygwin for WASM. However, I quickly learned that this wouldn't really be feasible with reasonable amounts of time/token spend, mostly due to issues like having to find a way to make fork work, etc. I am no expert for WASM or Linux system programming, but it's been a lot of fun working on this stuff. I hope that the WASI standard and runtimes become more mature, as I feel that WASM sandboxes make a lot of sense in environments where containers are not an option.
    - westurner 9mo ago
      "Rethinking Code Refinement: Learning to Judge Code Efficiency" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42097656 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42097656 eWASM has costed opcodes. The EVM virtual machine has not implemented eWASM. Costed opcodes in WASM for agents could incentivize efficiency re: wasm-bpf and eWASM and the BPF verifier: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42092120 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42092120 ewasm docs > Gas Costs > "Gas costs of individual instructions" https://ewasm.readthedocs.io/en/mkdocs/determining_wasm_gas_costs/ https://ewasm.readthedocs.io/en/mkdocs/determining_wasm_gas_... Browser tabs could show CPU, RAM, GPU utilization; From "The Risks of WebAssembly" (2022) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32765865 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32765865 : > Don't there need to be per- CPU/RAM/GPU quotas per WASM scope/tab? Or is preventing DOS with WASM out of scope for browsers? > IIRC, it's possible to check resource utilization in e.g. a browser Task Manager, but there's no way to do `nice` or `docker --cpu-quota` or `systemd-nspawn --cpu-affinity` to prevent one or more WASM tabs from DOS'ing a workstation with non-costed operations. Presumably workerd supports resource quotas somehow? From 2024 re: Process isolation in browsers : https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40861851 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40861851 : > From "WebGPU is now available on Android" [...] (2022) : >> What are some ideas for UI Visual Affordances to solve for bad UX due to slow browser tabs and extensions? >> UBY: Browsers: Strobe the tab or extension button when it's beyond (configurable) resource usage thresholds >> UBY: Browsers: Vary the {color, size, fill} of the tabs according to their relative resource utilization
    - souvik1997 9mo ago

westurner 9mo ago

From "Show HN: NPM install a WASM based Linux VM for your agents" re: https://github.com/deepclause/agentvm https://github.com/deepclause/agentvm .. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46686346 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46686346 : >> How to run vscode-container-wasm-gcc-example with c2w, with joelseverin/linux-wasm? > linux-wasm is apparently faster than c2w. container2wasm issue #550: https://github.com/container2wasm/container2wasm/issues/550#issue-3709559065 https://github.com/container2wasm/container2wasm/issues/550#... vscode-container-wasm-gcc-example : https://github.com/ktock/vscode-container-wasm-gcc-example https://github.com/ktock/vscode-container-wasm-gcc-example Cloudflare Runners also run WASM; with workerd: cloudflare/workerd : https://github.com/cloudflare/workerd https://github.com/cloudflare/workerd ... "Cage" implements ARM64 MTE Memory Tagging Extensions support for WASM with LLVM emscripten iirc: - "Cage: Hardware-Accelerated Safe WebAssembly" (2024) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46151170 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46151170 : > [ llvm-memsafe-wasm , wasmtime-mte , ]

souvik1997 9mo ago
agentvm looks very cool! They are taking a different approach - full Linux VM emulated in WASM. It's very impressive technically. We differentiate from agentvm by being lightweight (~11 MB Wasm binary, compared to 173 MB for agentvm). Though there is still a lot we can learn from agentvm, thank you for sharing their project.
- schmuhblaster 9mo ago
  Thank you! When I started working on agentvm my original goal was similar to yours, build a kind of Mingw or Cygwin for WASM. However, I quickly learned that this wouldn't really be feasible with reasonable amounts of time/token spend, mostly due to issues like having to find a way to make fork work, etc. I am no expert for WASM or Linux system programming, but it's been a lot of fun working on this stuff. I hope that the WASI standard and runtimes become more mature, as I feel that WASM sandboxes make a lot of sense in environments where containers are not an option.
  - westurner 9mo ago
    "Rethinking Code Refinement: Learning to Judge Code Efficiency" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42097656 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42097656 eWASM has costed opcodes. The EVM virtual machine has not implemented eWASM. Costed opcodes in WASM for agents could incentivize efficiency re: wasm-bpf and eWASM and the BPF verifier: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42092120 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42092120 ewasm docs > Gas Costs > "Gas costs of individual instructions" https://ewasm.readthedocs.io/en/mkdocs/determining_wasm_gas_costs/ https://ewasm.readthedocs.io/en/mkdocs/determining_wasm_gas_... Browser tabs could show CPU, RAM, GPU utilization; From "The Risks of WebAssembly" (2022) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32765865 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32765865 : > Don't there need to be per- CPU/RAM/GPU quotas per WASM scope/tab? Or is preventing DOS with WASM out of scope for browsers? > IIRC, it's possible to check resource utilization in e.g. a browser Task Manager, but there's no way to do `nice` or `docker --cpu-quota` or `systemd-nspawn --cpu-affinity` to prevent one or more WASM tabs from DOS'ing a workstation with non-costed operations. Presumably workerd supports resource quotas somehow? From 2024 re: Process isolation in browsers : https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40861851 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40861851 : > From "WebGPU is now available on Android" [...] (2022) : >> What are some ideas for UI Visual Affordances to solve for bad UX due to slow browser tabs and extensions? >> UBY: Browsers: Strobe the tab or extension button when it's beyond (configurable) resource usage thresholds >> UBY: Browsers: Vary the {color, size, fill} of the tabs according to their relative resource utilization
  - souvik1997 9mo ago