4 ms·

The problem is the monopoly over distribution channels. Regulation needs to force devices to allow A) downloading and using packages & executables from the inte

The problem is the monopoly over distribution channels. Regulation needs to force devices to allow A) downloading and using packages & executables from the internet, and B) any app to download and install other apps. Regulating the fees for one central app store is no solution.

stouset 9mo ago
> downloading and using packages & executables from the internet Oh boy, now my mom can get the full experience of having malware on her phone too!
- samrus 9mo ago
  I hate the classic apple users' "mom" argument. Why are all your moms morons? And why do you want to fuck up the entire mobile landscape to baby proof it for them. Im not gonna ruin my experience with technology because you dont expect your mom to be able to wipe her ass without apple's help
  - linkregister 9mo ago
    There is nothing stopping you from using non-Apple hardware to escape restrictions on downloading unreviewed software.
    - array_key_first 9mo ago
      There are many things impeding you from doing so and you know it, because Apple designed it that way. Walled garden, remember?
  - stouset 9mo ago
    I hate the classic “everyone should be an expert at IT and it’s their fault and they had it coming due to their own ignorance if they make mistakes” argument far more than you hate mine.
- rpdillon 9mo ago
  Let's not put everybody in a cage because we can't stop dumb people from walking off cliffs.
- ulrikrasmussen 9mo ago
  With freedom also comes responsibility, and some innocent people will inevitably shoot themselves in the foot. This is not a strong enough argument for putting everybody else in a cage and letting a duopoly take over virtually all of the distribution of consumer software.
  - ericmay 9mo ago
    It might be a strong argument depending on the negative effects - I don't think it's very clear cut. Also no, neither Apple nor Google have a duopoly on the distribution of all consumer software. Microsoft exists, for example. The other problem consideration here is negotiating power. Today consumers don't have negotiating power over individual developers, but both Apple and Google do. If you complain to Meta about their unwanted tracking, you don't really have many options besides deleting the app (which you should do anyway). But if enough people complain to Apple or Google, they are more inclined to do something and have the power. While it may be a marriage of convenience, it's undeniable that both companies through their app distribution models have also provided benefits to consumers that developers otherwise would have abused - privacy, screen recording, malicious advertising, &c. If you want to argue from the standpoint of pro-consumer action, you have to remember that "developers" are usually pretty awful too and will get away with anything they can, even if it harms their customers. A good balance, instead of ideological purity about one "side" or the other is the smarter move. I tend to come down on the side of the mainstream app stores precisely because those asking for more "freedom" to do as they wish are a tiny minority and are usually more technical. I.e. they can jump through the hoops to install 3rd party app stores and jailbreak their phones today, and since you already can do what you want, maybe it's best to just leave the masses alone since they're very obviously happy with the duopoly.
    - array_key_first 9mo ago
      Apple and Google each respectively have a monopoly in their markets. Only apple approved apps may be installed on an iPhone. Digital goods DO NOT work like physical goods. I can just buy another washing machine. I CANNOT just choose to opt out of using a smartphone. My choices are apple or Google, and even within those choices it's limited by network effects.

stouset 9mo ago

> downloading and using packages & executables from the internet Oh boy, now my mom can get the full experience of having malware on her phone too!

samrus 9mo ago
I hate the classic apple users' "mom" argument. Why are all your moms morons? And why do you want to fuck up the entire mobile landscape to baby proof it for them. Im not gonna ruin my experience with technology because you dont expect your mom to be able to wipe her ass without apple's help
- linkregister 9mo ago
  There is nothing stopping you from using non-Apple hardware to escape restrictions on downloading unreviewed software.
  - array_key_first 9mo ago
    There are many things impeding you from doing so and you know it, because Apple designed it that way. Walled garden, remember?
- stouset 9mo ago
  I hate the classic “everyone should be an expert at IT and it’s their fault and they had it coming due to their own ignorance if they make mistakes” argument far more than you hate mine.
rpdillon 9mo ago
Let's not put everybody in a cage because we can't stop dumb people from walking off cliffs.
ulrikrasmussen 9mo ago
With freedom also comes responsibility, and some innocent people will inevitably shoot themselves in the foot. This is not a strong enough argument for putting everybody else in a cage and letting a duopoly take over virtually all of the distribution of consumer software.
- ericmay 9mo ago
  It might be a strong argument depending on the negative effects - I don't think it's very clear cut. Also no, neither Apple nor Google have a duopoly on the distribution of all consumer software. Microsoft exists, for example. The other problem consideration here is negotiating power. Today consumers don't have negotiating power over individual developers, but both Apple and Google do. If you complain to Meta about their unwanted tracking, you don't really have many options besides deleting the app (which you should do anyway). But if enough people complain to Apple or Google, they are more inclined to do something and have the power. While it may be a marriage of convenience, it's undeniable that both companies through their app distribution models have also provided benefits to consumers that developers otherwise would have abused - privacy, screen recording, malicious advertising, &c. If you want to argue from the standpoint of pro-consumer action, you have to remember that "developers" are usually pretty awful too and will get away with anything they can, even if it harms their customers. A good balance, instead of ideological purity about one "side" or the other is the smarter move. I tend to come down on the side of the mainstream app stores precisely because those asking for more "freedom" to do as they wish are a tiny minority and are usually more technical. I.e. they can jump through the hoops to install 3rd party app stores and jailbreak their phones today, and since you already can do what you want, maybe it's best to just leave the masses alone since they're very obviously happy with the duopoly.
  - array_key_first 9mo ago
    Apple and Google each respectively have a monopoly in their markets. Only apple approved apps may be installed on an iPhone. Digital goods DO NOT work like physical goods. I can just buy another washing machine. I CANNOT just choose to opt out of using a smartphone. My choices are apple or Google, and even within those choices it's limited by network effects.