5 ms·

They're "investigating", presumably with data gleaned from arrests and CIs; you have a right to speech, and a right not to be prosecuted for speech, but a much,

by tptacek 10mo ago

They're "investigating", presumably with data gleaned from arrests and CIs; you have a right to speech, and a right not to be prosecuted for speech, but a much, much narrower right not to be "investigated", collapsing to ~epsilon when the investigation involves data the FBI already has.

andreygrehov 10mo ago
No. According to the latest reports, while searching for ICE vehicles, the protesters are unlawfully scanning license plates, which strongly suggests they are receiving insider help.
- janalsncm 10mo ago
  Can you rule out the much less technically advanced explanation that this information was crowdsourced? And people are simply observing the license plates that are plainly displayed? Frankly I don’t think it should have to come to license plate numbers. In a free society law enforcement should clearly identify themselves as such. We should not need secret police.
  - andreygrehov 10mo ago
    No, I cannot. One of the undercover journalists was in their group for days. > Frankly I don’t think it should have to come to license plate numbers. In a free society law enforcement should clearly identify themselves as such. We should not need secret police. None of that matters _today_, because _today_ the law is different.
    - janalsncm 10mo ago
      What the law is, is a question for lawyers. What the law should be is a question for the people. For example, a lot of people thought it was wrong that federal agents could cover their faces. Sacramento agreed. Now there is a law preventing it.
      - germinalphrase 10mo ago
        That law enforcement is permitted to hide their faces, drive unmarked vehicles, not display name tags, badges, or uniforms is concerning. Anyone can buy a gun, a vest, and a velcro “police” patch. There is very little that marks these agents as official law enforcement. I’m somewhat surprised that none of these agents have been shot entering a home under the mistaken perception by the homeowner that it’s a criminal home invasion.
        janalsncm 10mo ago
        Or alternatively, that criminals haven’t simply claimed to be ICE as an excuse to break into someone’s house.
        andreygrehov 10mo ago
        Where was the outrage when Obama deported 3.1 million people? Why was there no media coverage? Trump has deported 300k and the MSM is turning upside down. Doesn’t make any sense to me.
        dragonwriter 10mo ago
        No one is upset about the number of deportations. No one is complaining about the number of deportations. If you don't listen to what the complaints are about to start with, you can't argue that they are hypocritical.
        andreygrehov 10mo ago
        Ok. What are people upset about, and why are they only upset in one city?
        dragonwriter 10mo ago
        > What are people upset about, A wide array of policy issues related to the targeting and manner of execution of Trump’s mass deportation program, not the number of deportations. Also, a number of specific instances of violence by the federal government during what is (at least notionally) the execution of immigration enforcement. > why are they only upset in one city? People are very clearly not “only upset in one city” https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protests_against_mass_deportation_during_the_second_Trump_administration https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protests_against_mass_deportat... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Ren%C3%A9e_Good_protests https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Ren%C3%A9e_Good_protes... https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2026/jan/24/protests-alex-pretti-killing-federal-agents-ice https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2026/jan/24/protests-ale...
- derbOac 10mo ago
  "Unlawfully scanning license plates"? What does that even mean? Like searching a vehicle database? That's available to all sorts of people, like auto body repair shops. Taking a photo of a license plate? Nothing illegal about that.
  - andreygrehov 10mo ago
    You're confusing 'seeing a license plate' with 'querying restricted databases'. Taking a photo is legal. Running plates through law-enforcement/ALPR systems is not, and auto body shops don't have that access. Real-time identification != observation - it implies unauthorized data access.
    - paganel 10mo ago
      > through law-enforcement/ALPR systems Were they doing that? I haven't read the article, that's why I'm asking.
      - andreygrehov 10mo ago
        https://www.yahoo.com/news/articles/minnesota-signal-gate-did-lt-134523155.html https://www.yahoo.com/news/articles/minnesota-signal-gate-di...
        janalsncm 10mo ago
        I don’t see anything there about querying license plate databases. There is a spreadsheet of donors to some kind of organization.
        andreygrehov 10mo ago
        https://x.com/camhigby/status/2015093635096658172 https://x.com/camhigby/status/2015093635096658172 Also, what is the outrage about? This administration has deported the least number of people compared to all previous administrations. Obama deported 3.1 million people, ten times more than Trump today. Same ICE, same border patrol.
- anigbrowl 10mo ago
  There is nothing unlawful about scanning license plates. You are allowed to photograph them in the same way you are allowed to stand around writing them into a notebook if that activity is your idea of fun. Where do people get these ideas?!
  - tptacek 10mo ago
    I think the idea was that they were getting people associated with Minnesota DPS to do lookups on the plates.
    - germinalphrase 10mo ago
      Why would that even be necessary? They are almost certainly just contributing confirmed ICE plate numbers to an Excel file and then checking against it. Low tech and simple. This “criminal insider” angle is just building a bogeyman.
      - tptacek 10mo ago
        I don't think it's a real thing, I'm just saying that's what the claim is.
janalsncm 10mo ago
Yeah whenever people say “the first amendment is not a freedom from consequences” it is only a freedom from certain consequences (and that freedom only goes as far as the government is willing to protect it). It is a freedom from being convicted. They can still arrest you, you can still spend time in jail, prosecutors can even file charges. A court is supposed to throw those charges out. And in extreme cases you can be convicted and sent to prison for years before SCOTUS rules.
- tptacek 10mo ago
  Nobody has been charged.
  - jakelazaroff 10mo ago
    I think GP is speaking generally, not with regard to this situation specifically; obviously people have been charged for constitutionally-protected speech before.

by tptacek 10mo ago

andreygrehov 10mo ago

No. According to the latest reports, while searching for ICE vehicles, the protesters are unlawfully scanning license plates, which strongly suggests they are receiving insider help.

janalsncm 10mo ago
Can you rule out the much less technically advanced explanation that this information was crowdsourced? And people are simply observing the license plates that are plainly displayed? Frankly I don’t think it should have to come to license plate numbers. In a free society law enforcement should clearly identify themselves as such. We should not need secret police.
- andreygrehov 10mo ago
  No, I cannot. One of the undercover journalists was in their group for days. > Frankly I don’t think it should have to come to license plate numbers. In a free society law enforcement should clearly identify themselves as such. We should not need secret police. None of that matters _today_, because _today_ the law is different.
  - janalsncm 10mo ago
    What the law is, is a question for lawyers. What the law should be is a question for the people. For example, a lot of people thought it was wrong that federal agents could cover their faces. Sacramento agreed. Now there is a law preventing it.
    - germinalphrase 10mo ago
      That law enforcement is permitted to hide their faces, drive unmarked vehicles, not display name tags, badges, or uniforms is concerning. Anyone can buy a gun, a vest, and a velcro “police” patch. There is very little that marks these agents as official law enforcement. I’m somewhat surprised that none of these agents have been shot entering a home under the mistaken perception by the homeowner that it’s a criminal home invasion.
      - janalsncm 10mo ago
        Or alternatively, that criminals haven’t simply claimed to be ICE as an excuse to break into someone’s house.
        andreygrehov 10mo ago
        Where was the outrage when Obama deported 3.1 million people? Why was there no media coverage? Trump has deported 300k and the MSM is turning upside down. Doesn’t make any sense to me.
        dragonwriter 10mo ago
        No one is upset about the number of deportations. No one is complaining about the number of deportations. If you don't listen to what the complaints are about to start with, you can't argue that they are hypocritical.
        andreygrehov 10mo ago
        Ok. What are people upset about, and why are they only upset in one city?
        dragonwriter 10mo ago
        > What are people upset about, A wide array of policy issues related to the targeting and manner of execution of Trump’s mass deportation program, not the number of deportations. Also, a number of specific instances of violence by the federal government during what is (at least notionally) the execution of immigration enforcement. > why are they only upset in one city? People are very clearly not “only upset in one city” https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protests_against_mass_deportation_during_the_second_Trump_administration https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protests_against_mass_deportat... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Ren%C3%A9e_Good_protests https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Ren%C3%A9e_Good_protes... https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2026/jan/24/protests-alex-pretti-killing-federal-agents-ice https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2026/jan/24/protests-ale...
derbOac 10mo ago
"Unlawfully scanning license plates"? What does that even mean? Like searching a vehicle database? That's available to all sorts of people, like auto body repair shops. Taking a photo of a license plate? Nothing illegal about that.
- andreygrehov 10mo ago
  You're confusing 'seeing a license plate' with 'querying restricted databases'. Taking a photo is legal. Running plates through law-enforcement/ALPR systems is not, and auto body shops don't have that access. Real-time identification != observation - it implies unauthorized data access.
  - paganel 10mo ago
    > through law-enforcement/ALPR systems Were they doing that? I haven't read the article, that's why I'm asking.
    - andreygrehov 10mo ago
      https://www.yahoo.com/news/articles/minnesota-signal-gate-did-lt-134523155.html https://www.yahoo.com/news/articles/minnesota-signal-gate-di...
      - janalsncm 10mo ago
        I don’t see anything there about querying license plate databases. There is a spreadsheet of donors to some kind of organization.
        andreygrehov 10mo ago
        https://x.com/camhigby/status/2015093635096658172 https://x.com/camhigby/status/2015093635096658172 Also, what is the outrage about? This administration has deported the least number of people compared to all previous administrations. Obama deported 3.1 million people, ten times more than Trump today. Same ICE, same border patrol.
anigbrowl 10mo ago
There is nothing unlawful about scanning license plates. You are allowed to photograph them in the same way you are allowed to stand around writing them into a notebook if that activity is your idea of fun. Where do people get these ideas?!
- tptacek 10mo ago
  I think the idea was that they were getting people associated with Minnesota DPS to do lookups on the plates.
  - germinalphrase 10mo ago
    Why would that even be necessary? They are almost certainly just contributing confirmed ICE plate numbers to an Excel file and then checking against it. Low tech and simple. This “criminal insider” angle is just building a bogeyman.
    - tptacek 10mo ago
      I don't think it's a real thing, I'm just saying that's what the claim is.

janalsncm 10mo ago

Yeah whenever people say “the first amendment is not a freedom from consequences” it is only a freedom from certain consequences (and that freedom only goes as far as the government is willing to protect it). It is a freedom from being convicted. They can still arrest you, you can still spend time in jail, prosecutors can even file charges. A court is supposed to throw those charges out. And in extreme cases you can be convicted and sent to prison for years before SCOTUS rules.

tptacek 10mo ago
Nobody has been charged.
- jakelazaroff 10mo ago
  I think GP is speaking generally, not with regard to this situation specifically; obviously people have been charged for constitutionally-protected speech before.