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What "imbalance"? It is disingenuous to equate the two political situations as the same: 1. Palestine is a settler-colony of Israel, where the Israeli-right cu
by thisislife2 9mo ago
What "imbalance"? It is disingenuous to equate the two political situations as the same:
1. Palestine is a settler-colony of Israel, where the Israeli-right currently in power is conducting a genocide of Palestinians in Gaza ( https://www.btselem.org/publications/202507_our_genocide https://www.btselem.org/publications/202507_our_genocide ) while continuing to steal their land and deny them basic rights. ( https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/11/6/who-are-israeli-settlers-and-why-do-they-live-on-palestinian-lands https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/11/6/who-are-israeli-set... ). The oppressors and the victims are clear in the Israel - Palestine conflict, and thus it is easy to take a firm moral stand supporting one over the other.
2. What is happening in Iran is either (at best) a power struggle and violent conflict between two groups - the supporters of the Ayatollah and the supporters of the Shah (backed by the west), or (at worst) the start of a civil war. In this case, apart from sympathy for the victims of violence on both sides, it is hard to take a firm political stand for one side because both have a tainted record. (How The CIA Overthrew Iran's Democracy In 4 Days - https://www.npr.org/2019/01/31/690363402/how-the-cia-overthrew-irans-democracy-in-four-days https://www.npr.org/2019/01/31/690363402/how-the-cia-overthr... ). Note that these so-called "revolutionaries" in Sri Lanka, Bangladesh and Nepal too went on a rampage when law and order collapsed there, looting killing and doing senseless destruction ultimately destabilising their whole country. (Now Bangladesh is conducting a farce "democratic" election that deliberately excludes a major political party, the Awami League, because the so called "revolutionaries" fear that they will not be able to defeat them electorally. Something similar happened in Ukraine too). When both sides choose violence to capture power, and are hell bent on excluding the "other" from any future "democratic" setup, who really is the one with the "democratic" values and the real victim?
There is no doubt in my mind that the stand of the west (US / UK) here is totally hypocritical (and morally repugnant) if you praise the opponents of Ayatollah as "freedom fighters", while with the same breath you denounce the Palestinians as "terrorists" for daring to fight their Israeli colonial masters for freedom!
- tptacek 9mo ago1. Palestine is not a settler-colony of Israel. 2. The opposition in Iran is not orchestrated by the west.
- thisislife2 9mo ago1. Israel-Palestine: - History of Settler Colonialism in Palestine - https://www.globalresearch.ca/history-settler-colonialism-palestine/5721303 https://www.globalresearch.ca/history-settler-colonialism-pa... - Israeli Settler Colonialism Is The Obstacle To Peace - https://www.huffpost.com/entry/israeli-settler-colonialism-is-the-obstacle-to-peace_b_58655b30e4b04d7df167d358 https://www.huffpost.com/entry/israeli-settler-colonialism-i... - From Balfour to the Nakba: The settler-colonial experience of Palestine - https://www.middleeasteye.net/opinion/balfour-nakba-settler-colonial-experience-palestine https://www.middleeasteye.net/opinion/balfour-nakba-settler-... 2. Iran-US/UK: - How The CIA Overthrew Iran's Democracy In 4 Days - https://www.npr.org/2019/01/31/690363402/how-the-cia-overthrew-irans-democracy-in-four-days https://www.npr.org/2019/01/31/690363402/how-the-cia-overthr... - They don’t care if you die: How Iran’s protests became a bargaining chip for oil and power - https://www.rt.com/news/631163-irans-protests-oil-and-power/ https://www.rt.com/news/631163-irans-protests-oil-and-power/
- tptacek 9mo agoYou wrote "Palestine is a settler-colony of Israel". Nobody on either side of the conflict believes that. Your response here is a non sequitur.
- thisislife2 9mo agoAre you talking about grammar? Would you prefer that I write Israel is a settler-colonial state?
- tptacek 9mo agoAt least that claim would parse? The issue isn't grammar!
- thisislife2 9mo agoYes, it would and I have already shared some sources for the claim. So your assertions, without any supporting arguments for it, doesn't really sway me. Anyhow, I think we may have reached the limit of this kind of discussion on HN. If you want to explore this topic more, with others, https://politics.stackexchange.com/ https://politics.stackexchange.com/ would be a better place for this topic.
- midlander 9mo ago> The oppressors and the victim are clear in the Israel - Palestine conflict Only if you zoom in and focus on one tiny sliver. If you look at the bigger picture, Israel is surrounded by dozens of countries 100s of times its size, that have all been ethnically cleansed of Jews, many of them in different stages of open or proxy war with Israel, militarily or politically.
- direwolf20 9mo agoIf you look at the even bigger picture, it was Israel that decided to pick fights with all those countries.
- nickff 9mo agoThose countries literally attacked Israel on the day it became a state, and many times thereafter. Israel is definitely not perfect, but their neighbors have been trying to wipe them out for no good reason for a long time.
- direwolf20 9mo agoWhat was the process that made Israel a state? What was there before Israeli state was? Who were the allies of that country?
- nickff 9mo agoI'd suggest the Wikipedia article as a very good starting point: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Israel#Ancient_Israel_and_Judah:_Iron_Age_to_Babylonian_period https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Israel#Ancient_Isra...
- direwolf20 9mo agoDid they have states in 1209 BC? I'm pretty sure the modern Israel state is a modern invention, that just happens to take its name from former states. The modern state of Greece isn't the one from Jesus's time either.