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Yes it's definitely further back than homo sapiens have existed (200k - 300k years), but our ancestor species were known to have used tools and control fire. I
by doctoboggan 9mo ago
Yes it's definitely further back than homo sapiens have existed (200k - 300k years), but our ancestor species were known to have used tools and control fire. I believe we have evidence of tool use going back 1 million years. So this article is referencing the oldest known _wooden_ tools, which are obviously much less likely to be preserved across the ages.
- throwup238 9mo agoWe have evidence of control over fire (but not fire starting) at about 1 million years. Stone tools go even further back, at least 2 million years.
- drakythe 9mo agoWait hang on, would they "control" file by finding natural sources (volcano, lightning strike wildfire, etc.) and then make use of that source for controlled sources of light/heat/etc? I guess I've always thought of "control" of fire including the intentional starting thereof.
- adgjlsfhk1 9mo ago> Wait hang on, would they "control" file by finding natural sources (volcano, lightning strike wildfire, etc.) and then make use of that source for controlled sources of light/heat/etc? Pretty much. Being able to transfer/build a fire is a lot easier than starting one. Fire starting requires bow/flint&steel and a lot of patience. Control basically means using simple torches to transfer fire from one place to another (where the initial source is either lightning/wildfire or embers of a previous fire).
- walkerbrown 9mo agoSome very recently published research (Dec 2025) claims evidence of fire starting among homo neanderthalensis. This would push back fire starting know-how (not only control) from 50k to 400k years ago. Cool stuff! [1] https://www.nhm.ac.uk/press-office/press-releases/groundbreaking-discovery-shows-humans-were-making-fire-350-000-y.html https://www.nhm.ac.uk/press-office/press-releases/groundbrea...
- sophacles 9mo agoThere's pretty strong evidence that the use of fire to cook food is what enabled modern humans, with their short (and relatively fragile) digestive systems and giant energy hungry brains to evolve. Cooking food makes more calories bio-available in food and also reduced the amount of energy the body needs to expend on that food to harvest calories... so there's more energy available for thinking (etc).
- dbcurtis 9mo agoWhen is the first evidence for cooking?
- throwup238 9mo agoThat’s a complicated question. The Wonderwerk Cave in South Africa where we found the first evidence of controlled fire also contained burned plant remains and bones, which could be interpreted as evidence of cooking. There were also burned fish remains found at the Gesher Benot Ya’aqov site in Israel, dated to about 780 kYA, which could also be interpreted as evidence of cooking. By far the strongest evidence is the Qesem Cave in Israel, which had a central hearth and so many burned animal remains that it couldn’t have been accidental. Unfortunately the dating on that is controversial and the error bar is huge at 300 +- 100 kYA (200,000-400,000 years ago).
- dbcurtis 9mo agoThanks! That is much farther back than I thought, even 200 kYA.
- sandworm101 9mo agoAnd cooking kills like 99+% of pathogens, which freed us from much of the parasite/disease stress other animals must live with.
- awesome_dude 9mo agoI had thought (perhaps wrongly) that our brains got a massive "boost" in capacity when our ancestors moved to coastal areas and the diet was dominated by (Omega 3 heavy) shellfish and crustaceans. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/9505798/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/9505798/
- riffraff 9mo agoah, there's a very good movie about this exact topic (not scientifically accurate, one presumes, but still very good) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quest_for_Fire_(film) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quest_for_Fire_(film)
- doxeddaily 9mo agoNot to mention the Iron Maiden song! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SF7cWpBTZ6s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SF7cWpBTZ6s
- sethammons 9mo agoFirehawks spread fire to scare out game; that count? https://wildlife.org/australian-firehawks-use-fire-to-catch-prey/ https://wildlife.org/australian-firehawks-use-fire-to-catch-...
- adgjlsfhk1 9mo agoWe have 3.3 million year old stone tools https://www.nature.com/articles/nature14464 https://www.nature.com/articles/nature14464. They're very simple (even more so than the Oldowan stone tools https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oldowan https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oldowan) and basically just look like rocks, but there is clear evidence of intentional shaping by hominins (somewhere in the fuzzy late Australopthis/early homo transition).
- drakythe 9mo agoThanks for these sources. Archeology definitely is a big known unknown for me, so even getting started reading basic info about this is rough. I appreciate the links and terms.
- sophacles 9mo agoThis youtube channel: https://www.youtube.com/stefanmilo https://www.youtube.com/stefanmilo has a lot of good stuff. I don't know enough to know where he's right or wrong, but provides entry points for to looking more into it. I have gone down a couple rabbit holes based on his videos and while it seems like he's occasionally gotten some facts wrong or misunderstood an argument, I'm pretty confident he's doing a decent job accurately representing the archaeology.
- drakythe 9mo agoAwesome. I've watched plenty of Miniminuteman (Milo Rossi) videos, but his tend to be more pop-sci/debunking outrageous claims and less foundationally educational. I'll check this channel out too.
- Hikikomori 9mo agoDavid Miano and Flint Dibbles channels are also great. Both educational and debunking. https://www.youtube.com/@worldofantiquity https://www.youtube.com/@worldofantiquity https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC27vDmUZpQjuJFFkUz8ujtg https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC27vDmUZpQjuJFFkUz8ujtg