9 ms·

In a way, isn't it what the Americans and even the current administration want? We want a strong Europe who is keen on preserving and developing the glorious mo

In a way, isn't it what the Americans and even the current administration want? We want a strong Europe who is keen on preserving and developing the glorious modern civilization that it created. We want a strong Europe who can build and innovate instead of regulating and fining. In contrast, we certainly don't want see the disastrous joke like Northvolt. We certainly don't want to see the joke that BASF shut down its domestic factories and invested north of 10B in China for state-of-the-art factories. Oh, and we certainly don't want to see a Europe that couldn't defeat Russia and couldn't even out-manufacture Russia, even though Russia's GDP is merely of Guangzhou's.

toomuchtodo 9mo ago
Europe will then redirect the 300B euros it was investing in US treasuries annually to Eurobonds, while redirecting the $300M in purchasing from US companies to EU companies. This is biting the hand that feeds the US. Europe will buy LNG from Canada instead of the US, and continue to purchase imports from China. I agree though that a strong EU is needed, in part to defend against the US, as well as Russia (until the Russian economy reaches failure). CATL is currently building the largest battery factory in Europe in Spain.
- hintymad 9mo ago
  I think they should (in practice there could be something in the middle). Yes, they may have more bickering with the US, but that's just part of the messy diplomatic process. At the end of the day, we want to see strong allies that share a compatible value system with us. I'm actually more optimistic too: a stronger Europe will earn more respect because of their strength. And that respect will lead to more negotiation instead of more bickering.
- tick_tock_tick 9mo ago
  lol hahaha Europe will "say" and maybe in a few decades they might get around to starting some of that. Europe still buys gas from Russia; can't even ween itself off it during a war.
  - toomuchtodo 9mo ago
    > lol hahaha Europe will "say" and maybe in a few decades they might get around to starting some of that. Europe still buys gas from Russia; can't even ween itself off it during a war. EU countries give final approval to Russian gas ban - https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/eu-countries-give-final-approval-russian-gas-ban-2026-01-26/ https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/eu-countries-give-fi... | https://archive.today/wOHeR https://archive.today/wOHeR - January 26th, 2026 > Under the agreement, the EU will halt Russian liquefied natural gas imports by end-2026 and pipeline gas by September 30, 2027. > The law allows that deadline to shift to November 1, 2027, at the latest, if a country is struggling to fill its storage caverns with non-Russian gas ahead of winter. > Russia supplied more than 40% of the EU's gas before 2022. That share dropped to around 13% in 2025, according to the latest available EU data. > The European Commission plans to also propose legislation in the coming months to phase out Russian pipeline oil, and wean countries off Russian nuclear fuel. Ember Energy: The final push for EU Russian gas phase-out - https://ember-energy.org/latest-insights/the-final-push-for-eu-russian-gas-phase-out/ https://ember-energy.org/latest-insights/the-final-push-for-... - March 27th, 2025 Considering Russian's invasion started February 24, 2022, it's fairly impressive Europe has only needed ~5 years to disconnect entirely from Russian gas supplies. Better late than never. They've proven they have the capacity to achieve these objectives in a timely manner, when motivated.
    - tick_tock_tick 9mo ago
      > Considering Russian's invasion started February 24, 2022, You mean 2014. But thank you for proving my point. 2014 - 2027 just a short 15 years (assuming it actually happens I have my doubts).
      - toomuchtodo 9mo ago
        You also previously asserted, without citations, that Canada could not export natural gas to anyone but the US, so forgive me if I don’t take your opinion in high regard as it relates to global energy trade. China and Canada Energy Pact as Canada Aims to Cut Reliance on US - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46640932 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46640932 - January 2026 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45919165 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45919165 ("This line here makes it clear to me you've never really researched any of this. Canada doesn't have the ability to export that to anywhere but the USA and refuses to even consider building another pipeline." -- tick_tock_tick - November 13th, 2025) I'm confident you could make more factually accurate and less emotionally driven comments if you tried. Please consider it. Very little of the information I rely on for my comments is paywall gated, they are web searches away for your consumption and mental model enrichment.
- FpUser 9mo ago
  >"I agree though that a strong EU is needed, in part to defend against the US, as well as Russia (until the Russian economy reaches failure)." So after Russia fails "a strong EU" is no longer needed? Also waiting for Russian economy to fail may prove to be forever and not even desirable. Changing the system of government to one that treats people like it should is much better goal
  - toomuchtodo 9mo ago
    Putin will need to die for Russia to change. Change is not possible in Russia until then. A strong EU is required post Russia. Until then, starve the Russian economy of fossil fuel export revenue (which funds their war efforts). They have liquidated a majority of their gold reserves and have exhausted a majority of their military hardware stockpiles. If we wanted to wrap this up, we’d be bombing their oil and gas export facilities, but it appears we haven’t made it to that milestone yet. Russia Liquidates 71% of Its Gold Reserves to Finance War Effort - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46738690 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46738690 - January 2026
    - microtonal 9mo ago
      If we wanted to wrap this up, we’d be bombing their oil and gas export facilities, but it appears we haven’t made it to that milestone yet. Ukraine seems to be doing that pretty well.
Yoric 9mo ago
Seen from Europe, the current US administration doesn't want a Europe, end of story. Trump 1.0 already tried to convince EU countries to exit the EU. Trump 2.0 keeps insulting the EU, threatening the EU economically and threatening it militarily. To the point where even most of the far right EU candidates who were betting on being the ${EU COUNTRY} Trump are now doing their best to display how they're very much not Trump.
- petre 9mo ago
  Good thing we're not in the US to terrorize us with the ICE.
oblio 9mo ago
> even the current administration want Sure, the US admin wants a strong US military, for example, ideally with 100% US weapons. Etc.
boricj 9mo ago
The current US administration wants a captive Europe. One that buys its defense, energy and technology products from them. One that sells its territory, regulations and know-how to them. Ask the Department of State if they'd like a European-sized French attitude and strategic autonomy.
- johnsmith1840 9mo ago
  Current admin has been on record for years saying the same thing. Warning EU about russia, warning EU about China, warning them about not innovating. I don't know if this was planned internally but it seems the way they figured out how to get EU to actually do something is to make it seem like big bad trump is going to hurt them. Current admin has gotten more out of EU than 20years of asking nicely. Before: US: "please increase military spending" EU: "no" US: "please do not support our advesaries" EU: "builds nordstream" US: "stop killing innovation" EU: " more regulation" Now: US: "We will invade greenland" EU: "omg we need to invest in greenland and increase its military support, we will send more troops immediately!" US: "we will pull out of nato" EU: "omg we hate US we need to massively increase military spending and industry" US: "our tech companies will not listen to you" EU: "omg big bad america, we should try to make out own" I don't like it but at the same time, it works? Let EU rally against US who cares as long as they actually do something. Simply put absolute best thing for US is a strong EU. China is an advesary that will take the entire US system to challenge if EU can handle the rest then it's a win.
  - alopha 9mo ago
    Something tells me when the 'something' is a major trade deal with China suddenly it'll be 'oh my god how could you'. The US wants a EU vassal, what they're going to get is an EU that realigned itself to be politically and economically equidistant from the US and China.
    - tick_tock_tick 9mo ago
      The whole point is the USA has been complaining that the EU was/is reducing itself to a vassal. No matter what the USA said or did before they didn't seem to care that they had no power anymore because the USA was there to take care of them. The EU can't realign itself with China because that would destroy the last fragile bits of the EU economy that are left. They are already having issues with the excess supply lands on their shores even since the USA started tariffs with China. They can't deal with this long term.
surgical_fire 9mo ago
> In a way, isn't it what the Americans and even the current administration want? We want a strong Europe who is keen on preserving and developing the glorious modern civilization that it created. This is a pretty ridiculous statement. It is clear that the US under current administration is absolutely hostile to EU, and that the US in general is untrustworthy when a good portion of its people see the actions of the current administration as desirable.
m00dy 9mo ago
oh man, I agree with what you are saying but EU is a joke.!
- coredev_ 9mo ago
  Is it really though? We have strong labour laws, consumer laws, antitrust laws, personal information laws and so on because the majority of us want it. We understand that this do not maximize growth, and consider that worth it. In fact, the most of us sees the current US administration as a very big joke.
jb1991 9mo ago
> isn't it what the Americans and even the current administration want? no, I certainly do not read that at all. This is not what the U.S. wants -- a genuinely free EU that has its own economy and source of tech entirely independent of the U.S. That is quite the opposite of what the U.S. wants but it inevitable that it is what the U.S. will get.
phearnot 9mo ago
> even though Russia's GDP is merely of Guangzhou's Am I missing something? [1] lists Guangzhou’s GDP as 435,746 M USD, while [2] lists Russia’s GDP as 2,173,836 M USD. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_top_Chinese_cities_by_GDP https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_top_Chinese_cities_by_... [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(nominal) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(nomi...
- hintymad 9mo ago
  My bad. I meant Guangdong Province
  - FpUser 9mo ago
    Guangdong Province at the moment has about 140,000,000 people. About the same as Russia so it figures. Also it is not the best idea to estimate GDP of Russia in USD and using US criteria.
gtech1 9mo ago
What a joke of a comment. Trump and Musk and Vance explicitly support every anti-EU party in a half-dozen EU countries. Cuz they wanna make EU stronger, durrr.

toomuchtodo 9mo ago

Europe will then redirect the 300B euros it was investing in US treasuries annually to Eurobonds, while redirecting the $300M in purchasing from US companies to EU companies. This is biting the hand that feeds the US. Europe will buy LNG from Canada instead of the US, and continue to purchase imports from China. I agree though that a strong EU is needed, in part to defend against the US, as well as Russia (until the Russian economy reaches failure). CATL is currently building the largest battery factory in Europe in Spain.

hintymad 9mo ago
I think they should (in practice there could be something in the middle). Yes, they may have more bickering with the US, but that's just part of the messy diplomatic process. At the end of the day, we want to see strong allies that share a compatible value system with us. I'm actually more optimistic too: a stronger Europe will earn more respect because of their strength. And that respect will lead to more negotiation instead of more bickering.
tick_tock_tick 9mo ago
lol hahaha Europe will "say" and maybe in a few decades they might get around to starting some of that. Europe still buys gas from Russia; can't even ween itself off it during a war.
- toomuchtodo 9mo ago
  > lol hahaha Europe will "say" and maybe in a few decades they might get around to starting some of that. Europe still buys gas from Russia; can't even ween itself off it during a war. EU countries give final approval to Russian gas ban - https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/eu-countries-give-final-approval-russian-gas-ban-2026-01-26/ https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/eu-countries-give-fi... | https://archive.today/wOHeR https://archive.today/wOHeR - January 26th, 2026 > Under the agreement, the EU will halt Russian liquefied natural gas imports by end-2026 and pipeline gas by September 30, 2027. > The law allows that deadline to shift to November 1, 2027, at the latest, if a country is struggling to fill its storage caverns with non-Russian gas ahead of winter. > Russia supplied more than 40% of the EU's gas before 2022. That share dropped to around 13% in 2025, according to the latest available EU data. > The European Commission plans to also propose legislation in the coming months to phase out Russian pipeline oil, and wean countries off Russian nuclear fuel. Ember Energy: The final push for EU Russian gas phase-out - https://ember-energy.org/latest-insights/the-final-push-for-eu-russian-gas-phase-out/ https://ember-energy.org/latest-insights/the-final-push-for-... - March 27th, 2025 Considering Russian's invasion started February 24, 2022, it's fairly impressive Europe has only needed ~5 years to disconnect entirely from Russian gas supplies. Better late than never. They've proven they have the capacity to achieve these objectives in a timely manner, when motivated.
  - tick_tock_tick 9mo ago
    > Considering Russian's invasion started February 24, 2022, You mean 2014. But thank you for proving my point. 2014 - 2027 just a short 15 years (assuming it actually happens I have my doubts).
    - toomuchtodo 9mo ago
      You also previously asserted, without citations, that Canada could not export natural gas to anyone but the US, so forgive me if I don’t take your opinion in high regard as it relates to global energy trade. China and Canada Energy Pact as Canada Aims to Cut Reliance on US - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46640932 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46640932 - January 2026 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45919165 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45919165 ("This line here makes it clear to me you've never really researched any of this. Canada doesn't have the ability to export that to anywhere but the USA and refuses to even consider building another pipeline." -- tick_tock_tick - November 13th, 2025) I'm confident you could make more factually accurate and less emotionally driven comments if you tried. Please consider it. Very little of the information I rely on for my comments is paywall gated, they are web searches away for your consumption and mental model enrichment.
FpUser 9mo ago
>"I agree though that a strong EU is needed, in part to defend against the US, as well as Russia (until the Russian economy reaches failure)." So after Russia fails "a strong EU" is no longer needed? Also waiting for Russian economy to fail may prove to be forever and not even desirable. Changing the system of government to one that treats people like it should is much better goal
- toomuchtodo 9mo ago
  Putin will need to die for Russia to change. Change is not possible in Russia until then. A strong EU is required post Russia. Until then, starve the Russian economy of fossil fuel export revenue (which funds their war efforts). They have liquidated a majority of their gold reserves and have exhausted a majority of their military hardware stockpiles. If we wanted to wrap this up, we’d be bombing their oil and gas export facilities, but it appears we haven’t made it to that milestone yet. Russia Liquidates 71% of Its Gold Reserves to Finance War Effort - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46738690 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46738690 - January 2026
  - microtonal 9mo ago
    If we wanted to wrap this up, we’d be bombing their oil and gas export facilities, but it appears we haven’t made it to that milestone yet. Ukraine seems to be doing that pretty well.

Yoric 9mo ago

Seen from Europe, the current US administration doesn't want a Europe, end of story. Trump 1.0 already tried to convince EU countries to exit the EU. Trump 2.0 keeps insulting the EU, threatening the EU economically and threatening it militarily. To the point where even most of the far right EU candidates who were betting on being the ${EU COUNTRY} Trump are now doing their best to display how they're very much not Trump.

petre 9mo ago
Good thing we're not in the US to terrorize us with the ICE.

oblio 9mo ago

> even the current administration want Sure, the US admin wants a strong US military, for example, ideally with 100% US weapons. Etc.

boricj 9mo ago

The current US administration wants a captive Europe. One that buys its defense, energy and technology products from them. One that sells its territory, regulations and know-how to them. Ask the Department of State if they'd like a European-sized French attitude and strategic autonomy.

johnsmith1840 9mo ago
Current admin has been on record for years saying the same thing. Warning EU about russia, warning EU about China, warning them about not innovating. I don't know if this was planned internally but it seems the way they figured out how to get EU to actually do something is to make it seem like big bad trump is going to hurt them. Current admin has gotten more out of EU than 20years of asking nicely. Before: US: "please increase military spending" EU: "no" US: "please do not support our advesaries" EU: "builds nordstream" US: "stop killing innovation" EU: " more regulation" Now: US: "We will invade greenland" EU: "omg we need to invest in greenland and increase its military support, we will send more troops immediately!" US: "we will pull out of nato" EU: "omg we hate US we need to massively increase military spending and industry" US: "our tech companies will not listen to you" EU: "omg big bad america, we should try to make out own" I don't like it but at the same time, it works? Let EU rally against US who cares as long as they actually do something. Simply put absolute best thing for US is a strong EU. China is an advesary that will take the entire US system to challenge if EU can handle the rest then it's a win.
- alopha 9mo ago
  Something tells me when the 'something' is a major trade deal with China suddenly it'll be 'oh my god how could you'. The US wants a EU vassal, what they're going to get is an EU that realigned itself to be politically and economically equidistant from the US and China.
  - tick_tock_tick 9mo ago
    The whole point is the USA has been complaining that the EU was/is reducing itself to a vassal. No matter what the USA said or did before they didn't seem to care that they had no power anymore because the USA was there to take care of them. The EU can't realign itself with China because that would destroy the last fragile bits of the EU economy that are left. They are already having issues with the excess supply lands on their shores even since the USA started tariffs with China. They can't deal with this long term.

surgical_fire 9mo ago

> In a way, isn't it what the Americans and even the current administration want? We want a strong Europe who is keen on preserving and developing the glorious modern civilization that it created. This is a pretty ridiculous statement. It is clear that the US under current administration is absolutely hostile to EU, and that the US in general is untrustworthy when a good portion of its people see the actions of the current administration as desirable.

m00dy 9mo ago

oh man, I agree with what you are saying but EU is a joke.!

coredev_ 9mo ago
Is it really though? We have strong labour laws, consumer laws, antitrust laws, personal information laws and so on because the majority of us want it. We understand that this do not maximize growth, and consider that worth it. In fact, the most of us sees the current US administration as a very big joke.

jb1991 9mo ago

> isn't it what the Americans and even the current administration want? no, I certainly do not read that at all. This is not what the U.S. wants -- a genuinely free EU that has its own economy and source of tech entirely independent of the U.S. That is quite the opposite of what the U.S. wants but it inevitable that it is what the U.S. will get.

phearnot 9mo ago

> even though Russia's GDP is merely of Guangzhou's Am I missing something? [1] lists Guangzhou’s GDP as 435,746 M USD, while [2] lists Russia’s GDP as 2,173,836 M USD. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_top_Chinese_cities_by_GDP https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_top_Chinese_cities_by_... [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(nominal) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(nomi...

hintymad 9mo ago
My bad. I meant Guangdong Province
- FpUser 9mo ago
  Guangdong Province at the moment has about 140,000,000 people. About the same as Russia so it figures. Also it is not the best idea to estimate GDP of Russia in USD and using US criteria.

gtech1 9mo ago

What a joke of a comment. Trump and Musk and Vance explicitly support every anti-EU party in a half-dozen EU countries. Cuz they wanna make EU stronger, durrr.