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For me it's not arbitrary. An android device is a general purpose handheld touchscreen computer that happens to be used for music. That means a bunch of things

For me it's not arbitrary. An android device is a general purpose handheld touchscreen computer that happens to be used for music. That means a bunch of things to me: 1. "Touchscreen first" UX 2. Heavier than it needs to be 3. Worse battery life compared to a non-Android device Using a touchscreen in the rain is impossible. Running out of battery sucks. Going for a run with a 240g brick is no fun, it'll pull your pants down to your knees and trip you. Compare the specs: Hiby R1 Dimensions: 86.9 x 60.6 x 14.5 mm Weight: 118g OS: HibyOS Battery: 19 hour play time Price: $159.00 Hiby R4 Dimensions: 129.6 x 68.3 x 18.5 mm Weight: 231g OS: Android 12 Battery: 11 hour play time Price: $249 These are the things matter to me, in addition to the UX, sound quality, Bluetooth support, expandable / removable storage and sane file-based playlists.

testdelacc1 9mo ago
> 240g brick pantsing you Sometimes I wish people from 1995 could read our threads and see the things we’re complaining about.
- Y-bar 9mo ago
  240 grams is twice as heavy as for example an average minidisc player (https://www.minidisc.wiki/equipment/sony/portable/mz-g750 https://www.minidisc.wiki/equipment/sony/portable/mz-g750) which could often weigh less than 100g. The very first cassette Walkman was about 40 grams light: https://www.soundandvision.com/content/flashback-1979-sony-s-iconic-walkman-born https://www.soundandvision.com/content/flashback-1979-sony-s... The Rio MP3 player was 109 grams: https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2016/10/diamond-rio-pmp300-mp3-player-today/ https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2016/10/diamond-rio-pmp300-m... The classic Creative Nomad weighs in at 45g including battery: https://www.crutchfield.com/S-HglCxgxN2we/p_053NX128/Creative-NOMAD-MuVo-NX-128MB.html https://www.crutchfield.com/S-HglCxgxN2we/p_053NX128/Creativ...
  - tass 9mo ago
    Almost certainly a typo, the first Walkman was 390g or 14 ounces (not 1.4oz)
    - Y-bar 9mo ago
      Yes, it seems you are correct. For example this one is 180g including batteries: https://www.1001hifi.info/2025/01/sony-wm-20-1983-worlds-smallest-and.html https://www.1001hifi.info/2025/01/sony-wm-20-1983-worlds-sma... Though I stand by my implied argument that older devices were not as heavy as we might remember them to be. And it is okay to consider 240g a bit too heavy in the context of a digital music player with no need for cassettes or mechanical parts.
    - pmyteh 9mo ago
      I read the advert as claiming that the headphones for that Walkman are 1.4oz, which seems plausible (they're a very flimsy design).
  - Aurornis 9mo ago
    > 240 grams is twice as heavy as for example an average minidisc player (https://www.minidisc.wiki/equipment/sony/portable/mz-g750 https://www.minidisc.wiki/equipment/sony/portable/mz-g750) which could often weigh less than 100g. The parent comment chose an unusually large DAP with a big screen to compare to. It’s not really a fair comparison. Also the weights of old devices are usually listed without batteries, which could increase the overall weight by 50% or more. I had a minidisc player a long time ago. It was a quality one, but it wasn’t the lightest or more robust thing to carry around.
    - Y-bar 9mo ago
      You see that I used the weights including batteries for all but the minidisc player which is specced at 144g including those, right?
- raffraffraff 9mo ago
  Well, I had something like this back in the late 90s (can't recall the year exactly) https://walkman.land/aiwa/hs-px297 https://walkman.land/aiwa/hs-px297 Battery: 1AA gets 30h Dimensions: 111.4 x 29.1 x 80.7 mm Weight: 132g Ok, so you were limited to 90 minute tapes with slow seek. But aside from that compare it to the specs I posted for the android vs non-android mp3 players. Remember, this cassette player has some seriously impressive clockwork inside that case and it's still smaller and much lighter than the android. Also remember you can just buy another AA battery, and keep a few spares in your bag.
  - BobaFloutist 9mo ago
    Ok, and each AA battery you keep in your bag adds another 23 grams, so "a few" (let's say 3) and you're already right back up to 192 grams
    - raffraffraff 9mo ago
      If you're going running with your Walkman I think 30 hours on a single AA would be fine
- raydev 9mo ago
  We live in 2026 now, with expectations that are matched to the current year.
pmontra 9mo ago
My first Android phone was a Samsung Galaxy S2. It weighted two grams less than that Hiby R1. Of course it was much larger, but tiny by today's standards. https://m.gsmarena.com/samsung_i9100_galaxy_s_ii-3621.php https://m.gsmarena.com/samsung_i9100_galaxy_s_ii-3621.php
- medstrom 9mo ago
  I loved the buttons on the Galaxy Spica https://www.gsmarena.com/samsung_i5700_galaxy_spica-pictures-2965.php https://www.gsmarena.com/samsung_i5700_galaxy_spica-pictures... Now that I think about it, going no-buttons might have been a driver towards larger screens. Having at least a few buttons seemed to make it much less necessary.
- raffraffraff 9mo ago
  Never mind mp3 players, I'd love a small phone again also. It's ridiculous that there isn't a single decent android phone
kakacik 9mo ago
Whats wrong with some Nokia brick? Has bluetooth, probably 3.5mm jack too, lasts a week, has more physical buttons than you need for playing mp3s. Costs little
- nehal3m 9mo ago
  I have a few, and for managing and playing music the UX is absolute ass. Fine for dialing a number and occasionally switching to silent mode, but that's about it.
- BobaFloutist 9mo ago
  Does the battery actually last a week while playing music over Bluetooth?
  - jacquesm 9mo ago
    They last so long you forget they need charging.
Aurornis 9mo ago
> For me it's not arbitrary. An android device is a general purpose handheld touchscreen computer that happens to be used for music Android is just an operating system. I’ve developed and shipped Android based devices that have no screen at all. Android and Linux are both used for a wide variety of embedded systems. Saying they’re all general purpose computing devices isn’t true. > Going for a run with a 240g brick is no fun, it'll pull your pants down to your knees and trip you. Then don’t pick the largest device with a big screen? There are many smaller DAPs and phones that run Android. The reason that device is so large isn’t because it runs Android.
- raffraffraff 9mo ago
  Generally, across most DAP manufacturers, the android devices are all of those things that I don't want, and the non-android devices tend to be cheaper, lighter, with better battery life. I don't specifically choose non-android, I specifically chose those other parameters and have simply noticed a pattern. I don't doubt you, but you haven't given any examples and I'm not going to spend my life searching for the exception that proves the rule.
Exes8217 9mo ago
I've got the Hiby R1 and have been pretty pleased with it. The R1 doesn't actually run android but just straight linux. It boots up in about 6-8 seconds and returns to the place you previously were. As for physical controls it's got easy to identify buttons for volume, pause (double click for previous track) and next track that are pretty easy to find in a pocket. No experience with the R4 but seems to have good reviews with the hifi crowd.

testdelacc1 9mo ago

> 240g brick pantsing you Sometimes I wish people from 1995 could read our threads and see the things we’re complaining about.

Y-bar 9mo ago
240 grams is twice as heavy as for example an average minidisc player (https://www.minidisc.wiki/equipment/sony/portable/mz-g750 https://www.minidisc.wiki/equipment/sony/portable/mz-g750) which could often weigh less than 100g. The very first cassette Walkman was about 40 grams light: https://www.soundandvision.com/content/flashback-1979-sony-s-iconic-walkman-born https://www.soundandvision.com/content/flashback-1979-sony-s... The Rio MP3 player was 109 grams: https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2016/10/diamond-rio-pmp300-mp3-player-today/ https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2016/10/diamond-rio-pmp300-m... The classic Creative Nomad weighs in at 45g including battery: https://www.crutchfield.com/S-HglCxgxN2we/p_053NX128/Creative-NOMAD-MuVo-NX-128MB.html https://www.crutchfield.com/S-HglCxgxN2we/p_053NX128/Creativ...
- tass 9mo ago
  Almost certainly a typo, the first Walkman was 390g or 14 ounces (not 1.4oz)
  - Y-bar 9mo ago
    Yes, it seems you are correct. For example this one is 180g including batteries: https://www.1001hifi.info/2025/01/sony-wm-20-1983-worlds-smallest-and.html https://www.1001hifi.info/2025/01/sony-wm-20-1983-worlds-sma... Though I stand by my implied argument that older devices were not as heavy as we might remember them to be. And it is okay to consider 240g a bit too heavy in the context of a digital music player with no need for cassettes or mechanical parts.
  - pmyteh 9mo ago
    I read the advert as claiming that the headphones for that Walkman are 1.4oz, which seems plausible (they're a very flimsy design).
- Aurornis 9mo ago
  > 240 grams is twice as heavy as for example an average minidisc player (https://www.minidisc.wiki/equipment/sony/portable/mz-g750 https://www.minidisc.wiki/equipment/sony/portable/mz-g750) which could often weigh less than 100g. The parent comment chose an unusually large DAP with a big screen to compare to. It’s not really a fair comparison. Also the weights of old devices are usually listed without batteries, which could increase the overall weight by 50% or more. I had a minidisc player a long time ago. It was a quality one, but it wasn’t the lightest or more robust thing to carry around.
  - Y-bar 9mo ago
    You see that I used the weights including batteries for all but the minidisc player which is specced at 144g including those, right?
raffraffraff 9mo ago
Well, I had something like this back in the late 90s (can't recall the year exactly) https://walkman.land/aiwa/hs-px297 https://walkman.land/aiwa/hs-px297 Battery: 1AA gets 30h Dimensions: 111.4 x 29.1 x 80.7 mm Weight: 132g Ok, so you were limited to 90 minute tapes with slow seek. But aside from that compare it to the specs I posted for the android vs non-android mp3 players. Remember, this cassette player has some seriously impressive clockwork inside that case and it's still smaller and much lighter than the android. Also remember you can just buy another AA battery, and keep a few spares in your bag.
- BobaFloutist 9mo ago
  Ok, and each AA battery you keep in your bag adds another 23 grams, so "a few" (let's say 3) and you're already right back up to 192 grams
  - raffraffraff 9mo ago
    If you're going running with your Walkman I think 30 hours on a single AA would be fine
raydev 9mo ago
We live in 2026 now, with expectations that are matched to the current year.

pmontra 9mo ago

My first Android phone was a Samsung Galaxy S2. It weighted two grams less than that Hiby R1. Of course it was much larger, but tiny by today's standards. https://m.gsmarena.com/samsung_i9100_galaxy_s_ii-3621.php https://m.gsmarena.com/samsung_i9100_galaxy_s_ii-3621.php

medstrom 9mo ago
I loved the buttons on the Galaxy Spica https://www.gsmarena.com/samsung_i5700_galaxy_spica-pictures-2965.php https://www.gsmarena.com/samsung_i5700_galaxy_spica-pictures... Now that I think about it, going no-buttons might have been a driver towards larger screens. Having at least a few buttons seemed to make it much less necessary.
raffraffraff 9mo ago
Never mind mp3 players, I'd love a small phone again also. It's ridiculous that there isn't a single decent android phone

kakacik 9mo ago

Whats wrong with some Nokia brick? Has bluetooth, probably 3.5mm jack too, lasts a week, has more physical buttons than you need for playing mp3s. Costs little

nehal3m 9mo ago
I have a few, and for managing and playing music the UX is absolute ass. Fine for dialing a number and occasionally switching to silent mode, but that's about it.
BobaFloutist 9mo ago
Does the battery actually last a week while playing music over Bluetooth?
- jacquesm 9mo ago
  They last so long you forget they need charging.

Aurornis 9mo ago

> For me it's not arbitrary. An android device is a general purpose handheld touchscreen computer that happens to be used for music Android is just an operating system. I’ve developed and shipped Android based devices that have no screen at all. Android and Linux are both used for a wide variety of embedded systems. Saying they’re all general purpose computing devices isn’t true. > Going for a run with a 240g brick is no fun, it'll pull your pants down to your knees and trip you. Then don’t pick the largest device with a big screen? There are many smaller DAPs and phones that run Android. The reason that device is so large isn’t because it runs Android.

raffraffraff 9mo ago
Generally, across most DAP manufacturers, the android devices are all of those things that I don't want, and the non-android devices tend to be cheaper, lighter, with better battery life. I don't specifically choose non-android, I specifically chose those other parameters and have simply noticed a pattern. I don't doubt you, but you haven't given any examples and I'm not going to spend my life searching for the exception that proves the rule.

Exes8217 9mo ago

I've got the Hiby R1 and have been pretty pleased with it. The R1 doesn't actually run android but just straight linux. It boots up in about 6-8 seconds and returns to the place you previously were. As for physical controls it's got easy to identify buttons for volume, pause (double click for previous track) and next track that are pretty easy to find in a pocket. No experience with the R4 but seems to have good reviews with the hifi crowd.