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Almost 78% of farmers voted for Trump [1]. These are the guys that got Trump elected. Polls show that support for President Trump among farmers remains high, ho

Almost 78% of farmers voted for Trump [1]. These are the guys that got Trump elected. Polls show that support for President Trump among farmers remains high, hovering around 50-60%. That means these are the guys that are keeping Trump in power. When support among farmers drops to 20% level GOP legislators will feel emboldened to remove Trump from power. [1] https://www.yahoo.com/news/u-farmers-voted-trump-feeling-210000721.html https://www.yahoo.com/news/u-farmers-voted-trump-feeling-210... [2] https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cjedvwed1xgo https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cjedvwed1xgo

insane_dreamer 9mo ago
It's just shocking to me how certain demographics are so eager to vote against their own interests. I mean, name one thing that Trump has done to help farmers more than he hurt them with the tariffs? (Subsidies they already had, regardless of the party in power.) What are they getting in return for their vote? The safety of knowing that trans athletes are banned and some Guatemalans in far away "liberal" cities have been "gotten rid of"? None of those benefit them in any way. I still can't quite understand.
- lateforwork 9mo ago
  GOP has long pursued a strategy of getting rural whites to vote against their self interest. This is why they play up cultural issues such as trans people using women's bathrooms and such other topics that uneducated people can readily grasp.
  - insane_dreamer 9mo ago
    I suppose they've successfully instilled the fear that "our way of life" will be destroyed if they don't vote for Trump, despite 1) being a lie, and 2) a vote that will make things worse for them. It's amazing how powerful these relatively minor cultural issues can be. It certainly makes for interesting case studies for future political science and sociology university (if the humanities survive).
    - xienze 9mo ago
      > instilled the fear that "our way of life" will be destroyed if they don't vote for Trump, despite 1) being a lie You may find this hard to believe, but there are a lot of people old enough to see how rapidly "our way of life" has gone down the toilet. It's not a myth, it's happening.
      - lateforwork 9mo ago
        Are you talking about manufacturing jobs going away, or something else?
      - insane_dreamer 9mo ago
        in what ways has "our way of life" "gone down the toilet"? yes, the world as a whole has changed, and society with it, but I'm nearly 60 and don't see a "way of life" being "destroyed"
  - Spooky23 9mo ago
    It’s easy to say that. I grew up in a dairy county in upstate ny. Solid democrats. The board room of the local farm bureau had photos of FDR on the wall. The party really abandoned rural voters and farmers. Money in politics didn’t just affect Republicans — the democrats abandoned the traditional party structures and followed the money. There’s no more democratic picnics, etc. I’m not defending the GOP. They’ve embraced evil imo. But people followed their message because nobody else is talking to them.
    - insane_dreamer 9mo ago
      > The party really abandoned rural voters and farmers. Not to defend the Dem party (only the lesser of two evils, at least lately), but in what way? Because farm subsidies seem fairly consistent regardless of which party was in power[0] [0] https://www.ers.usda.gov/topics/farm-economy/farm-commodity-policy/farm-bill-spending https://www.ers.usda.gov/topics/farm-economy/farm-commodity-...
      - Spooky23 9mo ago
        There's literally zero platform coverage for rural issues. The hotbeds of liberal politics weren't NYC and Boston 50 years ago -- it was Iowa and Wisconsin. Subsidies today are mostly about stabilizing a few commodities. Dairy is the best example, it's an industry that scales down just fine with a regulated market. That was thrown away and massive dairy producers have literally destroyed the supply side of the market. 90% of dairy operations in New York have shut down since 1980. I worked on a farm as a teenager in the 90s that has been in continuous operation since the Dutch colonial period in the 1600s. Almost 200 years of that was significant dairy operations. They probably had 50-100 cows in the 1970s, but that business was gone by 1990-1992. Today, the family boards horses to pay their taxes and work for the government. Dairy is important because it supports a large ecosystem of business. Vet practices. Laborers. Dairy processing and cheese making. The remaining producers in New York are usually captive producers for vertically integrated businesses like convenience stores, co-ops or scaled operations in Western NY. All of that is dead, and that pattern repeats everywhere. Even in big agriculture states like say Iowa, the "farmers" are mostly tenants and employees now. All of these Trumper idiots who are going bankrupt will have their land purchased by PE, foreign capital or other funds and will become workers.
  - mlrtime 9mo ago
    Can urban liberals please tell us how to vote? You can come and help our fingers push the buttons. Seriously, do you think this works? Do you think urban people living in poverty vote against their interests as well?
    - lateforwork 9mo ago
      You should read "What's the Matter with Kansas?" by Thomas Frank [1] that discusses this topic at length. Yes, I do think it works: It is possible to persuade people to vote against their material or economic self-interest by inflaming passions around simple, emotionally charged "hot-button" topics that are easy for most voters to understand and react to instinctively. [1] https://www.amazon.com/Whats-Matter-Kansas-Conservatives-America/dp/080507774X https://www.amazon.com/Whats-Matter-Kansas-Conservatives-Ame...
      - mlrtime 9mo ago
        I’ve read Frank and this framing assumes there is an objective definition of self interest usually economic and that other priorities like culture autonomy or distrust of institutions are just manipulation. What stands out is the asymmetry where rural voters are described as being worked while poor urban voters making similar tradeoffs are explained through structure or lived experience. Frank himself later pulled back some of the book’s claims and shifted more blame toward party strategy and elite failure rather than voter pathology. Everyone is influenced by elites and narratives but only some voters are treated as lacking agency when they choose differently.
- seattle_spring 9mo ago
  > It's just shocking to me how certain demographics are so eager to vote against their own interests. Something that's been made very clear over the last few election cycles is that a lot of voters will go against their own interests, as long as it hurts their perceived "enemy" more than themselves.
  - lateforwork 9mo ago
    Right. This article discusses how race plays a central role in the opposition to universal health care policies like Obamacare, particularly focusing on how some of the resistance in the South is due to white populations not wanting Black Americans to receive free care: https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/08/14/magazine/universal-health-care-racism.html https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/08/14/magazine/univ...
    - mlrtime 9mo ago
      I live in a a rural farm land area, the only time I hear racist remarks of any kind is online, usually towards white cis men. Just an anecdote, but IMO progressive liberals are some of the most racist people I've encountered. I have family members who didn't like Obama at all, not one of them would ever comment on color, it was his policies.
      - malshe 9mo ago
        As a brown American who has to carry passport the moment I step outside my house and hope that ICE goons give me the opportunity to show it if detained, I am all ears to hear about your experiences with racism toward white cis males.
        mlrtime 9mo ago
        First, I'm sorry you have to do that, it's not right. You blame your skin color for other problems, conflation.
- bigstrat2003 9mo ago
  > It's just shocking to me how certain demographics are so eager to vote against their own interests. Nobody votes against their own interests. That is something that only stupid caricatures do, not actual people. If it seems that way to you, that should be a very strong signal to reevaluate your understanding of the situation. Most likely, that means either nobody is representing their interests or you have misunderstood what their interests are.
  - lateforwork 9mo ago
    That's like saying nobody ever gets swindled. If you think someone got swindled that should be a strong signal to reevaluate your understanding of how they wanted to spend their money.
  - mlrtime 9mo ago
    You are wasting your time I think. The people here know who the right people to vote for are, anyone who thinks otherwise is voting against their interests. There is only one comment above that says that both rural and urban people do the same thing, it is all boiling down to everyone should be voting one party.

insane_dreamer 9mo ago

It's just shocking to me how certain demographics are so eager to vote against their own interests. I mean, name one thing that Trump has done to help farmers more than he hurt them with the tariffs? (Subsidies they already had, regardless of the party in power.) What are they getting in return for their vote? The safety of knowing that trans athletes are banned and some Guatemalans in far away "liberal" cities have been "gotten rid of"? None of those benefit them in any way. I still can't quite understand.

lateforwork 9mo ago
GOP has long pursued a strategy of getting rural whites to vote against their self interest. This is why they play up cultural issues such as trans people using women's bathrooms and such other topics that uneducated people can readily grasp.
- insane_dreamer 9mo ago
  I suppose they've successfully instilled the fear that "our way of life" will be destroyed if they don't vote for Trump, despite 1) being a lie, and 2) a vote that will make things worse for them. It's amazing how powerful these relatively minor cultural issues can be. It certainly makes for interesting case studies for future political science and sociology university (if the humanities survive).
  - xienze 9mo ago
    > instilled the fear that "our way of life" will be destroyed if they don't vote for Trump, despite 1) being a lie You may find this hard to believe, but there are a lot of people old enough to see how rapidly "our way of life" has gone down the toilet. It's not a myth, it's happening.
    - lateforwork 9mo ago
      Are you talking about manufacturing jobs going away, or something else?
    - insane_dreamer 9mo ago
      in what ways has "our way of life" "gone down the toilet"? yes, the world as a whole has changed, and society with it, but I'm nearly 60 and don't see a "way of life" being "destroyed"
- Spooky23 9mo ago
  It’s easy to say that. I grew up in a dairy county in upstate ny. Solid democrats. The board room of the local farm bureau had photos of FDR on the wall. The party really abandoned rural voters and farmers. Money in politics didn’t just affect Republicans — the democrats abandoned the traditional party structures and followed the money. There’s no more democratic picnics, etc. I’m not defending the GOP. They’ve embraced evil imo. But people followed their message because nobody else is talking to them.
  - insane_dreamer 9mo ago
    > The party really abandoned rural voters and farmers. Not to defend the Dem party (only the lesser of two evils, at least lately), but in what way? Because farm subsidies seem fairly consistent regardless of which party was in power[0] [0] https://www.ers.usda.gov/topics/farm-economy/farm-commodity-policy/farm-bill-spending https://www.ers.usda.gov/topics/farm-economy/farm-commodity-...
    - Spooky23 9mo ago
      There's literally zero platform coverage for rural issues. The hotbeds of liberal politics weren't NYC and Boston 50 years ago -- it was Iowa and Wisconsin. Subsidies today are mostly about stabilizing a few commodities. Dairy is the best example, it's an industry that scales down just fine with a regulated market. That was thrown away and massive dairy producers have literally destroyed the supply side of the market. 90% of dairy operations in New York have shut down since 1980. I worked on a farm as a teenager in the 90s that has been in continuous operation since the Dutch colonial period in the 1600s. Almost 200 years of that was significant dairy operations. They probably had 50-100 cows in the 1970s, but that business was gone by 1990-1992. Today, the family boards horses to pay their taxes and work for the government. Dairy is important because it supports a large ecosystem of business. Vet practices. Laborers. Dairy processing and cheese making. The remaining producers in New York are usually captive producers for vertically integrated businesses like convenience stores, co-ops or scaled operations in Western NY. All of that is dead, and that pattern repeats everywhere. Even in big agriculture states like say Iowa, the "farmers" are mostly tenants and employees now. All of these Trumper idiots who are going bankrupt will have their land purchased by PE, foreign capital or other funds and will become workers.
- mlrtime 9mo ago
  Can urban liberals please tell us how to vote? You can come and help our fingers push the buttons. Seriously, do you think this works? Do you think urban people living in poverty vote against their interests as well?
  - lateforwork 9mo ago
    You should read "What's the Matter with Kansas?" by Thomas Frank [1] that discusses this topic at length. Yes, I do think it works: It is possible to persuade people to vote against their material or economic self-interest by inflaming passions around simple, emotionally charged "hot-button" topics that are easy for most voters to understand and react to instinctively. [1] https://www.amazon.com/Whats-Matter-Kansas-Conservatives-America/dp/080507774X https://www.amazon.com/Whats-Matter-Kansas-Conservatives-Ame...
    - mlrtime 9mo ago
      I’ve read Frank and this framing assumes there is an objective definition of self interest usually economic and that other priorities like culture autonomy or distrust of institutions are just manipulation. What stands out is the asymmetry where rural voters are described as being worked while poor urban voters making similar tradeoffs are explained through structure or lived experience. Frank himself later pulled back some of the book’s claims and shifted more blame toward party strategy and elite failure rather than voter pathology. Everyone is influenced by elites and narratives but only some voters are treated as lacking agency when they choose differently.
seattle_spring 9mo ago
> It's just shocking to me how certain demographics are so eager to vote against their own interests. Something that's been made very clear over the last few election cycles is that a lot of voters will go against their own interests, as long as it hurts their perceived "enemy" more than themselves.
- lateforwork 9mo ago
  Right. This article discusses how race plays a central role in the opposition to universal health care policies like Obamacare, particularly focusing on how some of the resistance in the South is due to white populations not wanting Black Americans to receive free care: https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/08/14/magazine/universal-health-care-racism.html https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/08/14/magazine/univ...
  - mlrtime 9mo ago
    I live in a a rural farm land area, the only time I hear racist remarks of any kind is online, usually towards white cis men. Just an anecdote, but IMO progressive liberals are some of the most racist people I've encountered. I have family members who didn't like Obama at all, not one of them would ever comment on color, it was his policies.
    - malshe 9mo ago
      As a brown American who has to carry passport the moment I step outside my house and hope that ICE goons give me the opportunity to show it if detained, I am all ears to hear about your experiences with racism toward white cis males.
      - mlrtime 9mo ago
        First, I'm sorry you have to do that, it's not right. You blame your skin color for other problems, conflation.
bigstrat2003 9mo ago
> It's just shocking to me how certain demographics are so eager to vote against their own interests. Nobody votes against their own interests. That is something that only stupid caricatures do, not actual people. If it seems that way to you, that should be a very strong signal to reevaluate your understanding of the situation. Most likely, that means either nobody is representing their interests or you have misunderstood what their interests are.
- lateforwork 9mo ago
  That's like saying nobody ever gets swindled. If you think someone got swindled that should be a strong signal to reevaluate your understanding of how they wanted to spend their money.
- mlrtime 9mo ago
  You are wasting your time I think. The people here know who the right people to vote for are, anyone who thinks otherwise is voting against their interests. There is only one comment above that says that both rural and urban people do the same thing, it is all boiling down to everyone should be voting one party.