3 ms·

That is one of the takes I've ever read. There is a reason gambling is so tightly regulated worldwide, and it's certainly not because governments hate easy vice

That is one of the takes I've ever read. There is a reason gambling is so tightly regulated worldwide, and it's certainly not because governments hate easy vice tax revenue. Gambling debt destroys family units, increases poverty rates (most notably for the children of gambling addicts -- the consequences are not localised only to the person making the bad decisions), and increases violent crime rates. Gambling is massively detrimental to society. There can be arguments in allowing people to do things that are detrimental to society in the name of freedom, but it's not a great thing to pretend those detriments don't exist at all.

_heimdall 9mo ago
Do you know of any studies that can accurately show the correlation between gambling and societal costs? On the surface the link makes sense to me and seems like it should be right, though I'm not sure how we could have tested it in a controlled way to really know the link exists.
- snapcaster 9mo ago
  This is such a weird question, just go outside and interact with humans and the evidence is everywhere
  - deleted 9mo ago
    [deleted]
  - _heimdall 9mo ago
    That's anecdotal, I was curious if there were (well designed) studies that showed likely correlation between the two. I have had family members addicted to drugs and/or alcohol and friends that have been addicted to gambling at various times. I've seen similar reactions anecdotally, but that isn't societal or scientific.
- BoxFour 9mo ago
  There are a bunch of studies out there [0][1] (two I found immediately) showing the risks around problem gambling, but like with most vices people who’ve already picked the pro side tend to react in the same predictable ways (myself included): 1) Dismissal: Feigning or having a profound misunderstanding of how statistics work by poking at the methodology like “N=200? That’s meaningless.” 2) Apathy: “So what if some people get addicted? We can’t babysit everyone.” 3) Rationalization: “Yeah but it helps Native American reservations, so...” 4) Downplaying: "Ok problem gambling is bad, but how prevalent is problem gambling really?" 0: https://psycnet.apa.org/record/1989-05439-001 https://psycnet.apa.org/record/1989-05439-001 1: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32402593/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32402593/
  - pvab3 9mo ago
    There's also a version of rationalization where people project arguments from the war on drugs to illegal gambling, as though the enforcement of illegal gambling was somehow had costs greater than just letting anyone bet any amount of money from their phones.
  - deleted 9mo ago
    [deleted]
- nilamo 9mo ago
  Do you know of any studies which show any evidence at all that gambling has no costs?
  - _heimdall 9mo ago
    You would like a study proving a negative? Good luck. My point absolutely wasn't that gambling has no known negative side effects. I was asking out of curiosity if there were studies someone could link to that actually tried to test it in a controlled way.
- trollbridge 9mo ago
  One study showed a significant increase in domestic violence after gamblers lost sports bets (based on the team for a specific city losing or winning and then comparing DV rates to cities before and after legal online sports betting). I believe it increased it about 10%.
- KellyCriterion 9mo ago
  In my country, lot of institutions running out-of-home-campaigns against gambling-addiction etc.; so yes, if public institutions are doing this then there is some evidence there
  - wat10000 9mo ago
    Must be nice to live in a country where you can make that inference.
    - KellyCriterion 9mo ago
      EU country
  - _heimdall 9mo ago
    I don't doubt that the programs are helpful, but how does that equate to evidence? Creating a campaign doesn't prove in anyway the specific problems caused by gambling, especially at the societal level. It only shows that there is a group willing to fund programs against gambling addictions. In no way am I questioning the intent or value of such programs, I hope it doesn't read that way. It just isn't necessarily relevant with regards to evidence.

_heimdall 9mo ago

Do you know of any studies that can accurately show the correlation between gambling and societal costs? On the surface the link makes sense to me and seems like it should be right, though I'm not sure how we could have tested it in a controlled way to really know the link exists.

snapcaster 9mo ago
This is such a weird question, just go outside and interact with humans and the evidence is everywhere
- deleted 9mo ago
  [deleted]
- _heimdall 9mo ago
  That's anecdotal, I was curious if there were (well designed) studies that showed likely correlation between the two. I have had family members addicted to drugs and/or alcohol and friends that have been addicted to gambling at various times. I've seen similar reactions anecdotally, but that isn't societal or scientific.
BoxFour 9mo ago
There are a bunch of studies out there [0][1] (two I found immediately) showing the risks around problem gambling, but like with most vices people who’ve already picked the pro side tend to react in the same predictable ways (myself included): 1) Dismissal: Feigning or having a profound misunderstanding of how statistics work by poking at the methodology like “N=200? That’s meaningless.” 2) Apathy: “So what if some people get addicted? We can’t babysit everyone.” 3) Rationalization: “Yeah but it helps Native American reservations, so...” 4) Downplaying: "Ok problem gambling is bad, but how prevalent is problem gambling really?" 0: https://psycnet.apa.org/record/1989-05439-001 https://psycnet.apa.org/record/1989-05439-001 1: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32402593/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32402593/
- pvab3 9mo ago
  There's also a version of rationalization where people project arguments from the war on drugs to illegal gambling, as though the enforcement of illegal gambling was somehow had costs greater than just letting anyone bet any amount of money from their phones.
- deleted 9mo ago
  [deleted]
nilamo 9mo ago
Do you know of any studies which show any evidence at all that gambling has no costs?
- _heimdall 9mo ago
  You would like a study proving a negative? Good luck. My point absolutely wasn't that gambling has no known negative side effects. I was asking out of curiosity if there were studies someone could link to that actually tried to test it in a controlled way.
trollbridge 9mo ago
One study showed a significant increase in domestic violence after gamblers lost sports bets (based on the team for a specific city losing or winning and then comparing DV rates to cities before and after legal online sports betting). I believe it increased it about 10%.
KellyCriterion 9mo ago
In my country, lot of institutions running out-of-home-campaigns against gambling-addiction etc.; so yes, if public institutions are doing this then there is some evidence there
- wat10000 9mo ago
  Must be nice to live in a country where you can make that inference.
  - KellyCriterion 9mo ago
    EU country
- _heimdall 9mo ago
  I don't doubt that the programs are helpful, but how does that equate to evidence? Creating a campaign doesn't prove in anyway the specific problems caused by gambling, especially at the societal level. It only shows that there is a group willing to fund programs against gambling addictions. In no way am I questioning the intent or value of such programs, I hope it doesn't read that way. It just isn't necessarily relevant with regards to evidence.