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Is there a law for residents/citizens that requires employers to have insurance plans that cover all expenses? Emergency treatments are not exactly free or paid

Is there a law for residents/citizens that requires employers to have insurance plans that cover all expenses? Emergency treatments are not exactly free or paid for by tax payers. If a H1-B loses his job or doesn't pay for med insurance and goes to healthcare institution (are there any publicly funded ones here?) - they will treat him/her but slap a collection for the full costs. As far as I know that is a potential loss for the healthcare provider not the general public as they did not fund the private organization.

rayiner 14y ago
What's the relevance of such a law? The point isn't whether H1-B's contribute more or less than residents/citizens. The point is that letting something in the country creates a set of reciprocal obligations. The people in a community are entitled to exercise control over incurring these obligations.
- blinkingled 14y ago
  You keep referring to obligations but I see no obligations society or community has to incur cost or resources for admitting a H1-B. If there were publicly funded hospitals that cared for H1-Bs, if there were publicly funded accommodations for H1-B offered for free or subsidized costs, if the government charged you in taxes for fulfilling their obligations towards the H1B - then what you are saying would be right. None of those are true - I paid for everything just like every other legal resident/citizen. You cannot make up corner cases that apply equally to H1-B and Citizens and claim that as an obligation - for the majority of H1Bs those are simply not relevant. You cannot also assume each H1-Bs children go to public school - mine didn't for a long time and when they did my wife volunteered there. In fact think about this - the H1-Bs are degree holders educated by their own country at its expense - no American money was spent on their entire education.
  - rayiner 14y ago
    First, I'm talking about immigration generally, not just H1-B. Second, you seem to be conflating the term "obligation" with "burden." I'm not saying that H1-B's are somehow particularly a drain on public resources or they benefit from common public expenditures in some special way that citizens don't. That's not what "obligation" means. You point out that you "paid for everything just like every other legal resident/citizen" and I'm sure that's true. But would you say our community has no obligations to every other legal resident/citizen? Of course not. The society has obligations to everyone within its borders. You say I'm making up "corner cases that apply equally to H1-B and Citizens" but nothing in my argument requires the community's obligations to extend to H1-B's specially. The community is obligated to everyone who lives here. For example, every single hospital in the US is publicly subsidized in some way. It's either a public hospital, a non-profit hospital, attached to a public university, etc. They all benefit from $30 billion in NIH grants, etc. H1-B's and Citizens benefit equally from that public subsidy. But that's an obligation of our society to both H-1Bs and citizens. We consider ourselves obligated to have a quality healthcare system for people who live here, including H1-B's. We don't turn away people from these hospitals just because they're H1-B's. The same thing with public education. It doesn't need to be the case that every H1-B goes to public school. That's not relevant. What's important is that our society makes a commitment--if you have a kid and need to send him to school, you will have a public school accessible. That's a commitment we make to everyone who lives here. We also commit to extend citizenship to your children born here. Again, that's something we commit to everyone who lives here, whether they take advantage of it or not. That commitment is the obligation. Just because these obligations are extended uniformly does not make them not obligations. My point is not that we should have fewer H1-B's because they suck up American resources. It's not an argument about the number of H1-B's or immigrants we take. My comments were originally a response to someone questioning the validity of our exercise of any controls on immigration. That's what I'm replying to. I'm asserting that because our society extends obligations to everyone who lives here, we validly get to control who gets to live here.
    - akiselev 14y ago
      But the society doesn't extend the same obligations or benefits. Non permanent residents and citizens are treated as second class citizens both in their financial prospects (paying the same taxes, not receiving the same benefits in SS, Medicare/aid, unemployment benefits, and especially federal financial aid among many others). Many immigrants never receive these benefits because they are forced out before they are eligible to realize them. The penalties for any breach of the obligations also happen to be harder on many immigrants. For many, even those who are permanent residents, breaking a law that would result in probation or even a misdemeanor can result in deportation. For many, this is worse than prison. (For example, if deported I would be forced into the corrupt military of an anti-American country where 300+ people die annually from hazing alone and where I am barely fluent in the language). The US totally has a right to control it's own borders but don't try to justify it. The immigration system of the US is at best broken, at worst inhumane.

rayiner 14y ago

What's the relevance of such a law? The point isn't whether H1-B's contribute more or less than residents/citizens. The point is that letting something in the country creates a set of reciprocal obligations. The people in a community are entitled to exercise control over incurring these obligations.

blinkingled 14y ago
You keep referring to obligations but I see no obligations society or community has to incur cost or resources for admitting a H1-B. If there were publicly funded hospitals that cared for H1-Bs, if there were publicly funded accommodations for H1-B offered for free or subsidized costs, if the government charged you in taxes for fulfilling their obligations towards the H1B - then what you are saying would be right. None of those are true - I paid for everything just like every other legal resident/citizen. You cannot make up corner cases that apply equally to H1-B and Citizens and claim that as an obligation - for the majority of H1Bs those are simply not relevant. You cannot also assume each H1-Bs children go to public school - mine didn't for a long time and when they did my wife volunteered there. In fact think about this - the H1-Bs are degree holders educated by their own country at its expense - no American money was spent on their entire education.
- rayiner 14y ago
  First, I'm talking about immigration generally, not just H1-B. Second, you seem to be conflating the term "obligation" with "burden." I'm not saying that H1-B's are somehow particularly a drain on public resources or they benefit from common public expenditures in some special way that citizens don't. That's not what "obligation" means. You point out that you "paid for everything just like every other legal resident/citizen" and I'm sure that's true. But would you say our community has no obligations to every other legal resident/citizen? Of course not. The society has obligations to everyone within its borders. You say I'm making up "corner cases that apply equally to H1-B and Citizens" but nothing in my argument requires the community's obligations to extend to H1-B's specially. The community is obligated to everyone who lives here. For example, every single hospital in the US is publicly subsidized in some way. It's either a public hospital, a non-profit hospital, attached to a public university, etc. They all benefit from $30 billion in NIH grants, etc. H1-B's and Citizens benefit equally from that public subsidy. But that's an obligation of our society to both H-1Bs and citizens. We consider ourselves obligated to have a quality healthcare system for people who live here, including H1-B's. We don't turn away people from these hospitals just because they're H1-B's. The same thing with public education. It doesn't need to be the case that every H1-B goes to public school. That's not relevant. What's important is that our society makes a commitment--if you have a kid and need to send him to school, you will have a public school accessible. That's a commitment we make to everyone who lives here. We also commit to extend citizenship to your children born here. Again, that's something we commit to everyone who lives here, whether they take advantage of it or not. That commitment is the obligation. Just because these obligations are extended uniformly does not make them not obligations. My point is not that we should have fewer H1-B's because they suck up American resources. It's not an argument about the number of H1-B's or immigrants we take. My comments were originally a response to someone questioning the validity of our exercise of any controls on immigration. That's what I'm replying to. I'm asserting that because our society extends obligations to everyone who lives here, we validly get to control who gets to live here.
  - akiselev 14y ago
    But the society doesn't extend the same obligations or benefits. Non permanent residents and citizens are treated as second class citizens both in their financial prospects (paying the same taxes, not receiving the same benefits in SS, Medicare/aid, unemployment benefits, and especially federal financial aid among many others). Many immigrants never receive these benefits because they are forced out before they are eligible to realize them. The penalties for any breach of the obligations also happen to be harder on many immigrants. For many, even those who are permanent residents, breaking a law that would result in probation or even a misdemeanor can result in deportation. For many, this is worse than prison. (For example, if deported I would be forced into the corrupt military of an anti-American country where 300+ people die annually from hazing alone and where I am barely fluent in the language). The US totally has a right to control it's own borders but don't try to justify it. The immigration system of the US is at best broken, at worst inhumane.