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I somewhat agree with this poster. However, I think the unfortunate reality of programming for money is that a mediocre programmer that pumps out millions of li

I somewhat agree with this poster. However, I think the unfortunate reality of programming for money is that a mediocre programmer that pumps out millions of lines of slop that seems to drive the business forward and manages to hide disastrous bugs until after the contract / promotion cycle is over will get further ahead than the more competent programmer that delivers better, less buggy, less spaghetti code.

ymyms 9mo ago
I mean, isn't driving the business forward really what matters (outside of academia, open source, and other such endeavors). We live in a hyper competitive market. All else being equal, if company A can produce "millions of lines of slop", constantly living on the knife-edge of disaster but not falling over it, they will beat company B that artificially slows themselves down. Up until the point company A implodes, but that's not necessarily a given if pre-LLM companies are any indication.
- j2kun 9mo ago
  Sounds like you should go bundle sub-prime mortgages into some complex securities, if you like intentionally living on the knife's edge of disaster.
  - ymyms 9mo ago
    Huh? Where did I say that's what I like? I'm just trying to discuss for discussion's sake. Personally, I want a world that rewards the people who put their thought, care, and craftsmanship into something more than those that don't. In order to live in that world, I think we need to discuss the parts (maybe the whole) that don't and why that might be.
    - hu3 9mo ago
      don't bother. Your parent commenter is writing some loaded comments in this post.
- falloutx 9mo ago
  This is not reality for most companies. Some have billions in bank but still produce slop. Its because their internal systems rewards slop.
theshrike79 9mo ago
Most of us are paid to solve problems and deliver features, not craft the most perfect code known to man. If the slop-o-matic next to you is delivering 5 features a week without tripping up QA and you do one every two weeks - which one will the company pick when layoffs hit again?
- tstrimple 9mo ago
  Most developer jobs are like working at Ikea, but most developers on HN pretend they are fine furniture craftsman and that's really what everyone needs or the whole world will fall apart. It turns out, the vast majority of the population is quite happy with a LACK side table and their carefully crafted dovetail joinery adds nothing but expense to the average use case.
  - theshrike79 9mo ago
    Exactly. With the current over-funded startup market people can spend tons of time and money building over-engineered juicers: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Cp-BGQfpHQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Cp-BGQfpHQ - and their software equivalent. So many companies would be just fine with a single VPS, Python and PostgreSQL - but that's boring and doesn't look good in your resume =)

ymyms 9mo ago

I mean, isn't driving the business forward really what matters (outside of academia, open source, and other such endeavors). We live in a hyper competitive market. All else being equal, if company A can produce "millions of lines of slop", constantly living on the knife-edge of disaster but not falling over it, they will beat company B that artificially slows themselves down. Up until the point company A implodes, but that's not necessarily a given if pre-LLM companies are any indication.

j2kun 9mo ago
Sounds like you should go bundle sub-prime mortgages into some complex securities, if you like intentionally living on the knife's edge of disaster.
- ymyms 9mo ago
  Huh? Where did I say that's what I like? I'm just trying to discuss for discussion's sake. Personally, I want a world that rewards the people who put their thought, care, and craftsmanship into something more than those that don't. In order to live in that world, I think we need to discuss the parts (maybe the whole) that don't and why that might be.
  - hu3 9mo ago
    don't bother. Your parent commenter is writing some loaded comments in this post.
falloutx 9mo ago
This is not reality for most companies. Some have billions in bank but still produce slop. Its because their internal systems rewards slop.

theshrike79 9mo ago

Most of us are paid to solve problems and deliver features, not craft the most perfect code known to man. If the slop-o-matic next to you is delivering 5 features a week without tripping up QA and you do one every two weeks - which one will the company pick when layoffs hit again?

tstrimple 9mo ago
Most developer jobs are like working at Ikea, but most developers on HN pretend they are fine furniture craftsman and that's really what everyone needs or the whole world will fall apart. It turns out, the vast majority of the population is quite happy with a LACK side table and their carefully crafted dovetail joinery adds nothing but expense to the average use case.
- theshrike79 9mo ago
  Exactly. With the current over-funded startup market people can spend tons of time and money building over-engineered juicers: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Cp-BGQfpHQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Cp-BGQfpHQ - and their software equivalent. So many companies would be just fine with a single VPS, Python and PostgreSQL - but that's boring and doesn't look good in your resume =)