4 ms·

Is this a recent thing? I'm in the UK under a Tier 1 (a points based, highly skilled migrants visa) and can work almost without restriction (I can't be a docto

by flog 14y ago

Is this a recent thing? I'm in the UK under a Tier 1 (a points based, highly skilled migrants visa) and can work almost without restriction (I can't be a doctor or professional sports person). Even under the working holiday maker there were no restrictions to your employer.

varjag 14y ago
UK is in many ways a special thing; as un-European as a EU country can get. I am in Norway and have a number of migrant friends throughout Scandinavia and mainland Europe. It's all very similar, with exception of Swiss (where permanent residence for a worker is nearly unobtainable).
sturadnidge 14y ago
The Tier 1 was a different, independent visa - I think varjag is referring to the UK work permit system which works as described (except for the time length, which used to be 5 years but is now only 2 years) and has been that way for many years. The Tier 1 doesn't actually exist anymore, basically the only way you can work in the UK without EU citizenship or an ancestry visa is via a sponsored visa. In fact the rules just changed recently for the worse - if you are working in the UK under a sponsored visa, the time no longer counts towards settlement. Under the old work permit system, you were still tied to a company but at least after 5 years you could apply for indefinite leave to remain (which is exactly what i did a few months ago). I don't know why anyone in their right mind would work in the UK with (a) the inability to easily change employers and (b) the inability to settle after X number of years. Obviously not a problem for EU citizens or ancestry visa holders, but for the rest of us...
- varjag 14y ago
  It's obviously a populist move; making life complicated to skilled workers is perhaps the worst way to fight illegal migration. I've been to the UK last year for friends wedding; obtaining even a visitor visa was a humiliating process only a cavity search short from prison experience. So many people in EU/EEC somehow hold this idea that getting residence in their country is as easy as simply applying for it: probably the outcome of public debate where some points of view are very selective and simplistic.
  - 46Bit 14y ago
    I'm from the UK, and despite having interests in government I paid little attention to our immigration process until I started to look into that of the USA. The problem is simple to sum up: highly skilled workers aren't going to sneak across the Channel Tunnel/Rio Grande very often. They'll stick to as-legal-as-possible means because generally they're respectable tradesmen, who've invested a lot of time/money in their skills and want to use them as best as they can. Unfortunately, these government-encouraged means of immigration/foreign-workers are the easiest things to stop. Hence an 'immigration clampdown to save the jobs of the natives' really consists of blocking the vast majority of the foreigners you might actually want to move to your country.
    - Tsagadai 14y ago
      You basically summarized the entire immigration debate in one post. Well done. I think it should be required for anyone arguing immigration policy from either position to go through an immigration system first. When you experience the hoops you need to go through to get into a country you begin to understand why making it harder only negatively impacts the people your country wants.

by flog 14y ago

varjag 14y ago

UK is in many ways a special thing; as un-European as a EU country can get. I am in Norway and have a number of migrant friends throughout Scandinavia and mainland Europe. It's all very similar, with exception of Swiss (where permanent residence for a worker is nearly unobtainable).

sturadnidge 14y ago

The Tier 1 was a different, independent visa - I think varjag is referring to the UK work permit system which works as described (except for the time length, which used to be 5 years but is now only 2 years) and has been that way for many years. The Tier 1 doesn't actually exist anymore, basically the only way you can work in the UK without EU citizenship or an ancestry visa is via a sponsored visa. In fact the rules just changed recently for the worse - if you are working in the UK under a sponsored visa, the time no longer counts towards settlement. Under the old work permit system, you were still tied to a company but at least after 5 years you could apply for indefinite leave to remain (which is exactly what i did a few months ago). I don't know why anyone in their right mind would work in the UK with (a) the inability to easily change employers and (b) the inability to settle after X number of years. Obviously not a problem for EU citizens or ancestry visa holders, but for the rest of us...

varjag 14y ago
It's obviously a populist move; making life complicated to skilled workers is perhaps the worst way to fight illegal migration. I've been to the UK last year for friends wedding; obtaining even a visitor visa was a humiliating process only a cavity search short from prison experience. So many people in EU/EEC somehow hold this idea that getting residence in their country is as easy as simply applying for it: probably the outcome of public debate where some points of view are very selective and simplistic.
- 46Bit 14y ago
  I'm from the UK, and despite having interests in government I paid little attention to our immigration process until I started to look into that of the USA. The problem is simple to sum up: highly skilled workers aren't going to sneak across the Channel Tunnel/Rio Grande very often. They'll stick to as-legal-as-possible means because generally they're respectable tradesmen, who've invested a lot of time/money in their skills and want to use them as best as they can. Unfortunately, these government-encouraged means of immigration/foreign-workers are the easiest things to stop. Hence an 'immigration clampdown to save the jobs of the natives' really consists of blocking the vast majority of the foreigners you might actually want to move to your country.
  - Tsagadai 14y ago
    You basically summarized the entire immigration debate in one post. Well done. I think it should be required for anyone arguing immigration policy from either position to go through an immigration system first. When you experience the hoops you need to go through to get into a country you begin to understand why making it harder only negatively impacts the people your country wants.