7 ms·

> It would work, but is not very different from banning all white people in order to shut down the KKK. There's a big difference in that those white people are

> It would work, but is not very different from banning all white people in order to shut down the KKK. There's a big difference in that those white people are already in America, and getting rid of them would be impossible. Note that I'm talking about implementing stricter immigration policies going forward, not getting rid of people who are already here. > The proportion of Arabs to radical Islamic fundamentalists is so small that it really, really wouldn't make sense. That's a lot of baby for very little bath water. To be honest, this whole Muslim immigration issue is more applicable to Europe than it is to America. America has (fortunately) maintained much stricter immigration policies than much of Europe, and the latter has consequently suffered from large swathes of Arab/Muslim immigrants failing to properly integrate into mainstream society. I'd say America has done quite well in comparison when it comes to assimilating Arab immigrants (although it has failed quite miserably so far when it comes to Hispanic and African Americans).

potatolicious 14y ago
> "(although it has failed quite miserably so far when it comes to Hispanic and African Americans)." I wouldn't exactly describe African Americans as immigrants per se... It seems to imply a level of volunteerism that simply wasn't there. Anyways, that's a nitpick. > "Note that I'm talking about implementing stricter immigration policies going forward, not getting rid of people who are already here." Right, but how do you know there aren't any bad apples in the people who are already here? Also bear in mind that of all Muslim terrorists who have committed an act of terrorism on American soil, many were visitors to the US, not immigrants. Do you believe we should also restrict Muslim visitation of the USA? How many more extremists do you think we will create within the existing Muslim population if we essentially had a big "Muslims go home" sign at every border checkpoint? What would it to do in terms of our desire to assimilate these immigrants? Your idea is fun to think about, but IMO it's not realistic. There are too many moving pieces for "no more Muslims in the US" to be a realistic policy choice. Not to mention the costs would be rather high. Go to any of the top US schools and look at both the grad student and professor rosters, count the people of Middle Eastern decent or of Muslim faith. These are all huge wins for American society - both in talent addition and talent denial to rival regimes. Do you really want all of these people to, say, go work for the Chinese? Or Iran? US hegemony is ensured in large (and put large in big screaming rainbow marquee letters) part by talent acquisition. We took much of Europe's best scientific talent after WW2, and we continued mopping up all the smartest and most talented people from all over the globe - Japan, China, India, the whole Eastern Bloc, and beyond. The US's lead over everyone else is economic and technological - leaving a whole swathe of educated immigrants on the table seems to go very firmly against this model. Slamming the door shut on immigration would be like starving yourself so you don't have to poop - it would work, but why?
- simonh 14y ago
  Our current government here in the UK is doing this at the moment. They even revoked a university's license to accept foreign students on a technicality. We make a fortune out of foreign students and with our demographics need them far more than the US, but according to the Daily Mail reading grey brigade if we packed them all off home, all our troubles would be over. Because simplistic, sweeping, poorly thought out solutions to deep rooted cultural and economic issues always work out so well.
  - lmm 14y ago
    It wasn't a technicality. While the response may have been disproportionate, we're talking about brazen corruption from LMU; I have very little sympathy for them.
  - whyhellothere 14y ago
    That 'technicality'(1) was the universities lack of effective checks on students right to be in the UK, which they had 6 months to fix. I don't disagree that foreign students bring a lot to this country, and that the handling of this thing by the government was extremely poor (2), but you're conflating two different issues in order to make a point about the Daily Mail. It seems like you're guilty of the same simplistic arguments. (1) http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-19419395 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-19419395 (2) http://www.guardian.co.uk/education/2012/aug/30/london-metropolitan-university-international-students http://www.guardian.co.uk/education/2012/aug/30/london-metro...
- white_devil 14y ago
  Europe certainly does have a problem with Muslim immigration. We've been tolerating and understanding the fuck out of them too, but that doesn't seem to have helped at all. They're massively over-represented in crime statistics. There are talented people everywhere, but you won't find all that many Western people who killed their own daughters for showing too much skin.
  - randomchars 14y ago
bitwiseXOR 14y ago
your bigoted antiquated opinions about immigration would never fly in this day and age, thank goodness. America has opened its legs culturally to the world, especially after WWII, and there will be dire economic and cultural consequences should she close them. accept it and move on, your daughter may not marry white. sorry.
winter_blue 14y ago
Wow, you're so incredibly racist and bigoted that it's sickening. I didn't expect the likes of you to be on HN.
- anon1385 14y ago
  Ha, do you actually regularly read HN? If you think the comments on this submission are bad I advise you don't go read the ones here from the other week http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4603611 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4603611

potatolicious 14y ago

> "(although it has failed quite miserably so far when it comes to Hispanic and African Americans)." I wouldn't exactly describe African Americans as immigrants per se... It seems to imply a level of volunteerism that simply wasn't there. Anyways, that's a nitpick. > "Note that I'm talking about implementing stricter immigration policies going forward, not getting rid of people who are already here." Right, but how do you know there aren't any bad apples in the people who are already here? Also bear in mind that of all Muslim terrorists who have committed an act of terrorism on American soil, many were visitors to the US, not immigrants. Do you believe we should also restrict Muslim visitation of the USA? How many more extremists do you think we will create within the existing Muslim population if we essentially had a big "Muslims go home" sign at every border checkpoint? What would it to do in terms of our desire to assimilate these immigrants? Your idea is fun to think about, but IMO it's not realistic. There are too many moving pieces for "no more Muslims in the US" to be a realistic policy choice. Not to mention the costs would be rather high. Go to any of the top US schools and look at both the grad student and professor rosters, count the people of Middle Eastern decent or of Muslim faith. These are all huge wins for American society - both in talent addition and talent denial to rival regimes. Do you really want all of these people to, say, go work for the Chinese? Or Iran? US hegemony is ensured in large (and put large in big screaming rainbow marquee letters) part by talent acquisition. We took much of Europe's best scientific talent after WW2, and we continued mopping up all the smartest and most talented people from all over the globe - Japan, China, India, the whole Eastern Bloc, and beyond. The US's lead over everyone else is economic and technological - leaving a whole swathe of educated immigrants on the table seems to go very firmly against this model. Slamming the door shut on immigration would be like starving yourself so you don't have to poop - it would work, but why?

simonh 14y ago
Our current government here in the UK is doing this at the moment. They even revoked a university's license to accept foreign students on a technicality. We make a fortune out of foreign students and with our demographics need them far more than the US, but according to the Daily Mail reading grey brigade if we packed them all off home, all our troubles would be over. Because simplistic, sweeping, poorly thought out solutions to deep rooted cultural and economic issues always work out so well.
- lmm 14y ago
  It wasn't a technicality. While the response may have been disproportionate, we're talking about brazen corruption from LMU; I have very little sympathy for them.
- whyhellothere 14y ago
  That 'technicality'(1) was the universities lack of effective checks on students right to be in the UK, which they had 6 months to fix. I don't disagree that foreign students bring a lot to this country, and that the handling of this thing by the government was extremely poor (2), but you're conflating two different issues in order to make a point about the Daily Mail. It seems like you're guilty of the same simplistic arguments. (1) http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-19419395 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-19419395 (2) http://www.guardian.co.uk/education/2012/aug/30/london-metropolitan-university-international-students http://www.guardian.co.uk/education/2012/aug/30/london-metro...
white_devil 14y ago
Europe certainly does have a problem with Muslim immigration. We've been tolerating and understanding the fuck out of them too, but that doesn't seem to have helped at all. They're massively over-represented in crime statistics. There are talented people everywhere, but you won't find all that many Western people who killed their own daughters for showing too much skin.
- randomchars 14y ago

bitwiseXOR 14y ago

your bigoted antiquated opinions about immigration would never fly in this day and age, thank goodness. America has opened its legs culturally to the world, especially after WWII, and there will be dire economic and cultural consequences should she close them. accept it and move on, your daughter may not marry white. sorry.

winter_blue 14y ago

Wow, you're so incredibly racist and bigoted that it's sickening. I didn't expect the likes of you to be on HN.

anon1385 14y ago
Ha, do you actually regularly read HN? If you think the comments on this submission are bad I advise you don't go read the ones here from the other week http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4603611 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4603611