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I’m friends with the manager of my neighborhood convenience store and he is extremely angry that he has shoplifting caught on tape, trespassed people, begged an

I’m friends with the manager of my neighborhood convenience store and he is extremely angry that he has shoplifting caught on tape, trespassed people, begged and pleaded with the police but they won’t do anything. I’m not sure if you actually know anyone operating a retail store but it’s pretty grim in the blue cities

mcphage 10mo ago
You really need to figure out how to get the police to do their job.
Terr_ 10mo ago
The symptoms you're describing don't seem to match the proposed treatment. Police: "You've caught them red-handed on camera, but we're very busy and we don't care. Or perhaps this is a place where we're deliberately doing-nothing as a revenge or pressure-tactic against local politicians." Shopkeeper: "Ah, but this time I have the camera-footage and fancy biometrics of everyone in the store!" Police: "Oh, well why didn't you say so? That completely changes things, we're always willing to help out a fellow biometrics fan."
- rurban 10mo ago
  Depends on the judges. If police cannot prove the crime in front of the judge, they wasted their time. With proper evidence it's not a waste of time anymore.
  - Eisenstein 10mo ago
    So the reason is that they are afraid of bringing case with witnesses and video footage to a judge because it might be too flimsy?
    - monero-xmr 10mo ago
      Progressive prosecutors don’t care. Judges let repeat offenders out with a wrist slap. Demoralizes police - what’s the point of all the effort if they are back out on the street tomorrow?
      - Eisenstein 10mo ago
        Sounds like you have a narrative that you are going to believe no matter what.
        monero-xmr 10mo ago
        My narrative is living here forever and seeing everything go to shit
        Eisenstein 10mo ago
        No, that's your experience. The narrative is that everything went to shit because the left is trying to create a society where the values you hold are despised and where the good people are blamed for everything while lazy people and criminals get to do whatever they want because of a misplaced sense of justice. What is actually happening is more mundane. It's political systems breaking because closed primaries and Gerrymandering mean that a significant population in a lot of places effectively get no political voice because the elections are held in the primaries, and the people can't vote in the opposing party's primary. Ossification results, or the candidate who appeals to the party's more ardent voters get elected, and we essentially lose the center as a political position. We also have a homeless situation that isn't being addressed, because no one wants to do anything effective. So what happens is that the only thing that can be done is to arrest them, and house them in jail temporarily. This is expensive and doesn't actually fix anything. So you have a bunch of frustrated citizens who feel like they have no control over their local policy and are sick of the petty crime, along with police who are handling it by not enforcing quality of life crimes in the hope people will blame the elected officials they don't like. Your frustration is real, but the causes you are attributing for them are wrong.
- mlrtime 10mo ago
  You forgot the local DA that run on a political stance to NOT be tough on crime. Police will not arrest if the DA won't prosecute.
  - mcphage 10mo ago
    > Police will not arrest if the DA won't prosecute. Why not? If the police are frustrated that the DAs aren’t doing their job, I don’t think it helps the police any to choose to also not do their job. Especially since DAs are often elected, which means it’s easier to replace them if the police can show that they (the DA) are the bottleneck. But if the police don’t do their job first, then the police are the bottleneck.
    - mlrtime 10mo ago
      That is great and I agree with you, but not how things work on the streets, at least in NYC.
      - mcphage 10mo ago
        > but not how things work on the streets, at least in NYC Then how do things work on the streets in NYC?
        mlrtime 10mo ago
        Criminals walk into a store, steal things and leave. Or you have criminals walking around with 80+ arrests that are let go same day over and over again.
Spooky23 10mo ago
The police rarely have ever been super responsive on shoplifting and basic trespass. I worked at a big box electronics store in the 90s, and we got looted when management did stupid shit like put hard drives on a retail shelf to save labor. The police rarely cared with some specific exception. These cases are both minor and hard to prosecute. The difference isn’t enforcement, it’s demand. The retail model as it stands today wasn’t designed for a world where there is a global market for everything. 95% people are honest, and most dishonest people are disorganized and easy to deter. If you were to raid a drug store in 1986, your ability to unload stolen toothpaste and hair spray was pretty limited - maybe some mafias had a network of bodegas or independent stores. Today, you have a major corporation that prides itself at having the “world‘s largest selection”. It’s also the worlds largest fence — Amazon.
danaris 10mo ago
...Do you, perhaps, detect some sort of a difference between your neighborhood convenience store, and Wal-Mart? Perhaps some differences in level of power? Perhaps some differences in the degree to which police are willing to bend over backward for them, vs blowing them off?

mcphage 10mo ago

You really need to figure out how to get the police to do their job.

Terr_ 10mo ago

The symptoms you're describing don't seem to match the proposed treatment. Police: "You've caught them red-handed on camera, but we're very busy and we don't care. Or perhaps this is a place where we're deliberately doing-nothing as a revenge or pressure-tactic against local politicians." Shopkeeper: "Ah, but this time I have the camera-footage and fancy biometrics of everyone in the store!" Police: "Oh, well why didn't you say so? That completely changes things, we're always willing to help out a fellow biometrics fan."

rurban 10mo ago
Depends on the judges. If police cannot prove the crime in front of the judge, they wasted their time. With proper evidence it's not a waste of time anymore.
- Eisenstein 10mo ago
  So the reason is that they are afraid of bringing case with witnesses and video footage to a judge because it might be too flimsy?
  - monero-xmr 10mo ago
    Progressive prosecutors don’t care. Judges let repeat offenders out with a wrist slap. Demoralizes police - what’s the point of all the effort if they are back out on the street tomorrow?
    - Eisenstein 10mo ago
      Sounds like you have a narrative that you are going to believe no matter what.
      - monero-xmr 10mo ago
        My narrative is living here forever and seeing everything go to shit
        Eisenstein 10mo ago
        No, that's your experience. The narrative is that everything went to shit because the left is trying to create a society where the values you hold are despised and where the good people are blamed for everything while lazy people and criminals get to do whatever they want because of a misplaced sense of justice. What is actually happening is more mundane. It's political systems breaking because closed primaries and Gerrymandering mean that a significant population in a lot of places effectively get no political voice because the elections are held in the primaries, and the people can't vote in the opposing party's primary. Ossification results, or the candidate who appeals to the party's more ardent voters get elected, and we essentially lose the center as a political position. We also have a homeless situation that isn't being addressed, because no one wants to do anything effective. So what happens is that the only thing that can be done is to arrest them, and house them in jail temporarily. This is expensive and doesn't actually fix anything. So you have a bunch of frustrated citizens who feel like they have no control over their local policy and are sick of the petty crime, along with police who are handling it by not enforcing quality of life crimes in the hope people will blame the elected officials they don't like. Your frustration is real, but the causes you are attributing for them are wrong.
mlrtime 10mo ago
You forgot the local DA that run on a political stance to NOT be tough on crime. Police will not arrest if the DA won't prosecute.
- mcphage 10mo ago
  > Police will not arrest if the DA won't prosecute. Why not? If the police are frustrated that the DAs aren’t doing their job, I don’t think it helps the police any to choose to also not do their job. Especially since DAs are often elected, which means it’s easier to replace them if the police can show that they (the DA) are the bottleneck. But if the police don’t do their job first, then the police are the bottleneck.
  - mlrtime 10mo ago
    That is great and I agree with you, but not how things work on the streets, at least in NYC.
    - mcphage 10mo ago
      > but not how things work on the streets, at least in NYC Then how do things work on the streets in NYC?
      - mlrtime 10mo ago
        Criminals walk into a store, steal things and leave. Or you have criminals walking around with 80+ arrests that are let go same day over and over again.

Spooky23 10mo ago

The police rarely have ever been super responsive on shoplifting and basic trespass. I worked at a big box electronics store in the 90s, and we got looted when management did stupid shit like put hard drives on a retail shelf to save labor. The police rarely cared with some specific exception. These cases are both minor and hard to prosecute. The difference isn’t enforcement, it’s demand. The retail model as it stands today wasn’t designed for a world where there is a global market for everything. 95% people are honest, and most dishonest people are disorganized and easy to deter. If you were to raid a drug store in 1986, your ability to unload stolen toothpaste and hair spray was pretty limited - maybe some mafias had a network of bodegas or independent stores. Today, you have a major corporation that prides itself at having the “world‘s largest selection”. It’s also the worlds largest fence — Amazon.

danaris 10mo ago

...Do you, perhaps, detect some sort of a difference between your neighborhood convenience store, and Wal-Mart? Perhaps some differences in level of power? Perhaps some differences in the degree to which police are willing to bend over backward for them, vs blowing them off?