3 ms·

I think they may get away with it. Our head-of-state is already describing it as an act of self-defense.

by beeflet 9mo ago

jcranmer 9mo ago
The president can do jack shit to stop a state prosecution, one of the blessed advantages of federalism.
- beeflet 9mo ago
  That may be the case, I am not an expert in law. I hope there is some type of repercussion for the cop that point-blanks a random driver. I just don't hold much faith in the separation of power between state and federal government, it sounds like there has been a massive erosion of this barrier since the civil war and the abuse of the commerce clause and all that.
  - nickthegreek 9mo ago
    A cop did not do this, an ice agent did. It might sound trivial, but it very much isn’t when it comes to prosecution in this circumstance.
- esseph 9mo ago
  Maybe he cuts their federal funding by $10Bn until they drop the charge. Seems to be roughly the playbook.
- websiteapi 9mo ago
  this is not true. why is this upvoted? first of all, ICE is federal. second, they were acting as part of "federal official" duties. it will be trivial to move any state prosecution to federal court.
  - jcranmer 9mo ago
    Federal officers aren't immune from state prosecution just because they're federal officers, or because they're doing their federal duties at the moment. They also have to be acting in accord with their federal duties. See, e.g., https://www.lawfaremedia.org/article/are-federal-officials-immune-from-state-prosecution https://www.lawfaremedia.org/article/are-federal-officials-i... (although that's not in response to the current incident). They will certainly attempt to dismiss any charges, but they are far from guaranteed that they will be successful.
    - websiteapi 9mo ago
      They’re literally on camera doing ice work (prior to the killing), virtually guaranteed it’ll count.
      - jcranmer 9mo ago
        That doesn't matter. It's not enough that they were doing their job beforehand, their actions at stake have to comport with their actual duties. So is it part of their official duties to walk in front of a car of someone who is trying to leave the scene, alter their path when the car turns out of the way to ensure they remain in their way, and then shoot the driver? Or is that merely the kind of excessive force that's in contravention of their training and not part of their job role?
        websiteapi 9mo ago
        Watch the video, it’s obvious. The person was stopped as part of an ice directive.
hahahahhaah 9mo ago
They definitely get away with it. To be punished requires: 1. Prosecution. US wont because of trump. State might not because of some threat from trump. 2. Proof beyond reasonable doubt. Video can make case for self defence so bar is high. 3. No presidential pardon.
- nozzlegear 9mo ago
  1. Minnesota will absolutely prosecute, Walz has already announced a criminal investigation. 2. We'll let the jury decide but ICE is specifically trained not to shoot at moving vehicles and not to approach them from the front. 3. The president can't pardon someone convicted of murder in a state court, he can only pardon people convicted of federal crimes.
  - cmxch 9mo ago
    [flagged]
    - actionfromafar 9mo ago
      Do you think these are good ideas?
  - hahahahhaah 9mo ago
    https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c99knmrx71go https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c99knmrx71go "Minnesota officials say FBI blocked their access to ICE shooting probe"
    - nozzlegear 9mo ago
      Not at all unexpected given Trump's sycophants are heading the FBI. Luckily Minnesota is moving forward with their own independent review: https://www.startribune.com/hennepin-county-prosecutor-attorney-general-launch-independent-state-review-into-fatal-ice-shooting/601561110 https://www.startribune.com/hennepin-county-prosecutor-attor...

I think they may get away with it. Our head-of-state is already describing it as an act of self-defense.

by beeflet 9mo ago

I think they may get away with it. Our head-of-state is already describing it as an act of self-defense.

jcranmer 9mo ago

The president can do jack shit to stop a state prosecution, one of the blessed advantages of federalism.

beeflet 9mo ago
That may be the case, I am not an expert in law. I hope there is some type of repercussion for the cop that point-blanks a random driver. I just don't hold much faith in the separation of power between state and federal government, it sounds like there has been a massive erosion of this barrier since the civil war and the abuse of the commerce clause and all that.
- nickthegreek 9mo ago
  A cop did not do this, an ice agent did. It might sound trivial, but it very much isn’t when it comes to prosecution in this circumstance.
esseph 9mo ago
Maybe he cuts their federal funding by $10Bn until they drop the charge. Seems to be roughly the playbook.
websiteapi 9mo ago
this is not true. why is this upvoted? first of all, ICE is federal. second, they were acting as part of "federal official" duties. it will be trivial to move any state prosecution to federal court.
- jcranmer 9mo ago
  Federal officers aren't immune from state prosecution just because they're federal officers, or because they're doing their federal duties at the moment. They also have to be acting in accord with their federal duties. See, e.g., https://www.lawfaremedia.org/article/are-federal-officials-immune-from-state-prosecution https://www.lawfaremedia.org/article/are-federal-officials-i... (although that's not in response to the current incident). They will certainly attempt to dismiss any charges, but they are far from guaranteed that they will be successful.
  - websiteapi 9mo ago
    They’re literally on camera doing ice work (prior to the killing), virtually guaranteed it’ll count.
    - jcranmer 9mo ago
      That doesn't matter. It's not enough that they were doing their job beforehand, their actions at stake have to comport with their actual duties. So is it part of their official duties to walk in front of a car of someone who is trying to leave the scene, alter their path when the car turns out of the way to ensure they remain in their way, and then shoot the driver? Or is that merely the kind of excessive force that's in contravention of their training and not part of their job role?
      - websiteapi 9mo ago
        Watch the video, it’s obvious. The person was stopped as part of an ice directive.

hahahahhaah 9mo ago

They definitely get away with it. To be punished requires: 1. Prosecution. US wont because of trump. State might not because of some threat from trump. 2. Proof beyond reasonable doubt. Video can make case for self defence so bar is high. 3. No presidential pardon.

nozzlegear 9mo ago
1. Minnesota will absolutely prosecute, Walz has already announced a criminal investigation. 2. We'll let the jury decide but ICE is specifically trained not to shoot at moving vehicles and not to approach them from the front. 3. The president can't pardon someone convicted of murder in a state court, he can only pardon people convicted of federal crimes.
- cmxch 9mo ago
  [flagged]
  - actionfromafar 9mo ago
    Do you think these are good ideas?
- hahahahhaah 9mo ago
  https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c99knmrx71go https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c99knmrx71go "Minnesota officials say FBI blocked their access to ICE shooting probe"
  - nozzlegear 9mo ago
    Not at all unexpected given Trump's sycophants are heading the FBI. Luckily Minnesota is moving forward with their own independent review: https://www.startribune.com/hennepin-county-prosecutor-attorney-general-launch-independent-state-review-into-fatal-ice-shooting/601561110 https://www.startribune.com/hennepin-county-prosecutor-attor...