4 ms·

The end result of his vax push has been to reduce the set of government required vaccines down to the same set used by Europe already. Additional vaccination is

The end result of his vax push has been to reduce the set of government required vaccines down to the same set used by Europe already. Additional vaccination is still available should an individual elect. Are you of the opinion that the European recommendation is insufficient? Would you petition European healthcare industry that they are requiring too few vaccines? If so, I would expect Europeans to be chronically far more diseased than Americans, do we see that in the data?

amanaplanacanal 9mo ago
The argument I've seen is that because the US has worse medical care in general, it makes sense to get more vaccinations.
j0057 9mo ago
I haven't particularly kept up with RFKs brand of MAGA craziness, but all European countries have different childhood vaccination schedules, with some overlap, see here: https://vaccination-info.europa.eu/en/about-vaccines/when-vaccinate/vaccination-schedules-eueea https://vaccination-info.europa.eu/en/about-vaccines/when-va...
- vscode-rest 9mo ago
  The superset of all Euro vaccines is still much smaller than what the US had. Are we that much healthier?
  - davorak 9mo ago
    What is on the US schedule that is not on Euro schedule?
    - burkaman 9mo ago
      Here's the US vaccine schedule pre-RFK: https://archive.cdc.gov/#/details?q=schedule&start=0&rows=10&url=https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/schedules/hcp/imz/prior-years/2022/child-adolescent-compliant.html https://archive.cdc.gov/#/details?q=schedule&start=0&rows=10... Here's a site where you can view vaccine schedules across Europe: https://vaccine-schedule.ecdc.europa.eu/ https://vaccine-schedule.ecdc.europa.eu/ The only outlier is Hepatitis A, which is still recommended in some European countries. On the reverse side, the meningococcal vaccine is commonly scheduled in Europe but not in the US.
Izikiel43 9mo ago
They are based on denmark's guidelines, which as you know is a very cold country. One of the vaccines made strictly optional was for dengue, which is not really a thing in denmark since I think they don't have that many mosquitos due to weather. However, in the US, mosquitos and tropical weather are common for a large part of the population. Point being, a huge country with a huge variety of climates and diseases shouldn't follow the lead of a small country with a fairly homogenous weather and disease pattern.
- vscode-rest 9mo ago
  Are you familiar with any European country that does schedule a dengue vaccine? It is not listed here: https://vaccine-schedule.ecdc.europa.eu/ https://vaccine-schedule.ecdc.europa.eu/
  - Izikiel43 9mo ago
    Maybe because dengue is not endemic in Europe? And it is in the Americas?
hn_acc1 9mo ago
Once those additional vaccines are off the "routine" schedule, they'll be pulled by the suppliers, because it eliminates exemption from lawsuits. If you "choose" a non-routine vaccination, people can then sue pharma for ANY harm, and you can be sure there'll be a bunch of crackpot right-wingers trying to prove each one is "bad" and they'll disappear sooner or later. RFK's fans (Del Bigtree) have admitted that this is their plan. And if they're NOT routine, they'll probably not be covered by insurance, so you'll have to pay hundreds or thousands to get one. I would still do that, but not many others will. Electing to get all ZERO optional vaccines actually available to you because of "reasons" isn't much of a choice.
- jimbobimbo 9mo ago
  "Once those additional vaccines are off the "routine" schedule, they'll be pulled by the suppliers, because it eliminates exemption from lawsuits" Why is this bad? From one of the threads - "There IS scrutiny on vaccines, by the scientific and medical community - your "scrutiny" (as presumably neither a PhD in a relevant field or MD) is not valuable or relevant. There is decades of research that says that currently recommended vaccines are safe and effective." OK, then there won't be grounds for lawsuits or lawsuits will be easily dismissed. "you can be sure there'll be a bunch of crackpot right-wingers trying to prove each one is "bad" and they'll disappear sooner or later" - This logic can be applied to literally any product, be it a medicine, a vaccine, or any consumer good. Somehow pharma companies are able to sell any other drug without going into bankruptcy.
  - gowld 9mo ago
    Cerebral palsy, a naturally occuring disorder, generates $10M in "malpractice" payouts, part of why giving birth in USA is so expensive.

amanaplanacanal 9mo ago

The argument I've seen is that because the US has worse medical care in general, it makes sense to get more vaccinations.

j0057 9mo ago

I haven't particularly kept up with RFKs brand of MAGA craziness, but all European countries have different childhood vaccination schedules, with some overlap, see here: https://vaccination-info.europa.eu/en/about-vaccines/when-vaccinate/vaccination-schedules-eueea https://vaccination-info.europa.eu/en/about-vaccines/when-va...

vscode-rest 9mo ago
The superset of all Euro vaccines is still much smaller than what the US had. Are we that much healthier?
- davorak 9mo ago
  What is on the US schedule that is not on Euro schedule?
  - burkaman 9mo ago
    Here's the US vaccine schedule pre-RFK: https://archive.cdc.gov/#/details?q=schedule&start=0&rows=10&url=https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/schedules/hcp/imz/prior-years/2022/child-adolescent-compliant.html https://archive.cdc.gov/#/details?q=schedule&start=0&rows=10... Here's a site where you can view vaccine schedules across Europe: https://vaccine-schedule.ecdc.europa.eu/ https://vaccine-schedule.ecdc.europa.eu/ The only outlier is Hepatitis A, which is still recommended in some European countries. On the reverse side, the meningococcal vaccine is commonly scheduled in Europe but not in the US.

Izikiel43 9mo ago

They are based on denmark's guidelines, which as you know is a very cold country. One of the vaccines made strictly optional was for dengue, which is not really a thing in denmark since I think they don't have that many mosquitos due to weather. However, in the US, mosquitos and tropical weather are common for a large part of the population. Point being, a huge country with a huge variety of climates and diseases shouldn't follow the lead of a small country with a fairly homogenous weather and disease pattern.

vscode-rest 9mo ago
Are you familiar with any European country that does schedule a dengue vaccine? It is not listed here: https://vaccine-schedule.ecdc.europa.eu/ https://vaccine-schedule.ecdc.europa.eu/
- Izikiel43 9mo ago
  Maybe because dengue is not endemic in Europe? And it is in the Americas?

hn_acc1 9mo ago

Once those additional vaccines are off the "routine" schedule, they'll be pulled by the suppliers, because it eliminates exemption from lawsuits. If you "choose" a non-routine vaccination, people can then sue pharma for ANY harm, and you can be sure there'll be a bunch of crackpot right-wingers trying to prove each one is "bad" and they'll disappear sooner or later. RFK's fans (Del Bigtree) have admitted that this is their plan. And if they're NOT routine, they'll probably not be covered by insurance, so you'll have to pay hundreds or thousands to get one. I would still do that, but not many others will. Electing to get all ZERO optional vaccines actually available to you because of "reasons" isn't much of a choice.

jimbobimbo 9mo ago
"Once those additional vaccines are off the "routine" schedule, they'll be pulled by the suppliers, because it eliminates exemption from lawsuits" Why is this bad? From one of the threads - "There IS scrutiny on vaccines, by the scientific and medical community - your "scrutiny" (as presumably neither a PhD in a relevant field or MD) is not valuable or relevant. There is decades of research that says that currently recommended vaccines are safe and effective." OK, then there won't be grounds for lawsuits or lawsuits will be easily dismissed. "you can be sure there'll be a bunch of crackpot right-wingers trying to prove each one is "bad" and they'll disappear sooner or later" - This logic can be applied to literally any product, be it a medicine, a vaccine, or any consumer good. Somehow pharma companies are able to sell any other drug without going into bankruptcy.
- gowld 9mo ago
  Cerebral palsy, a naturally occuring disorder, generates $10M in "malpractice" payouts, part of why giving birth in USA is so expensive.