3 ms·

Being on the actual plane is the most uncomfortable part of the entire experience, for me at least. Others may disagree, but I'd rather cut an hour from the fl

by elicash 10mo ago

Being on the actual plane is the most uncomfortable part of the entire experience, for me at least. Others may disagree, but I'd rather cut an hour from the flight than the entire commute/parking/security/airport waiting. (Assuming conditions on the actual plane were the same.)

anon84873628 10mo ago
Funny, for me it's the opposite. It's uniquely relaxing to be locked in with nothing but a book or some movies (I purposely avoid connecting to the internet during a flight.) My biggest dilemma is whether to sit in the aisle or window. The former you can get up whenever you want but are bumped by passers by and neighbors exiting the row. Versus being the one doing the disturbing. And if you can afford business class - where supersonic would be priced - then I mean... The meals are restaurant quality and the full recline?! I hardly want to disembark! The biggest discomfort is the dry sinuses. But in getting to/from the plane you are cattle moving through a logistical labyrinth with countless possibilities for something to go wrong.
- ghaff 10mo ago
  I don't love being on a plane for a very long stretch, even in business class. And IMO food is very mid-tier restaurant. But I don't necessarily disagree with your comment. Even with transport and airport conveniences that a relatively modest amount of money can buy, there's plenty that can go wrong and you can avoid all the other people to only a certain degree.
- hbosch 10mo ago
  >And if you can afford business class [...] The meals are restaurant quality and the full recline?! I hardly want to disembark! Let's settle down. This kind of biz class experience is almost certainly unique to international travel. Flying "business class" from ATL to SFO might get you a plate of microwave slop and an extra 15deg of incline on almost all domestic jets. Once in a blue moon you'll get a modern plane with the diagonal seats. One less person in the row, though. Paying for business class domestically is almost always a sham by my experience.
  - zamadatix 10mo ago
    ATL to SFO would almost certainly top out at first class, not business class. This is true of most all domestic routes. First class on international also just gets you the 15 degrees and 1 or 2 fewer chairs per row, it's business that gets you the lie downs and such. The food will probably still be worse than a first class international flight though. Not as many people paying as much and not enough air time to really force all of them to want to eat airplane food in the first place.
    - sokoloff 10mo ago
      > First class on international also just gets you the 15 degrees and 1 or 2 fewer chairs per row, it's business that gets you the lie downs and such. This is not my experience at all. First class is better than business class on international (and domestic, of course, though relatively few domestic routes have true three cabin service [counting all the slightly different economy levels as one cabin]).
      - zamadatix 10mo ago
        For ATL<->SFO the directs are Delta, Frontier, and United: Frontier doesn't have a business class nor long haul international flights (they are an ultra-low cost carrier). Delta calls their highest tier "Delta One" their business class offering. It's mostly available in mid & long haul international flights, though there are a few select domestic routes with it IIRC. A tier below is First, which is available for both domestic and international flights. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delta_Air_Lines#Cabin:~:text=Delta%20One%20is%20the%20airline%27s%20premier%20business%20class%20product%2C%20available%20on%20long%2Dhaul%20international%20flights%2C%20as%20well%20as%20transcontinental%20service%20from%20New%20York%E2%80%93Kennedy%20to%20Los%20Angeles%20and%20San%20Francisco.%5B184%5D https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delta_Air_Lines#Cabin:~:text=D... United's highest is called "Polaris", representing their international business class. Confusingly, they have "United First and United Business" as the next class. I.e. it's the same class but on domestic flights they call it "United First" and on international flights the same seat would be sold as "United Business" despite having Polaris for that already. Regardless of that oddity, the First class can't be higher than itself named Business class even compared directly instead of with the actual business class Polaris - it's the same seat. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Airlines#Cabins:~:text=United%20Polaris%20is%20the%20airline%27s%20international%20business%20class%20product https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Airlines#Cabins:~:text=.... Other airlines label and order things differently of course. E.g. American has Flagship First above Flagship Business above First/Business (shared much like United on that 3rd class) and maybe that's where your experience is. To my knowledge though, no such airlines operate the ATL<->SFO route originally described though.
- joshstrange 10mo ago
  > And if you can afford business class - where supersonic would be priced - then I mean... The meals are restaurant quality and the full recline?! I hardly want to disembark! The biggest discomfort is the dry sinuses. Lay-flat chairs and business class are nice and a massive upgrade for long flights but better than being off the plane? Nope. > restaurant quality The food is mid-tier at best, I would not return to a restaurant that served food like what they serve in business class. It's only amazing when compared to the alternatives and the fact you get treated like half a human for a minute. > full recline Ehh, I find them claustrophobic and they only really "lay flat" if you aren't 6'+. They are approximately 1 billion times better than normal airplane chairs but you are still in an airplane.
- TulliusCicero 10mo ago
  100% agree with you. Actually being on the plane is fine, I don't have many complaints there. Yes, there are various compromises around space and comfort, but they're all understandable given the cost/efficiency concerns. Getting through the airport is just a huge pain in the ass though. At least some airports now let you keep your shoes on again, hopefully soon we'll have scanners that don't need you to remove electronics (I tend to bring too much of this and it's always a pain), or even let you keep liquids again (!).
  - anon84873628 9mo ago
    Look for the "Smiths" brand scanners and go in that line if possible. Those don't have to remove items from the bag.
ghaff 10mo ago
Unless you pay the sort of money (or more) that supersonic flight would realistically cost. Even without going private, business/first seating (along with expedited service through security, airport clubs, and arranged private car to your hotel) deal with a lot of the issues that many economy travelers have with air travel.
kakacik 10mo ago
Nah, its quite opposite for me. It becomes real chore with small kids on non-short flights, but the thing is - I travel normally only for vacations. Time spent in airports is literally vacation wasted on bureaucracy without even moving, since in ideal situation I would spend 1 minute giving them big luggage, if at all, and stepping in the plane just about to take off. Flying is actually moving me towards the goal, feels more acceptable. Overall when I started traveling I loved all of it, exciting, new. Now I hate this part as a whole, necessary evil of wasted life to get what I actually want where I actually want.
- elicash 10mo ago
  I expected that others would have opposing experiences and tried to reflect that in my comment. People are different sizes, flying different class, frequenting different airports, traveling with families or solo, for longer or shorter periods of time, more or less luggage, etc. So of course it won't be universal. My main point is that all time is not created equal, that it matters WHERE you shave the minutes/hours off, not just what percent of overall travel time is removed. And while we disagree on how to apply this, we seem to agree on that main point.
- anon84873628 10mo ago
  I try to find absurd humor in counting the different steps that I had to go through from leaving my house to getting on the plane. Or analyzing the legibility & usability of the systems. Or just being proud of myself for being able to be so patient and let it all go. Sometimes you can even strike up a good conversation with a stranger. But with kids, oof, yeah... :-)
red-iron-pine 10mo ago
being on the plane is the easy part. put bags up top -- and check the big ones so this is a simple process -- and then buckle-up and snooze. it's the everything-else part of air travel that is fucking awful. 40+ minutes of security theater even with NEXUS and other fast-passes, lost bags, massive PITA airports, delays, and the hoards of dumb fuckin rubes who have no idea how to travel and need to haul their comically huge carry ons that somehow got through sizing + emotional support chihuahua -- a far cry from even the worst subways I've been on.
- anon84873628 10mo ago
  I feel the need to praise the (relatively) new SFO terminal 1 somewhere. The design is a breath of fresh air. Always my smoothest airport experience by far. No checked bag, Clear + Pre Check, fill your water bottle after security, get a coffee at Ritual, buy a banh mi for the plane, use a pretty clean bathroom, sit in one of those swivel chairs, get on the plane.
- devilbunny 10mo ago
  If you live in the right areas - mostly the western US - try JSX. Runs about equal to maybe 20% more than commercial domestic first class. Regional jets, all 1+1 seating, fly out of (effectively) an FBO, show up 20 minutes before domestic and 40 before international flights. Light screening, no terminal, no carryon (all bags brought off immediately at end of flight for collection planeside). Free WiFi on board and 120V power outlet at every seat.
- charcircuit 10mo ago
  >40+ minutes of security theater This is such an exaggeration. Usually it's like 3-5 minutes.
HarHarVeryFunny 10mo ago
The whole experience nowadays is horrible. The airplane is a bus, the airport is a shopping mall. Passengers are just cattle.
- nine_k 10mo ago
  When you can fly e.g. London to Barcelona for something like $59 (if you time your ticket purchase right), it is a bus, for the price of a long-range bus ticket. (There is even a big aircraft company named "Air Bus", or something, did you hear about them?)
  - joshstrange 10mo ago
    I've flown business class, it's still a bus, a nicer bus where you are treated marginally better, but it's a bus. Maybe private planes would change things (I've never been on one) but I can't imagine airplanes as being anything but a means to an end that I wanted to spend the least amount of time on.
- satvikpendem 10mo ago
  Of course it's a bus, what do you expect? If you want it to be like the 1950s golden age, you can get that, but for a price.

by elicash 10mo ago

anon84873628 10mo ago

Funny, for me it's the opposite. It's uniquely relaxing to be locked in with nothing but a book or some movies (I purposely avoid connecting to the internet during a flight.) My biggest dilemma is whether to sit in the aisle or window. The former you can get up whenever you want but are bumped by passers by and neighbors exiting the row. Versus being the one doing the disturbing. And if you can afford business class - where supersonic would be priced - then I mean... The meals are restaurant quality and the full recline?! I hardly want to disembark! The biggest discomfort is the dry sinuses. But in getting to/from the plane you are cattle moving through a logistical labyrinth with countless possibilities for something to go wrong.

ghaff 10mo ago
I don't love being on a plane for a very long stretch, even in business class. And IMO food is very mid-tier restaurant. But I don't necessarily disagree with your comment. Even with transport and airport conveniences that a relatively modest amount of money can buy, there's plenty that can go wrong and you can avoid all the other people to only a certain degree.
hbosch 10mo ago
>And if you can afford business class [...] The meals are restaurant quality and the full recline?! I hardly want to disembark! Let's settle down. This kind of biz class experience is almost certainly unique to international travel. Flying "business class" from ATL to SFO might get you a plate of microwave slop and an extra 15deg of incline on almost all domestic jets. Once in a blue moon you'll get a modern plane with the diagonal seats. One less person in the row, though. Paying for business class domestically is almost always a sham by my experience.
- zamadatix 10mo ago
  ATL to SFO would almost certainly top out at first class, not business class. This is true of most all domestic routes. First class on international also just gets you the 15 degrees and 1 or 2 fewer chairs per row, it's business that gets you the lie downs and such. The food will probably still be worse than a first class international flight though. Not as many people paying as much and not enough air time to really force all of them to want to eat airplane food in the first place.
  - sokoloff 10mo ago
    > First class on international also just gets you the 15 degrees and 1 or 2 fewer chairs per row, it's business that gets you the lie downs and such. This is not my experience at all. First class is better than business class on international (and domestic, of course, though relatively few domestic routes have true three cabin service [counting all the slightly different economy levels as one cabin]).
    - zamadatix 10mo ago
      For ATL<->SFO the directs are Delta, Frontier, and United: Frontier doesn't have a business class nor long haul international flights (they are an ultra-low cost carrier). Delta calls their highest tier "Delta One" their business class offering. It's mostly available in mid & long haul international flights, though there are a few select domestic routes with it IIRC. A tier below is First, which is available for both domestic and international flights. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delta_Air_Lines#Cabin:~:text=Delta%20One%20is%20the%20airline%27s%20premier%20business%20class%20product%2C%20available%20on%20long%2Dhaul%20international%20flights%2C%20as%20well%20as%20transcontinental%20service%20from%20New%20York%E2%80%93Kennedy%20to%20Los%20Angeles%20and%20San%20Francisco.%5B184%5D https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delta_Air_Lines#Cabin:~:text=D... United's highest is called "Polaris", representing their international business class. Confusingly, they have "United First and United Business" as the next class. I.e. it's the same class but on domestic flights they call it "United First" and on international flights the same seat would be sold as "United Business" despite having Polaris for that already. Regardless of that oddity, the First class can't be higher than itself named Business class even compared directly instead of with the actual business class Polaris - it's the same seat. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Airlines#Cabins:~:text=United%20Polaris%20is%20the%20airline%27s%20international%20business%20class%20product https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Airlines#Cabins:~:text=.... Other airlines label and order things differently of course. E.g. American has Flagship First above Flagship Business above First/Business (shared much like United on that 3rd class) and maybe that's where your experience is. To my knowledge though, no such airlines operate the ATL<->SFO route originally described though.
joshstrange 10mo ago
> And if you can afford business class - where supersonic would be priced - then I mean... The meals are restaurant quality and the full recline?! I hardly want to disembark! The biggest discomfort is the dry sinuses. Lay-flat chairs and business class are nice and a massive upgrade for long flights but better than being off the plane? Nope. > restaurant quality The food is mid-tier at best, I would not return to a restaurant that served food like what they serve in business class. It's only amazing when compared to the alternatives and the fact you get treated like half a human for a minute. > full recline Ehh, I find them claustrophobic and they only really "lay flat" if you aren't 6'+. They are approximately 1 billion times better than normal airplane chairs but you are still in an airplane.
TulliusCicero 10mo ago
100% agree with you. Actually being on the plane is fine, I don't have many complaints there. Yes, there are various compromises around space and comfort, but they're all understandable given the cost/efficiency concerns. Getting through the airport is just a huge pain in the ass though. At least some airports now let you keep your shoes on again, hopefully soon we'll have scanners that don't need you to remove electronics (I tend to bring too much of this and it's always a pain), or even let you keep liquids again (!).
- anon84873628 9mo ago
  Look for the "Smiths" brand scanners and go in that line if possible. Those don't have to remove items from the bag.

ghaff 10mo ago

Unless you pay the sort of money (or more) that supersonic flight would realistically cost. Even without going private, business/first seating (along with expedited service through security, airport clubs, and arranged private car to your hotel) deal with a lot of the issues that many economy travelers have with air travel.

kakacik 10mo ago

Nah, its quite opposite for me. It becomes real chore with small kids on non-short flights, but the thing is - I travel normally only for vacations. Time spent in airports is literally vacation wasted on bureaucracy without even moving, since in ideal situation I would spend 1 minute giving them big luggage, if at all, and stepping in the plane just about to take off. Flying is actually moving me towards the goal, feels more acceptable. Overall when I started traveling I loved all of it, exciting, new. Now I hate this part as a whole, necessary evil of wasted life to get what I actually want where I actually want.

elicash 10mo ago
I expected that others would have opposing experiences and tried to reflect that in my comment. People are different sizes, flying different class, frequenting different airports, traveling with families or solo, for longer or shorter periods of time, more or less luggage, etc. So of course it won't be universal. My main point is that all time is not created equal, that it matters WHERE you shave the minutes/hours off, not just what percent of overall travel time is removed. And while we disagree on how to apply this, we seem to agree on that main point.
anon84873628 10mo ago
I try to find absurd humor in counting the different steps that I had to go through from leaving my house to getting on the plane. Or analyzing the legibility & usability of the systems. Or just being proud of myself for being able to be so patient and let it all go. Sometimes you can even strike up a good conversation with a stranger. But with kids, oof, yeah... :-)

red-iron-pine 10mo ago

being on the plane is the easy part. put bags up top -- and check the big ones so this is a simple process -- and then buckle-up and snooze. it's the everything-else part of air travel that is fucking awful. 40+ minutes of security theater even with NEXUS and other fast-passes, lost bags, massive PITA airports, delays, and the hoards of dumb fuckin rubes who have no idea how to travel and need to haul their comically huge carry ons that somehow got through sizing + emotional support chihuahua -- a far cry from even the worst subways I've been on.

anon84873628 10mo ago
I feel the need to praise the (relatively) new SFO terminal 1 somewhere. The design is a breath of fresh air. Always my smoothest airport experience by far. No checked bag, Clear + Pre Check, fill your water bottle after security, get a coffee at Ritual, buy a banh mi for the plane, use a pretty clean bathroom, sit in one of those swivel chairs, get on the plane.
devilbunny 10mo ago
If you live in the right areas - mostly the western US - try JSX. Runs about equal to maybe 20% more than commercial domestic first class. Regional jets, all 1+1 seating, fly out of (effectively) an FBO, show up 20 minutes before domestic and 40 before international flights. Light screening, no terminal, no carryon (all bags brought off immediately at end of flight for collection planeside). Free WiFi on board and 120V power outlet at every seat.
charcircuit 10mo ago
>40+ minutes of security theater This is such an exaggeration. Usually it's like 3-5 minutes.

HarHarVeryFunny 10mo ago

The whole experience nowadays is horrible. The airplane is a bus, the airport is a shopping mall. Passengers are just cattle.

nine_k 10mo ago
When you can fly e.g. London to Barcelona for something like $59 (if you time your ticket purchase right), it is a bus, for the price of a long-range bus ticket. (There is even a big aircraft company named "Air Bus", or something, did you hear about them?)
- joshstrange 10mo ago
  I've flown business class, it's still a bus, a nicer bus where you are treated marginally better, but it's a bus. Maybe private planes would change things (I've never been on one) but I can't imagine airplanes as being anything but a means to an end that I wanted to spend the least amount of time on.
satvikpendem 10mo ago
Of course it's a bus, what do you expect? If you want it to be like the 1950s golden age, you can get that, but for a price.