4 ms·
Isn’t this illegal and a wrong thing to do. Just because you don’t agree with ideology, you can’t just go ahead and destroy actual IP . I’d think if the sites a
by carlotavez 10mo ago
Isn’t this illegal and a wrong thing to do. Just because you don’t agree with ideology, you can’t just go ahead and destroy actual IP .
I’d think if the sites are based in the US and the owners decided to take action, they could force this activist to be extradited and face punishment.
- undeveloper 10mo agoIllegal? Probably. Wrong or immoral? lol no
- tomlockwood 10mo ago[flagged]
- applicatio 10mo ago[flagged]
- throw-12-16 10mo agoWhite supremacy leads directly into war. It's happened several times over the last 2 centuries and its looking like it will happen again soon. You should read about Neville Chamberlain and his experience trying to open a dialogue with these people.
- applicatio 10mo ago[flagged]
- saubeidl 10mo ago[flagged]
- applicatio 10mo ago[flagged]
- saubeidl 10mo ago[flagged]
- applicatio 10mo ago[flagged]
- saubeidl 10mo agoNo, this isn't the work for a single person. It needs a movement, like the French Resistance or the Yugoslav Partisans.
- applicatio 10mo agoI will assume you haven't started a murder club nor have you inquired as to joining any that may already exist.
- saubeidl 10mo agoIf I were to join a resistance movement, I would surely keep such information from online reactionaries.
- eudamoniac 10mo ago[flagged]
- saubeidl 10mo agoI disagree with your framing about not wanting a civil war. At this point it's between the fascists taking over unopposed and them maybe losing this civil war. I'd rather take the chance than give up without a fight. I agree with the framing of "rather you than me", fwiw.
- deleted 10mo ago[deleted]
- throw-12-16 10mo ago[flagged]
- applicatio 10mo ago[flagged]
- throw-12-16 10mo ago[flagged]
- cindyllm 10mo ago[dead]
- applicatio 10mo ago[flagged]
- dxdm 10mo ago[flagged]
- saubeidl 10mo ago[flagged]
- dxdm 10mo ago[flagged]
- saubeidl 10mo ago[flagged]
- dxdm 10mo agoI noticed my use of "indiscriminately" was problematic and I edited my previous post to remove it before I saw your reply. I'd hoped I could fix the ambivalence quickly, before someone misunderstood. I was too late; my apologies. What I meant to say: indiscriminately murdering people after an ideological lithmus test. Or for their beliefs. For their ethnicity. Stuff like that. You know, not entirely unlike what the Nazis did. > The ends matter. The means do not. We disagree here; but even if we take this to be correct, you are wrong about what the ends are. "No nazis around" is in itself only a means, and not an end. The end is what we want to accomplish by "purging the nazis", or what we do end up accomplishing instead. Their abhorrent ideology does not merely exist in an ideological space. It is abhorrent precisely because of the consequences it leads to: the rule of violence, the establishment of a system for wholesale "purging" of whole groups of people (and lots of other bad things, but we're discussing these ones). That is what we want to avoid. You may think that you can simply "kill all the Nazis and feed them to the pigs" to avoid this. Even if you think that's a reasonable course of action, have you thought about how this would work? In order to accomplish it, you will have to put into place a system that catches all potential Nazis, precisely determines their ideology - judge people not by their actual actions, but what is believed are their thoughts, some of which are now a capital crime. Which are the ones, by the way? Where is the line? Who is going to decide this correctly? Even if you can, or are willing to accept some false positives (your "no benefit of doubt"): you will then have to kill all these people and feed them to the pigs. Such an effort is going to require state power and some serious organisation, and likely more than one "pig farm", let's call it that. Does this remind you of aything in history? There's plenty to choose from, humanity seems quite adept at pulling off such things, whenever instability propels a group to power that hates another group very much. But I believe the prime example, that comes closest to what you envision, happened in Europe in the last century. For the admittedly noble goal of countering nazis and their destructive doings, you're willing to slaughter, and keep slaughtering, permit me this summary word for "kill and feed to the pigs", everyone who is deemed to be a Nazi. In such a situation, if I were you, I'd avoid things that might get me mistaken for one. You don't want to become a Robespierre! Take a good look at yourself and what you are endorsing, where you're invariably going to end up. The ends do matter.
- defrost 10mo ago> Isn’t this illegal and a wrong thing to do. (?) The pseudonymous hacker [...] deleted the servers of WhiteDate, WhiteChild, and WhiteDeal in real time at the end of a talk at the annual Chaos Communication Congress in Hamburg, Germany. As of this writing, WhiteDate, which Hoffmann described as a “Tinder for Nazis”; WhiteChild, a site that claimed to match white supremacists’ sperm and egg donors; and WhiteDeal, a sort-of Taskrabbit-esque labor marketplace for racists, are all offline. Root, Hoffmann, and Fuchs claim to have identified the real identity of the websites’ administrator as a woman from Germany. There's likely a hacking crime of some nature here, but it's reasonably certain a German website administrator could face charges for running a Nazi aligned and themed website in Germany. > I’d think if the sites are based in the US and the owners decided to take action, they could force this activist to be extradited and face punishment. US based content owners have had mixed success forcing hackers to be extradited and face punishment in the US. Many ransomware gangs are still operating, Anna's Archive is still up, ThePirateBay continues to defy Hollywood. Sure, some hackers are caught and dragged through courts. Many are not. Enough to make your statement questionable.
- like_any_other 10mo ago[flagged]
- altairprime 10mo agoI would not bet on a US jury being willing to convict for this, especially not one empaneled by a DC/NYC federal court. A mistrial would be far more likely. (Jury nullification has entered the chat.)
- cmxch 10mo agoThen try in East Texas.
- Doxin 10mo agoIt's probably illegal. It's not wrong though. I'm not generally a fan of vigilante justice, but with the rise of fascism lately it's better to act sooner than later.
- throw-12-16 10mo ago[flagged]
- halJordan 10mo agoNo one is saying dont fight nazis. We're saying dont do nazi-things and justify it by saying im fighting nazis. Because when you beat them, you're going to take your new nazi-powers and ideals and use them against non-nazi's. It's only ever worked that way and you convincing yourself youre the exception is the first step.
- throw-12-16 10mo agoSo do you think the assassination attempts on Hitler should never have been carried out? If they were successful millions could have been spared. The future is looking primed for war, what if millions more could be spared at the cost of one life?
- krapp 10mo agoWhat "new nazi-powers" do you believe were asserted here? Do you believe this is the first time that anyone has taken down a website through hacktivism, or that "the nazis" have never done anything of the sort? What "not nazi-things" specifically do you suggest would be effective for fighting nazis? You'll probably say "simply debate them on the merits" but that doesn't work. And it's odd how in this argument the slippery slope is only ever a danger when people fight nazis, and never when people allow nazis to gain power and proliferate.
- rsynnott 10mo ago> We're saying dont do nazi-things and justify it by saying im fighting nazis. I mean I think if Hitler had confined himself to a bit of light vandalism, people might have been somewhat less upset about him.
- Davidbrcz 10mo ago[flagged]
- therobots927 10mo ago[flagged]
- curtisblaine 10mo ago[flagged]
- seethedeaduu 10mo ago[flagged]
- raxxorraxor 10mo agoIt was basically a site that was scamming nazis. I think the admin was from Germany, but another source said that it was connected to an enterprise based in France, but I cannot find the info anymore. Perhaps it was wrong. The Ids of the members is of course juicy.
- jijijijij 10mo agoDon't make up stuff, watch the talk: https://media.ccc.de/v/39c3-the-heartbreak-machine-nazis-in-the-echo-chamber https://media.ccc.de/v/39c3-the-heartbreak-machine-nazis-in-... (English translation available.)
- ndsipa_pomu 10mo agoThis isn't just an ideology, but a movement that kills people. I can't see how you can value "actual IP" more than human lives.
- LexiMax 10mo agoI saw the article title and somehow I predicted the top most voted response on Hacker News without even clicking on the comments - someone having sympathy for the poor poor white supremacist.
- jijijijij 10mo agoIllegal? Maybe. Wrong? Lol, no. The site, and the extended media presence are full of hardcore racist statements not protected under the German constitution, not considered legal expressions of free speech here. If you have seen the talk, you'd know the site/owner has been investigated by the German inland intelligence agency (Verfassungsschutz), but due to incompetence they only got the wrong person fired... In fact, the "Q&A" intro to the deletion bit, references the executive's inaction. Some information disclosure is also evidently in the public interest. For example the AfD representatives found are additional evidence for anti-constitutional sentiments within the AfD. This is highly relevant for a possible party prohibition process (which has an extremely high legal threshold). After all, the website security was hilariously bad. (I suspect the members' IQ scores may have been largely self-diagnosed...) From what I've gathered the publicized data has been somewhat anonymized. The victims of this hack should be rather happy the original data got nuked. Also good luck extraditing the activist. It's pretty clear the pink power ranger on stage is a borrowed body, and/or, I presume, the voice heard is AI or borrowed recording, as well. OpSec seems alright. But you know, these days, the president of the United States may personally order the NSA and navy seals to snatch the Martha Root off the streets to uphold the holy rule of law and freedom of speech/expression...
- cmxch 10mo ago[flagged]
- jijijijij 10mo ago[flagged]
- asacrowflies 10mo agoSo it seems obvious you only care about certain laws some of the time.... So we can dismiss your outrage over the "law" as performative to get what you want. And also draw many conclusion on your character based on what you want... Interesting.
- cmxch 10mo ago
- rsynnott 10mo ago[flagged]
- tavavex 10mo agoHacker culture is all about unquestionably accepting every law and declining to fight one of the most objectively evil ideologies conceived because of a desire to kneel at the altar of intellectual property, don't you know?
- owebmaster 10mo agoThere's no hacker in hackernews
- cmxch 10mo agoYes. And do so with haste, and maximum identification of the person behind the mask. Justice follows the law, not the whims of hacktivism.