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I genuinely don't understand why there's no movement to just shove solar panels onto every apartment building subsidizing the initial cost in form of a loan tha

I genuinely don't understand why there's no movement to just shove solar panels onto every apartment building subsidizing the initial cost in form of a loan that gets repaid as paying for power bills - the cost wouldn't change or even be lower than current power bills in a lot of european countries. It really makes no sense to not use solar except in very few exceptions where it's genuinely never sunny and doesn't have that many sunny days, but hey estonia is making it work. obviously there is some added maintenance like cleaning the panels, but that also applies for general services that residents of buildings already share.

raybb 10mo ago
In Germany they allow people to install solar panels on their balconies. https://cleantechnica.com/2024/12/21/germany-embraces-balkonkraftwerke-balcony-solar-for-apartments/ https://cleantechnica.com/2024/12/21/germany-embraces-balkon... Though last I looked this probably isn't feasible in the US due to differences in our electrical systems or something like that?
- kachapopopow 10mo ago
  in some states they're now allowing to just plug in panels without any permits up to 1.5kw so actually, no. In US specifically it's just lobbying or hurricane safety since panels flying off and creating even more debris is obviously not great.
  - raybb 10mo ago
    Which states are allowing it? Also this hn comment seems to confirm it's not a tech problem just a policy one! https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43007271 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43007271
  - pfdietz 10mo ago
    Specifically, Utah. I don't know if it's allowed yet in another state. In my state a law to allow such is working through the legislature right now. https://www.nysenate.gov/legislation/bills/2025/S8512/amendment/original https://www.nysenate.gov/legislation/bills/2025/S8512/amendm...
  - toomuchtodo 10mo ago
    https://www.brightsaver.org/ https://www.brightsaver.org/ is the US advocacy group advocating for balcony solar in the US. More US States Are Promoting Balcony Solar - https://cleantechnica.com/2025/12/01/more-us-states-are-promoting-balcony-solar/ https://cleantechnica.com/2025/12/01/more-us-states-are-prom... - December 1st, 2025 ("Earlier this year, Utah became the first state in the US to pass legislation allowing people to purchase balcony solar equipment. In other states, there are laws on the books that make balcony solar illegal, but according to The Guardian that is about to change. Bills have been introduced in the legislatures in New York and Pennsylvania that would allow people to add balcony solar to their homes. Vermont, Maryland, and New Hampshire are expected to follow soon as well.") Pennsylvania [HB 1971]: https://www.palegis.us/legislation/bills/2025/hb1971 https://www.palegis.us/legislation/bills/2025/hb1971 | https://www.pahouse.com/Pielli/InTheNews/NewsRelease/?id=140820 https://www.pahouse.com/Pielli/InTheNews/NewsRelease/?id=140...
Yizahi 10mo ago
That's Communism and we can't have that. Hell, can't even agree that people would pay for the universal health insurance (via tax), and you now propose that government subsidize electricity? Funny joke :) . By the way, energy generation is only 1/4 to 1/3 of all emissions on average, so transitioning the fraction of that fraction to a lesser amount of emissions (since there a ton of emissions in manufacturing, transporting and installing solar panels) is nice and cool, but not very efficient to combat climate change.
- melling 10mo ago
  “There’s a more perfect way to fix the problem…” Yes, there always is. 40 years later… Global commercial aviation is about 3% of all emissions”. Reducing that 25-30% to 15-20% is significant.
- kachapopopow 10mo ago
  it's not about climate change, it's about providing a better service at lower cost and better longevity: no aging above ground or underground wires, no massive distribution centers, decentralized grid at time of war (ukraine is switching to solar), benefits are astonishing the further you dive into it. several apartment buildings can also be linked together to handle maintenance and share peak power capability as well.
darubedarob 10mo ago
[dead]
icegreentea2 10mo ago
It's cause you get better returns in centralized installations. For example, NREL estimates that centralized installations cost half as much as commercial rooftop, and a third of residential (https://www.nrel.gov/solar/market-research-analysis/solar-installed-system-cost https://www.nrel.gov/solar/market-research-analysis/solar-in...) on a per-watt basis. Now normally, in a commercial or residential installation, as an owner you don't need to pay for cost of property. But as a utility (or government, or whatever), if you need to offer loans to get these installed, then those loans act a lot like property acquisition costs. There are definitely factors that can tip things in favour of such an approach (for example, if your land acquisition fees are particularly high for whatever reason, or you really really want a distributed grid), but I suspect that it's this fundamental aspect that keeps utilities from trying to push residential solar.
- kachapopopow 10mo ago
  I think there is a lot of profit to be made for maintenance, initial installation and being the one to provide the loan. But you're right, utility companies already own the land and have a monopoly - introducing something that would make it pretty easy to undercut and decentralize the power grid isn't that appealing.
two_handfuls 10mo ago
That was very much a thing. Sign a contract, company puts solar on your roof, owns that electricity, and you pay a predetermined price for the next 20 years or so and then the panels are yours. Except some were a scam, and now the well is poisoned. https://www.solarreviews.com/blog/solar-lease-everything-you-need-to-know https://www.solarreviews.com/blog/solar-lease-everything-you...

raybb 10mo ago

In Germany they allow people to install solar panels on their balconies. https://cleantechnica.com/2024/12/21/germany-embraces-balkonkraftwerke-balcony-solar-for-apartments/ https://cleantechnica.com/2024/12/21/germany-embraces-balkon... Though last I looked this probably isn't feasible in the US due to differences in our electrical systems or something like that?

kachapopopow 10mo ago
in some states they're now allowing to just plug in panels without any permits up to 1.5kw so actually, no. In US specifically it's just lobbying or hurricane safety since panels flying off and creating even more debris is obviously not great.
- raybb 10mo ago
  Which states are allowing it? Also this hn comment seems to confirm it's not a tech problem just a policy one! https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43007271 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43007271
- pfdietz 10mo ago
  Specifically, Utah. I don't know if it's allowed yet in another state. In my state a law to allow such is working through the legislature right now. https://www.nysenate.gov/legislation/bills/2025/S8512/amendment/original https://www.nysenate.gov/legislation/bills/2025/S8512/amendm...
- toomuchtodo 10mo ago
  https://www.brightsaver.org/ https://www.brightsaver.org/ is the US advocacy group advocating for balcony solar in the US. More US States Are Promoting Balcony Solar - https://cleantechnica.com/2025/12/01/more-us-states-are-promoting-balcony-solar/ https://cleantechnica.com/2025/12/01/more-us-states-are-prom... - December 1st, 2025 ("Earlier this year, Utah became the first state in the US to pass legislation allowing people to purchase balcony solar equipment. In other states, there are laws on the books that make balcony solar illegal, but according to The Guardian that is about to change. Bills have been introduced in the legislatures in New York and Pennsylvania that would allow people to add balcony solar to their homes. Vermont, Maryland, and New Hampshire are expected to follow soon as well.") Pennsylvania [HB 1971]: https://www.palegis.us/legislation/bills/2025/hb1971 https://www.palegis.us/legislation/bills/2025/hb1971 | https://www.pahouse.com/Pielli/InTheNews/NewsRelease/?id=140820 https://www.pahouse.com/Pielli/InTheNews/NewsRelease/?id=140...

Yizahi 10mo ago

That's Communism and we can't have that. Hell, can't even agree that people would pay for the universal health insurance (via tax), and you now propose that government subsidize electricity? Funny joke :) . By the way, energy generation is only 1/4 to 1/3 of all emissions on average, so transitioning the fraction of that fraction to a lesser amount of emissions (since there a ton of emissions in manufacturing, transporting and installing solar panels) is nice and cool, but not very efficient to combat climate change.

melling 10mo ago
“There’s a more perfect way to fix the problem…” Yes, there always is. 40 years later… Global commercial aviation is about 3% of all emissions”. Reducing that 25-30% to 15-20% is significant.
kachapopopow 10mo ago
it's not about climate change, it's about providing a better service at lower cost and better longevity: no aging above ground or underground wires, no massive distribution centers, decentralized grid at time of war (ukraine is switching to solar), benefits are astonishing the further you dive into it. several apartment buildings can also be linked together to handle maintenance and share peak power capability as well.

darubedarob 10mo ago

[dead]

icegreentea2 10mo ago

It's cause you get better returns in centralized installations. For example, NREL estimates that centralized installations cost half as much as commercial rooftop, and a third of residential (https://www.nrel.gov/solar/market-research-analysis/solar-installed-system-cost https://www.nrel.gov/solar/market-research-analysis/solar-in...) on a per-watt basis. Now normally, in a commercial or residential installation, as an owner you don't need to pay for cost of property. But as a utility (or government, or whatever), if you need to offer loans to get these installed, then those loans act a lot like property acquisition costs. There are definitely factors that can tip things in favour of such an approach (for example, if your land acquisition fees are particularly high for whatever reason, or you really really want a distributed grid), but I suspect that it's this fundamental aspect that keeps utilities from trying to push residential solar.

kachapopopow 10mo ago
I think there is a lot of profit to be made for maintenance, initial installation and being the one to provide the loan. But you're right, utility companies already own the land and have a monopoly - introducing something that would make it pretty easy to undercut and decentralize the power grid isn't that appealing.

two_handfuls 10mo ago

That was very much a thing. Sign a contract, company puts solar on your roof, owns that electricity, and you pay a predetermined price for the next 20 years or so and then the panels are yours. Except some were a scam, and now the well is poisoned. https://www.solarreviews.com/blog/solar-lease-everything-you-need-to-know https://www.solarreviews.com/blog/solar-lease-everything-you...