3 ms·

> It took me about 30 minutes to knock up a demonstration Really? >Both are visually identical in appearance, both use CSS to control the positioning of the c

> It took me about 30 minutes to knock up a demonstration Really? >Both are visually identical in appearance, both use CSS to control the positioning of the columns, but one is in "correct" logical order in the document (left, center, right) and the other out of order (center, left, right). Really?? > (Only tested in Firefox3 on Linux.) Ah, there it is. :)

braindead_in 18y ago
We'll the author says intent was to prove it is possible. I believe him.
- Jem 18y ago
  Her.
  - braindead_in 18y ago
    oops. my bad.
    - Jem 18y ago
      Don't worry, you're not the only one that made that assumption. Apparently only men should be allowed near code ;)
      - braindead_in 18y ago
        :). It was just a careless mistake. And we really love it when someone can figure out CSS better than us ;).
      - ars 18y ago
        "He" can mean male, but in English it's also the gender neutral. BTW you have 4 w's in the url in your profile on HN.
        Jem 18y ago
        Thanks for the heads up.
- discojesus 18y ago
  > We'll the author says intent was to prove it is possible. Which is a straw man - nobody's arguing that it's impossible. The argument generally centers around valid, web-tested, academic-approved CSS layouts being practical for use in the real world. I worked with someone who did freelance web design on the side and who said "I program for Opera and only test in Opera." Does anyone really need to wonder why he didn't have any repeat business? I also worked in a slicing sweatshop, and using CSS to do layouts instead of tables tripled the amount of time it took to slice a PSD mockup. Department-wide adoption of the YUI CSS framework brought this down to maybe double, although YUI still has some of the basic layout issues that CSS itself does (eg the lead engineer on YUI CSS told me himself that the only way they know of to solve the equal-height column issue with YUI is using Javascript, and there is no equal-height column CSS hack that's anywhere near to understand or cross-browser compatible as table-tr-td-td-td). The greatest time sinkhole by FAR was CSS layout debugging. It was not infrequent to have someone's whole day go down the drain struggling with some god-awful cross-browser issue that would be relatively easy using tables for layout. So I've been there, to the point where I know that the only CSS books that aren't nearly completely worthless are _CSS Mastery_, _Bulletproof Web Design_, and maybe O'Reilly's Definitive Guide. Doing a layout in perfect, valid CSS separating presentation from content (as much as possible, because I've never seen them successfully completely separated in a non-trivial project) is sort of like writing a book and having a sticker on the cover that says "This book has been validated 100% grammatically correct." Swell, but it really doesn't have anything to do with the price of spinach. Just like how the fact that many people have a beef with using CSS for layouts doesn't negate the fact that for everything else it eliminates redundancies and is generally the cat's pajamas, the fact that tables look ugly doesn't negate the fact that in many cases they Just Work faster and are easier to understand than CSS for standard layouts like three equal-height columns.
  - Jem 18y ago
    > The argument generally centers around valid, web-tested, academic-approved CSS layouts being practical for use in the real world. Your argument, perhaps, but that's not what the post was about.
    - 18y ago

braindead_in 18y ago

We'll the author says intent was to prove it is possible. I believe him.

Jem 18y ago
Her.
- braindead_in 18y ago
  oops. my bad.
  - Jem 18y ago
    Don't worry, you're not the only one that made that assumption. Apparently only men should be allowed near code ;)
    - braindead_in 18y ago
      :). It was just a careless mistake. And we really love it when someone can figure out CSS better than us ;).
    - ars 18y ago
      "He" can mean male, but in English it's also the gender neutral. BTW you have 4 w's in the url in your profile on HN.
      - Jem 18y ago
        Thanks for the heads up.
discojesus 18y ago
> We'll the author says intent was to prove it is possible. Which is a straw man - nobody's arguing that it's impossible. The argument generally centers around valid, web-tested, academic-approved CSS layouts being practical for use in the real world. I worked with someone who did freelance web design on the side and who said "I program for Opera and only test in Opera." Does anyone really need to wonder why he didn't have any repeat business? I also worked in a slicing sweatshop, and using CSS to do layouts instead of tables tripled the amount of time it took to slice a PSD mockup. Department-wide adoption of the YUI CSS framework brought this down to maybe double, although YUI still has some of the basic layout issues that CSS itself does (eg the lead engineer on YUI CSS told me himself that the only way they know of to solve the equal-height column issue with YUI is using Javascript, and there is no equal-height column CSS hack that's anywhere near to understand or cross-browser compatible as table-tr-td-td-td). The greatest time sinkhole by FAR was CSS layout debugging. It was not infrequent to have someone's whole day go down the drain struggling with some god-awful cross-browser issue that would be relatively easy using tables for layout. So I've been there, to the point where I know that the only CSS books that aren't nearly completely worthless are _CSS Mastery_, _Bulletproof Web Design_, and maybe O'Reilly's Definitive Guide. Doing a layout in perfect, valid CSS separating presentation from content (as much as possible, because I've never seen them successfully completely separated in a non-trivial project) is sort of like writing a book and having a sticker on the cover that says "This book has been validated 100% grammatically correct." Swell, but it really doesn't have anything to do with the price of spinach. Just like how the fact that many people have a beef with using CSS for layouts doesn't negate the fact that for everything else it eliminates redundancies and is generally the cat's pajamas, the fact that tables look ugly doesn't negate the fact that in many cases they Just Work faster and are easier to understand than CSS for standard layouts like three equal-height columns.
- Jem 18y ago
  > The argument generally centers around valid, web-tested, academic-approved CSS layouts being practical for use in the real world. Your argument, perhaps, but that's not what the post was about.
  - 18y ago