4 ms·

Looks great, but a mere 30 day warranty for manufacturing defects is kind of insane. I'm glad they're planning to fully support notifications on iOS in the EU d

Looks great, but a mere 30 day warranty for manufacturing defects is kind of insane. I'm glad they're planning to fully support notifications on iOS in the EU due to the DMA, but that warranty wouldn't even be legal if they sell directly within the EU.

lm28469 9mo ago
> Looks great, but a mere 30 day warranty for manufacturing defects is kind of insane. It's illegal in advanced societies, but americans call these things "communism" (the rest of the world uses "regulations")
- apparent 9mo ago
  Apple is forced to offer longer warranties in some non-US countries. In these countries, the price of the product is simply higher, to account for this. So basically consumers are forced to pay for an extended warranty in those countries, whereas if they bought them in the US (as some do on vacation), they get them cheaper but without the extended warranty. I would agree that a product that supposedly has a 30 day battery life (PT2) should have a warranty that lasts longer than 30 days. This is especially true if the software optimizations haven't been completed at the time the watches ship. Otherwise it's just impossible to reliably assess whether the product is actually defective during the return window.
  - leoedin 9mo ago
    > In these countries, the price of the product is simply higher, to account for this Maybe on the individual level, but the aggregate effect is that manufacturers are incentivised to save money by increasing reliability. Which is a good thing for everyone.
    - apparent 9mo ago
      I mean, it's good for the people in America and other shorter-warranty countries, who get to free-ride on any enhanced reliability that this results in. But honestly I've had Macs that still work 15 years after I bought them, and iPhones that work for easily 6 or 7. That's not because AU or EU require a somewhat longer warranty, I don't think.
      - TheDong 9mo ago
        > good for America and other shorter-warranty countries, who get to free-ride on any enhanced reliability that this results in. The EU mandates that in the EU you can change your default navigation app from Apple Maps to Google Maps. The US isn't getting to free-ride on that, that only works if you move to an EU country. Why wouldn't apple do the same for US vs EU, if EU has a longer required warranty period, apple can bin processors so the US gets more likely to fail processors and the EU gets more stable chips. It would be the sort of vindictive malicious compliance apple has been doing with everything else, so I wouldn't put it past them.
      - rollcat 9mo ago
        > But honestly I've had Macs that still work 15 years after I bought them [...]. 2002 PowerBook user checking in. Not great for "modern" work, CPU gets really hot compiling "simple" stuff like git or libressl, but OSX 10.5 is a superior user experience to macOS 15. Still great for lightweight web browsing (disable JS!), some coding (Python 2.7.14!), classic games (StarCraft! from a *box*!).
        apparent 9mo ago
        Amazing. I have a 17 year old iMac that still works OK. I don't use it often, but I remember the first time I booted it with an SSD over FW800 and I was like damn, this is a brand new machine.
cromka 9mo ago
They'll likely be shipping to EU from outside, not selling them directly.
- RestartKernel 9mo ago
  Makes sense for a smaller company. Though proudly advertising a feature you may implement thanks to EU regulation, while avoiding compliance yourself, seems in somewhat bad taste. Not that I am unaware of the immense difference in scale and influence between Apple and Pebble, and the different nature of these regulations in this light.
  - makeitdouble 9mo ago
    That would be fine if it was a kickstarter or some "sold as is" prototype. But looking at the page and pitch, it's sold as a regular product backed by a regular company. We're not talking about free returns or costly perks, but manufacturing defects that got passed their QA process or resulted from design issues. Leaving the customer holding the bag for these is kinda crap, even (especially?) for a small company IMHO.
    - RestartKernel 9mo ago
      Exactly. I've bought custom keyboards off individuals under such limited expectations, but everything makes this watch otherwise look like a proper product release. Just to spare people reading this a few clicks (from their FAQ): > Yes, we warrant against manufacturing defects for 30 days after you receive your order. Ship us the defective watch, and after we receive it back, we will ship (no charge) you a replacement. Full warranty as of now: https://archive.is/HxXvL https://archive.is/HxXvL
    - jerlam 9mo ago
      Pebble also has a bad track record of making lasting products. The original Pebbles had a zebra strip connector to the display which had problems; and their last product, the Pebble 2, had buttons made of a soft silicon rubber which quickly fell apart. The fact that the new Pebble company sold a brand new product (the Pebble 2 Duo) with the same defective design is worrying.
bartvk 9mo ago
Just so I understand; this watch does not show notifications when paired with an iPhone?
- infotainment 9mo ago
  It shows them just fine -- the issue is that on iOS, only Apple Watches are permitted to perform notification "actions" (e.g., replying to a message, etc). Recently, EU pressure might mean that Apple will open that ability up to non-Apple watches as well.
- Rebelgecko 9mo ago
  I think Apple lets third party watches show notifications but they're not allowed to take any action in response (eg having a snooze button when your alarm goes off or whatever). Next version of iOS will allow interaction for a single smart watch at a time in the EU. I think it's still unclear if Apple will enable that feature outside of where it's legally required.
  - apparent 9mo ago
    Interestingly a Garmin can turn off an alarm on an iPhone. Not sure if this counts as an action in response to a notification, exactly.
    - hombre_fatal 9mo ago
      ANCS lets bluetooth devices trigger basic positive/negative actions on notifications. Stop alarm is presumably one of those basic actions. But it doesn’t support custom actions that the app developer might have registered.
      - rollcat 9mo ago
        It's been always kinda weird to me that BT spans four layers, from antennas to volume controls. You'd think all the vertical integration should make it reliable and interoperable, yet in practice it's the exact opposite.
spike021 9mo ago
oof, 30 days is not good. I had a couple early pebbles from a decade ago and both had various issues within 1-2 years of use. the first was the original pebble and the screen basically had broken lines of pixels. can't recall the second, newer one's issue.
keraf 9mo ago
Eric's answer is just don't buy it if you're not happy with the warranty [0]. I'm still willing to take the risk because Pebble smartwatches are the only ones I like and wear. I managed to give my OG Steel another life by replacing the battery. Unfortunately that seems to be harder with the Round 2 as there won't be any screws. I'm still a bit split on whether to change my Time 2 pre-order for a Round 2. [0] https://bsky.app/profile/ericmigi.com/post/3maubss6mqc25 https://bsky.app/profile/ericmigi.com/post/3maubss6mqc25
- DaSHacka 9mo ago
  > Eric's answer is just don't buy it if you're not happy with the warranty [0]. lol, wouldn't that go for any product?
erohead 9mo ago
Here's my answer (as the founder of Pebble - both eras!) on this. We're a small company this time (standing on the shoulders of giants by using open source PebbleOS - thank you google!). We are excited to make new devices, but wary about over-promising. We'd rather under-promise and over-deliver. So far, we have only received a few requests for warranty support for our first new watch (Pebble 2 Duo) and we have provided support for everyone who has asked.
- RestartKernel 9mo ago
  Thanks for the reply. Are you therefore not planning to sell within the EU for now? Just for my understanding: so full notification support would essentially only apply to anyone in the EU willing to import from the US (or directly from the country you're manufacturing these devices in).

lm28469 9mo ago

> Looks great, but a mere 30 day warranty for manufacturing defects is kind of insane. It's illegal in advanced societies, but americans call these things "communism" (the rest of the world uses "regulations")

apparent 9mo ago
Apple is forced to offer longer warranties in some non-US countries. In these countries, the price of the product is simply higher, to account for this. So basically consumers are forced to pay for an extended warranty in those countries, whereas if they bought them in the US (as some do on vacation), they get them cheaper but without the extended warranty. I would agree that a product that supposedly has a 30 day battery life (PT2) should have a warranty that lasts longer than 30 days. This is especially true if the software optimizations haven't been completed at the time the watches ship. Otherwise it's just impossible to reliably assess whether the product is actually defective during the return window.
- leoedin 9mo ago
  > In these countries, the price of the product is simply higher, to account for this Maybe on the individual level, but the aggregate effect is that manufacturers are incentivised to save money by increasing reliability. Which is a good thing for everyone.
  - apparent 9mo ago
    I mean, it's good for the people in America and other shorter-warranty countries, who get to free-ride on any enhanced reliability that this results in. But honestly I've had Macs that still work 15 years after I bought them, and iPhones that work for easily 6 or 7. That's not because AU or EU require a somewhat longer warranty, I don't think.
    - TheDong 9mo ago
      > good for America and other shorter-warranty countries, who get to free-ride on any enhanced reliability that this results in. The EU mandates that in the EU you can change your default navigation app from Apple Maps to Google Maps. The US isn't getting to free-ride on that, that only works if you move to an EU country. Why wouldn't apple do the same for US vs EU, if EU has a longer required warranty period, apple can bin processors so the US gets more likely to fail processors and the EU gets more stable chips. It would be the sort of vindictive malicious compliance apple has been doing with everything else, so I wouldn't put it past them.
    - rollcat 9mo ago
      > But honestly I've had Macs that still work 15 years after I bought them [...]. 2002 PowerBook user checking in. Not great for "modern" work, CPU gets really hot compiling "simple" stuff like git or libressl, but OSX 10.5 is a superior user experience to macOS 15. Still great for lightweight web browsing (disable JS!), some coding (Python 2.7.14!), classic games (StarCraft! from a *box*!).
      - apparent 9mo ago
        Amazing. I have a 17 year old iMac that still works OK. I don't use it often, but I remember the first time I booted it with an SSD over FW800 and I was like damn, this is a brand new machine.

cromka 9mo ago

They'll likely be shipping to EU from outside, not selling them directly.

RestartKernel 9mo ago
Makes sense for a smaller company. Though proudly advertising a feature you may implement thanks to EU regulation, while avoiding compliance yourself, seems in somewhat bad taste. Not that I am unaware of the immense difference in scale and influence between Apple and Pebble, and the different nature of these regulations in this light.
- makeitdouble 9mo ago
  That would be fine if it was a kickstarter or some "sold as is" prototype. But looking at the page and pitch, it's sold as a regular product backed by a regular company. We're not talking about free returns or costly perks, but manufacturing defects that got passed their QA process or resulted from design issues. Leaving the customer holding the bag for these is kinda crap, even (especially?) for a small company IMHO.
  - RestartKernel 9mo ago
    Exactly. I've bought custom keyboards off individuals under such limited expectations, but everything makes this watch otherwise look like a proper product release. Just to spare people reading this a few clicks (from their FAQ): > Yes, we warrant against manufacturing defects for 30 days after you receive your order. Ship us the defective watch, and after we receive it back, we will ship (no charge) you a replacement. Full warranty as of now: https://archive.is/HxXvL https://archive.is/HxXvL
  - jerlam 9mo ago
    Pebble also has a bad track record of making lasting products. The original Pebbles had a zebra strip connector to the display which had problems; and their last product, the Pebble 2, had buttons made of a soft silicon rubber which quickly fell apart. The fact that the new Pebble company sold a brand new product (the Pebble 2 Duo) with the same defective design is worrying.

bartvk 9mo ago

Just so I understand; this watch does not show notifications when paired with an iPhone?

infotainment 9mo ago
It shows them just fine -- the issue is that on iOS, only Apple Watches are permitted to perform notification "actions" (e.g., replying to a message, etc). Recently, EU pressure might mean that Apple will open that ability up to non-Apple watches as well.
Rebelgecko 9mo ago
I think Apple lets third party watches show notifications but they're not allowed to take any action in response (eg having a snooze button when your alarm goes off or whatever). Next version of iOS will allow interaction for a single smart watch at a time in the EU. I think it's still unclear if Apple will enable that feature outside of where it's legally required.
- apparent 9mo ago
  Interestingly a Garmin can turn off an alarm on an iPhone. Not sure if this counts as an action in response to a notification, exactly.
  - hombre_fatal 9mo ago
    ANCS lets bluetooth devices trigger basic positive/negative actions on notifications. Stop alarm is presumably one of those basic actions. But it doesn’t support custom actions that the app developer might have registered.
    - rollcat 9mo ago
      It's been always kinda weird to me that BT spans four layers, from antennas to volume controls. You'd think all the vertical integration should make it reliable and interoperable, yet in practice it's the exact opposite.

spike021 9mo ago

oof, 30 days is not good. I had a couple early pebbles from a decade ago and both had various issues within 1-2 years of use. the first was the original pebble and the screen basically had broken lines of pixels. can't recall the second, newer one's issue.

keraf 9mo ago

Eric's answer is just don't buy it if you're not happy with the warranty [0]. I'm still willing to take the risk because Pebble smartwatches are the only ones I like and wear. I managed to give my OG Steel another life by replacing the battery. Unfortunately that seems to be harder with the Round 2 as there won't be any screws. I'm still a bit split on whether to change my Time 2 pre-order for a Round 2. [0] https://bsky.app/profile/ericmigi.com/post/3maubss6mqc25 https://bsky.app/profile/ericmigi.com/post/3maubss6mqc25

DaSHacka 9mo ago
> Eric's answer is just don't buy it if you're not happy with the warranty [0]. lol, wouldn't that go for any product?

erohead 9mo ago

Here's my answer (as the founder of Pebble - both eras!) on this. We're a small company this time (standing on the shoulders of giants by using open source PebbleOS - thank you google!). We are excited to make new devices, but wary about over-promising. We'd rather under-promise and over-deliver. So far, we have only received a few requests for warranty support for our first new watch (Pebble 2 Duo) and we have provided support for everyone who has asked.

RestartKernel 9mo ago
Thanks for the reply. Are you therefore not planning to sell within the EU for now? Just for my understanding: so full notification support would essentially only apply to anyone in the EU willing to import from the US (or directly from the country you're manufacturing these devices in).