2 ms·

My country is not a fan of Trump, is it morally right to send a bunch of covert soldiers to capture him and throw him out of the country? We'd be saving the US

by stavros 10mo ago

My country is not a fan of Trump, is it morally right to send a bunch of covert soldiers to capture him and throw him out of the country? We'd be saving the US from a dictatorship.

radu_floricica 10mo ago
[flagged]
- stavros 10mo ago
  I certainly didn't expect a "well if you can depose a country's president, feel free", especially combined with a "once it's a dictatorship" cop out, as if there's the Worldwide Department of Dictatorship Judgement to tell us if a country is a dictatorship or not.
  - radu_floricica 10mo ago
    Which is why you don't do it nilly willy. There are plenty of hard decision in the real world, with real consequences when you guess wrong. But as far as my personal opinion goes, I'd prefer a bit more intervention in the world. We actually created United Nations with this purpose, but it got hobbled by Russia and China's security vetos, and by the arab block making it a "resolution against Israel" machine. But we never decided as a planet to just leave Sudan-like atrocities to happen without taking action because "sovereignty". That's not a thing that happened, and I'm actually a bit puzzled everybody acts like we did.
    - stavros 10mo ago
      Yeah, I guess this was just pretty high on my "willy nilly" scale.
    - shaftoe 10mo ago
      I completely agree. It's worth remembering the UN fought in the Korean war and wasn't was always a place for authoritarian regimes to pass useless resolutions and make noise. The fact we, as humanity, have allowed so many genocides and slave nations to exist, and to treat them with a measure of equality, is a failing. And, to be clear, I'm not talking about people I disagree with politically. I'm talking about places and peoples like North Korea and Cambodia and Sudan. There's a ton of shades of gray, but some situations really require a special kind of blindness to pretend are gray.
      - int_19h 10mo ago
        It's also worth remembering how the UN (which was really mostly US in practice) fought in the Korean war: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_War#War_crimes https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_War#War_crimes There are very good reasons to avoid that kind of thing. Modern warfare is extremely devastating, so the bar for ethical use of force is extremely high.

by stavros 10mo ago

My country is not a fan of Trump, is it morally right to send a bunch of covert soldiers to capture him and throw him out of the country? We'd be saving the US from a dictatorship.

radu_floricica 10mo ago

[flagged]

stavros 10mo ago
I certainly didn't expect a "well if you can depose a country's president, feel free", especially combined with a "once it's a dictatorship" cop out, as if there's the Worldwide Department of Dictatorship Judgement to tell us if a country is a dictatorship or not.
- radu_floricica 10mo ago
  Which is why you don't do it nilly willy. There are plenty of hard decision in the real world, with real consequences when you guess wrong. But as far as my personal opinion goes, I'd prefer a bit more intervention in the world. We actually created United Nations with this purpose, but it got hobbled by Russia and China's security vetos, and by the arab block making it a "resolution against Israel" machine. But we never decided as a planet to just leave Sudan-like atrocities to happen without taking action because "sovereignty". That's not a thing that happened, and I'm actually a bit puzzled everybody acts like we did.
  - stavros 10mo ago
    Yeah, I guess this was just pretty high on my "willy nilly" scale.
  - shaftoe 10mo ago
    I completely agree. It's worth remembering the UN fought in the Korean war and wasn't was always a place for authoritarian regimes to pass useless resolutions and make noise. The fact we, as humanity, have allowed so many genocides and slave nations to exist, and to treat them with a measure of equality, is a failing. And, to be clear, I'm not talking about people I disagree with politically. I'm talking about places and peoples like North Korea and Cambodia and Sudan. There's a ton of shades of gray, but some situations really require a special kind of blindness to pretend are gray.
    - int_19h 10mo ago
      It's also worth remembering how the UN (which was really mostly US in practice) fought in the Korean war: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_War#War_crimes https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_War#War_crimes There are very good reasons to avoid that kind of thing. Modern warfare is extremely devastating, so the bar for ethical use of force is extremely high.