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> I think the first successful autopilot landing with passengers onboard happened last week. What definition are you using for "autopilot landing" here? Autopi

by rkomorn 10mo ago

> I think the first successful autopilot landing with passengers onboard happened last week. What definition are you using for "autopilot landing" here? Autopilots have been able to land planes for quite some time. Conversely, autopilots still can't handle takeoff (though the more modern airliners have significantly more takeoff automation than before).

nrhrjrjrjtntbt 10mo ago
Is autopilot takeoff a hard problem, or is there just little incentive to do it? I.e. if takeoff is dangerous you dont do it. Making takeoff generslly easier. The option to not land doesnt exist (insert old joke about a good landing)! So landing may have harder problems like wind sheer, thunder storms, tailwind, visibility, and more incentive to take load off pilots with automation.
- rkomorn 10mo ago
  I agree about incentive (with a small asterisk that if you do decide to take off when you shouldn't, now you have two problems), but taking off isn't particularly easier. Eg you have to stay on the runway, you have decisions to make about whether to reject takeoff (the asterisk I mentioned earlier), etc. For a computer, I'd say it's 6 of one, half a dozen of the other. For runway equipment (ie ILS), it probably changes enough that you couldn't "just use ILS" for takeoff. I did infra work for a team that was contributing to Airbus' ATTOL (automated taxi, takeoff, and landing) project a few years ago. They (the ATTOL folks, not the side I was on) did do an automated takeoff demo and it definitely wasn't simple.
andyjohnson0 10mo ago
Possibly a reference to the recent event described here: https://fallows.substack.com/p/a-positive-sign-for-flying-in-the https://fallows.substack.com/p/a-positive-sign-for-flying-in... tl/dr: The aircraft detected pilot incapacitation and landed on its own initiative.
- rkomorn 10mo ago
  That's what I figured yeah, though that's GA, not cargo planes, and emergency rather than normal operations. Lots of differences.

by rkomorn 10mo ago

nrhrjrjrjtntbt 10mo ago

Is autopilot takeoff a hard problem, or is there just little incentive to do it? I.e. if takeoff is dangerous you dont do it. Making takeoff generslly easier. The option to not land doesnt exist (insert old joke about a good landing)! So landing may have harder problems like wind sheer, thunder storms, tailwind, visibility, and more incentive to take load off pilots with automation.

rkomorn 10mo ago
I agree about incentive (with a small asterisk that if you do decide to take off when you shouldn't, now you have two problems), but taking off isn't particularly easier. Eg you have to stay on the runway, you have decisions to make about whether to reject takeoff (the asterisk I mentioned earlier), etc. For a computer, I'd say it's 6 of one, half a dozen of the other. For runway equipment (ie ILS), it probably changes enough that you couldn't "just use ILS" for takeoff. I did infra work for a team that was contributing to Airbus' ATTOL (automated taxi, takeoff, and landing) project a few years ago. They (the ATTOL folks, not the side I was on) did do an automated takeoff demo and it definitely wasn't simple.

andyjohnson0 10mo ago

Possibly a reference to the recent event described here: https://fallows.substack.com/p/a-positive-sign-for-flying-in-the https://fallows.substack.com/p/a-positive-sign-for-flying-in... tl/dr: The aircraft detected pilot incapacitation and landed on its own initiative.

rkomorn 10mo ago
That's what I figured yeah, though that's GA, not cargo planes, and emergency rather than normal operations. Lots of differences.