3 ms·

This is an interesting take, considering several EVs from traditional manufacturers have been canned entirely.

by zdragnar 10mo ago

Tiktaalik 10mo ago
The EV market is booming outside of NA. EV growth share in Europe is remarkable and Tesla is flatlining there while everyone else advances.
- iknowstuff 10mo ago
  Lack of FSD in Europe. If they manage to get it approved in 2026 expect that to reverse.
  - apexalpha 10mo ago
    Probably also the no lack of Nazi salutes on TV and his political ‘escapades’.
    - iknowstuff 10mo ago
      He appeared at an AfD thing
      - apexalpha 10mo ago
        I am well aware that clip mustve been played thousands of times. He really had no clue how politics work here. The people voting Afd et al. are NOT people buying EVs. The venn diagram of those groups is two circles.
        delusional 10mo ago
        > He really had no clue how politics work here. Its not like this differs from the US. Neither white supremacists (the "alt right") nor mainstream republicans were buying his cars. You should be open to the possibility that he isn't clueless, he might actually just be a racist authoritarian.
  - array_key_first 10mo ago
    I really, really doubt FSD is the limiter of European sales. It's pricing and competition. The US car market is laughably uncompetitive, with most manufacturers opting to make luxury landboats. It's easy to compete when all your competitors refuse to introduce an EV under, like, 50 grand.
    - riffraff 10mo ago
      I think musk's descent into politics also impacted the Tesla sales in Europe.
      - literalAardvark 10mo ago
        Absolutely. I know a couple of their early adopters in the EU and they were ashamed to drive their cars once that mess started. They've all since sold them (at massive losses).
  - qaq 10mo ago
    Sure Musk trying his hardest to blow up EU has 0 effect on sales there
- bhokbah 10mo ago
  In the EU, jan-nov 2025 compared to jan-nov 2024: BEV market is +27.6% while Tesla is -38.8%.
  - wtcactus 10mo ago
    That's only when you consider hybrids. If you look at pure EVs (like Tesla), the picture is different.
    - bhokbah 10mo ago
      No, it's for pure EVs https://www.acea.auto/files/Press_release_car_registrations_November_2025.pdf https://www.acea.auto/files/Press_release_car_registrations_...
      - deleted 10mo ago
        [deleted]
- deleted 10mo ago
  [deleted]
verdverm 10mo ago
US auto is not the trend setter here. BYD is crushing it by comparison
cyberax 10mo ago
EVs are in the Cambrian Explosion state in China right now. There are dozens of companies fiercely competing on price and features. The two most popular EVs in China are the Wuling Mini and the Geely Xingyuan. The first one costs $4500 for the base model, and the second one is $9800. And you can get a very decent EV for $15k with plenty of options. In 2-3 years, these $5k and $10k cars will only get better, and they'll just slaughter all the competition in markets outside the US and Europe. Especially once used cars start appearing at a fraction of the cost. Traditional auto manufacturers are dead. Full stop. They just haven't realized it yet. Tesla had a chance to compete in this market with Model 2 but Musk decided to blow their lead on a completely stillborn and gimmick-filled robotaxi.
- andsoitis 10mo ago
  > Traditional auto manufacturers are dead. Full stop. They just haven't realized it yet. Tesla had a chance to compete in this market with Model 2 but Musk decided to blow their lead on a completely stillborn and gimmick-filled robotaxi. Not sure whether you know, but Geely entered the automotive business in 1997 (founded in 1986). The company has subsidiaries / joint ventures with automakers like Volvo, Polestar, Proton, Smart, Lotus, Renault, etc. Lin Shufu, Geely’s founder and chairman bought just shy of 10% of Mercedes Benz in 2018, making him the second biggest individual shareholder in the German carmaker. The #1 spot is occupied by The Beijing Automotive Industry Holding Co. (BAIC), via its state-owned parent. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geely https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geely
  - cyberax 10mo ago
    Thanks! Correction: American and probably some European automakers are doomed. Even Toyota is slowly waking up, with a reasonable bZ3X SUV for $15k (China only).

This is an interesting take, considering several EVs from traditional manufacturers have been canned entirely.

The EV market is booming outside of NA. EV growth share in Europe is remarkable and Tesla is flatlining there while everyone else advances.

iknowstuff 10mo ago
Lack of FSD in Europe. If they manage to get it approved in 2026 expect that to reverse.
- apexalpha 10mo ago
  Probably also the no lack of Nazi salutes on TV and his political ‘escapades’.
  - iknowstuff 10mo ago
    He appeared at an AfD thing
    - apexalpha 10mo ago
      I am well aware that clip mustve been played thousands of times. He really had no clue how politics work here. The people voting Afd et al. are NOT people buying EVs. The venn diagram of those groups is two circles.
      - delusional 10mo ago
        > He really had no clue how politics work here. Its not like this differs from the US. Neither white supremacists (the "alt right") nor mainstream republicans were buying his cars. You should be open to the possibility that he isn't clueless, he might actually just be a racist authoritarian.
- array_key_first 10mo ago
  I really, really doubt FSD is the limiter of European sales. It's pricing and competition. The US car market is laughably uncompetitive, with most manufacturers opting to make luxury landboats. It's easy to compete when all your competitors refuse to introduce an EV under, like, 50 grand.
  - riffraff 10mo ago
    I think musk's descent into politics also impacted the Tesla sales in Europe.
    - literalAardvark 10mo ago
      Absolutely. I know a couple of their early adopters in the EU and they were ashamed to drive their cars once that mess started. They've all since sold them (at massive losses).
- qaq 10mo ago
  Sure Musk trying his hardest to blow up EU has 0 effect on sales there
bhokbah 10mo ago
In the EU, jan-nov 2025 compared to jan-nov 2024: BEV market is +27.6% while Tesla is -38.8%.
- wtcactus 10mo ago
  That's only when you consider hybrids. If you look at pure EVs (like Tesla), the picture is different.
  - bhokbah 10mo ago
    No, it's for pure EVs https://www.acea.auto/files/Press_release_car_registrations_November_2025.pdf https://www.acea.auto/files/Press_release_car_registrations_...
    - deleted 10mo ago
      [deleted]
deleted 10mo ago
[deleted]

verdverm 10mo ago

US auto is not the trend setter here. BYD is crushing it by comparison

cyberax 10mo ago

EVs are in the Cambrian Explosion state in China right now. There are dozens of companies fiercely competing on price and features. The two most popular EVs in China are the Wuling Mini and the Geely Xingyuan. The first one costs $4500 for the base model, and the second one is $9800. And you can get a very decent EV for $15k with plenty of options. In 2-3 years, these $5k and $10k cars will only get better, and they'll just slaughter all the competition in markets outside the US and Europe. Especially once used cars start appearing at a fraction of the cost. Traditional auto manufacturers are dead. Full stop. They just haven't realized it yet. Tesla had a chance to compete in this market with Model 2 but Musk decided to blow their lead on a completely stillborn and gimmick-filled robotaxi.

andsoitis 10mo ago
> Traditional auto manufacturers are dead. Full stop. They just haven't realized it yet. Tesla had a chance to compete in this market with Model 2 but Musk decided to blow their lead on a completely stillborn and gimmick-filled robotaxi. Not sure whether you know, but Geely entered the automotive business in 1997 (founded in 1986). The company has subsidiaries / joint ventures with automakers like Volvo, Polestar, Proton, Smart, Lotus, Renault, etc. Lin Shufu, Geely’s founder and chairman bought just shy of 10% of Mercedes Benz in 2018, making him the second biggest individual shareholder in the German carmaker. The #1 spot is occupied by The Beijing Automotive Industry Holding Co. (BAIC), via its state-owned parent. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geely https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geely
- cyberax 10mo ago
  Thanks! Correction: American and probably some European automakers are doomed. Even Toyota is slowly waking up, with a reasonable bZ3X SUV for $15k (China only).